Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

12 Dec 2016

Audibles at the Line: Week 14

compiled by Andrew Potter

Each Sunday, the FO staff sends around emails about the games that each of us are watching. We share information about the games that the rest of the group might not be watching, ask questions, and keep everyone else informed about which games they might want to tune into (if they can).

On Monday, we compile a digest of those emails and produce this feature. By its nature, it can be disjointed and dissimilar to the other articles on the site.

While these emails are generally written with Audibles in mind, they do not represent a standard review of all the games each week. That means we aren't going to cover every game, or every important play. We watch the games that we, as fans, are interested in watching, so your favorite team's game might not be covered to your fullest desires or even at all. (If you are a Steelers or Patriots fan, you are probably in luck; if you are a Bills fan, not so much.) We have no intention of adding new authors solely to cover every game on a given Sunday, nor will we watch a different game from the ones that we're personally interested in watching just to ensure that Audibles covers every game.

Cincinnati Bengals 23 at Cleveland Browns 10

Cian Fahey: Robert Griffin's first drive in his return won't have instilled much confidence. A 6-yard run on an option on first down before a throwaway on second and a dropped interception on third down.

Hue Jackson clearly doesn't care at this point. RGIII threw an interception into triple coverage after Jackson called a flea-flicker on first down from his own end zone. That led to Tyler Eifert's second touchdown of the game.

Jamie Collins has played well today. That's pretty much it for positive notes on the Browns.

Rob Weintraub: If Jeremy Hill could play 16 games vs Cleveland he'd be an All-Pro. Then again, who wouldn't?

Cincy rolled out to a big lead behind Hill and Eifert (two red zone touchdowns), and Vontaze Burfict was tremendous again. Once up 20-0, on a frigid day, Cincy basically took the second half off.

Two easy wins over the league's dregs doesn't change much, but the 0-3-1 November, with four games decided by a grand total of 10 points, changed the season from "expected playoff contender" to "ruining draft position with late rush."

Oh, and Mike Nugent missed an extra point for the fourth straight game. And a field goal from similar distance.

Minnesota Vikings 25 at Jacksonville Jaguars 16

Aaron Schatz: Disappointed to see the Vikings do the "let's try to draw them offsides" game instead of going for it on fourth-and-1 from the Jacksonville 9 in the first quarter. It's a bit of a surprise, given the quality of that offensive line, but the Vikings have an average offensive DVOA on third/fourth-and-short.

Vince Verhei: Sam Bradford has had more time in the pocket today than he has probably all season, which says a lot about Jacksonville's pass rush, obviously. And sometimes that extra time just seems to confuse him. He's not sure what to do with all this protection, and he looks hesitant and indecisive. He does have 40-yard completions to both Adam Theilen and Kyle Rudolph, but otherwise all that time has just resulted in wonky scrambles and dumpoffs.

Aaron Schatz: Curious if you're noticing anything from Dante Fowler. We're talking about a third overall pick late in his first year and I don't remember seeing anything anywhere about whether he looks any good.

Vince Verhei: I wrote that comment about Bradford before Minnesota's fifth possession of the game, but that drive just emphasized Minnesota's boom-and-bust day. The drive started with Yannick Ngakoue swatting the ball out of Bradford's hand for what appears to be a strip-sack, but Bradford gets the ball back and hits Jerick McKinnon for a 15-yard catch-and-run. Two plays later, Bradford has time in the pocket and hits Stefon Diggs in one-on-one coverage down the middle for a 45-yard gain that puts Minnesota in the red zone. They get a first-and-goal at the 3, but the drive stalls there. The second-down play, a sideways pass to Rudolph that was basically a pitch, was particularly confusing. Matt Asiata is then stuffed at the 1 on both third and fourth down, and the Vikings come away with no points, though they still lead 9-6. 

Fowler does have a tackle today, so he is alive. I just checked and he has 2.5 sacks and one start this season. Yeah, that pick has not worked out.

Jaguars tie the score at 9 just before halftime. Biggest plays were a 31-yard DPI on Xavier Rhodes covering Allen Robinson, and then Marqise Lee reversing field and breaking tackles to turn a short catch over the middle into a 39-yard gain before being pushed out of bounds.

Tom Gower: Fowler's done little, from everything I've seen and heard about Jacksonville this year.

Vince Verhei: If the Vikings lose this game, they'll be able to blame it all on their scoring-range offense. They've had six drives cross the Jacksonville 30 today, resulting in one touchdown, three field goals, one fourth-down stop, and just now, a lost fumble at the goal line as Matt Asiata was trying to score. Jaguars get the ball back, down 18-16, with about six minutes to go.

By the way, I have seen Fowler get a couple of pressures today, but no game-changing plays.

Oh, and adding to that: Kai Forbath has kicked four field goals today, but he missed an extra point, and that's why Jacksonville can win with a field goal.

Vikings drove down the field and had a goal-to-go situation again. This time they avoided Asiata, and Bradford hit Rudolph for a 6-yard touchdown to give the Vikings what you figure will be an insurmountable 25-16 lead.

San Diego Chargers 16 at Carolina Panthers 28

Bryan Knowles: Nasty sight in San Diego -- Melvin Gordon dove in after what he thought was a Philip Rivers fumble, and his leg got very, very awkwardly pinned behind him. He has been carted off the field.

Vince Verhei: Chargers nearly had themselves in position for an all-time comeback here. After falling behind 23-0, they crawled back to make it 26-16. Trovon Reed then intercepted Cam Newton at the goal line, and was originally ruled to have returned the ball for a 100-yard pick-six. Replay showed, though, that he had been touched down after a return of just 3 yards. So San Diego had a first down at their own 3, still down ten points -- and then Philip Rivers was sacked for a safety on third down, giving the Panthers a 28-16 lead and the ball.

And then Carolina gets aggressive, going for it on fourth-and-1 at midfield with still half a quarter to go -- and they get it, with Jonathan Stewart getting a good gain and letting the Panthers kill more clock.

Bryan Knowles: San Diego briefly had signs of life, fighting back from a 23-0 deficit, but Carolina eventually squelched it. The 28-16 victory keeps Carolina's faint playoff hopes alive for one more week, at least.

Washington Redskins 27 at Philadelphia Eagles 22

Andrew Potter: People complain a lot about pass interference being a spot foul and automatic first down, making the penalty often disproportionate to what can be a marginal foul. No such complaints about the huge penalty against Quinton Dunbar on Philly's second drive here -- Dunbar was soundly beaten deep left by Nelson Agoholor and Carson Wentz threw for Agholor, so Dunbar simply tackled the receiver 44 yards downfield. Textbook example of why it's a spot foul and not simply set yardage.

Vince Verhei: Strong disagree! Critics of the 15-yard DPI rule say that if it was installed, defenders would just tackle receivers before the ball got there every time they were beaten. Well, here we see an example of a defender who was cleanly beaten and just tackled the receiver before the ball got there anyway -- in other words, the spot foul rule doesn't discourage that kind of behavior at all.

Aaron Schatz: I know my solution to the DPI problem is complicated, probably too much math for some people, but I think it works. Spot foul up to the 20, half the distance to the goal inside the 20. That prevents the deep ball that is just an attempt to get first-and-goal on the 1. On a deep pass of more than 20 yards, that DPI in the end zone gives you first-and-goal from the 10 instead.

Andrew Potter: Potentially critical development in Philadelphia, as Eagles long snapper Jon Dorenbos is out with a wrist injury and Brent Celek replaces him on a 50-yard field goal attempt. The snap, though not Travis Goethel bad, is nowhere near right and holder Donnie Jones can't get it in place for Caleb Sturgis. Doug Pederson has been aggressive on third down all year, and had a couple of big conversions today, but Dorenbos being unable to snap the ball puts them in a very tough spot on both kicks and -- more worryingly -- punts.

Washington leads 14-13, so that botched snap has already had a significant impact on the game.

Bryan Knowles: Eagles long snapper Jon Dorenbos is hurt, so the Eagles turn to tight end Brent Celek as their long-snapper on field goals. It costs the Eagles three points -- Celek's snap is low, and the holder is unable to come down with it. Something to watch as the game moves forward, if it ends up close.

Andrew Potter: ...and now Celek is also hurt, injured long-snapping on a Donnie Jones punt. According to Pam Oliver, the Eagles have no idea who's going to snap for them if neither Celek nor Dorenbos can return.

We just had the remarkable sight of the Eagles holding sideline tryouts for a third-string long snapper, with Dorenbos out with a wrist injury and Brent Celek questionable to return with a stinger. Fullback Trey Burton, who has been an unexpected feature of Philadelphia's passing game today, wins the job, then on his first attempt gets too much air under a snap to Donnie Jones. Jones, however, expertly catches the ball and gets it down for Sturgis to kick his third field goal of the day.

Bryan Knowles: 5 minutes left, facing fourth-and-1 from the Washington 23, the Eagles are down two points. This is an obvious field goal situation -- but with both long snappers out, the Eagles line up to go for it, figuring their odds of getting a yard are higher than their odds of completing a snap.

They do eventually call the time-out and re-think it, deciding to opt with third-string long snapper Trey Burton, who I assume must have volunteered on the sideline to give it a shot. His snap is adequate, and Philly takes the lead.

Andrew Potter: Hilariously, Doug Pederson just challenged an incomplete pass to Jamison Crowder in hopes of having the outcome reversed to a catch and fumble. Crowder did make the catch, but was then down by contact before he lost the ball, so we got the outstanding result of an incomplete pass being overturned into a 33-yard completion because of a successful challenge by the DEFENSE.

Arizona Cardinals 23 at Miami Dolphins 26

Aaron Schatz: Some interesting goings-on early in the Arizona-Miami tilt.

Carson Palmer threw a pick on the first Arizona drive with something you don't see often -- a ball tipped in the air by Larry Fitzgerald. The Dolphins marched back up the field and threw a touchdown to Kenny Stills.

Arizona takes the kickoff, and on the first series they hand the ball off to J.J. Nelson on an end-around. Nelson had not just one but two extra gears and just accelerated right through the hole and went all the way for a touchdown. Chandler Catanzaro missed the XP, so it's now 7-6 Miami.

Then Ryan Tannehill got busy throwing to tightly covered receivers on the second drive. First, Jarvis Landry on a slant had no separation from Patrick Peterson. Then Tannehill threw deep left to Stills, whose little move to try to shake off the coverage was so small, Marcus Peters stepped in front of the ball. It looked sort of like simultaneous reception but the refs gave the ball to Peters. Then the skies opened up, and the Cardinals just fumbled it right back because suddenly things got very, very wet. That's three turnovers in the first 9 minutes of this game.

And with another Carson Palmer pick (pressure in his face, plus a slippery ball, led to a pass thrown too high) and then a Miami fumble at the goal line (botched center-quarterback exchange), we're now at five turnovers in the first quarter. The city of Miami is very, very wet right now.

Vince Verhei: Funniest thing about the weather in Miami is that the other game in Florida today is being played in perfect sunshine. (And yes, I realize Jacksonville and Miami are hundreds of miles apart.)

Aaron Schatz: One of the elements of the Arizona Cardinals collapse that nobody is really talking about: their offensive line has gone from a major strength to a huge weakness, particularly in pass protection. The Cardinals were fifth in adjusted sack rate last year but are 24th going into this game. They're now missing two opening day starters (left tackle Jared Veldheer, right guard Evan Mathis), which also means D.J. Humphries has been moved over to left tackle and they're stuck playing a 2014 seventh-rounder cut by Miami earlier this year, Ulrick John, as their starting right tackle. Humphries is a bit overmatched on the left side and John is awful on the right. They've also got John Wetzel now at right guard, a former UDFA on his fourth team.

Oh boy. D.J. Humphries is now out with an injury and Wetzel is playing left tackle. Andre "Don't Call Me Alan" Branch just brutalized him with a speed move to the outside to strip-sack Palmer. Wetzel recovered, but man, that looked terrible. Two players later, Palmer nearly threw a pick to Branch when the Cardinals were trying to throw a screen and Branch sniffed it out. Branch couldn't hold on to the ball, but again, horrid play. How do you expect David Johnson to do awesome things when the quarterback can't get Johnson the ball?

The Arizona Cardinals offensive line suddenly started holding up halfway through the fourth quarter. I must admit I have not watched things close enough to know whether or not the issue was that the Dolphins are now sending fewer guys or what, but Arizona had a long drive downfield with Palmer getting plenty of time to throw. Touchdown to Brittan Golden... and then Chandler Catanzaro gets the XP blocked and the Dolphins return it for a two-point defensive conversion. 23-15 Miami.

Andrew Potter: Chandler Catanzaro better hope he looks really good in some other team's tryouts next offseason.

Bryan Knowles: After nearly accidentally running out their own clock, the Dolphins line up for a 21-yard field goal for the win. It's not a gimme, in a rainstorm when there has already been an extra point blocked this game -- but it goes through.

No points for Adam Gase there -- the complete lack of clock awareness from the Dolphins nearly cost them even the chance to kick a field goal here. That would have been mortifying for a team that's in playoff position now, with Denver's loss.

The Miami win means New England will have to wait another week before claiming the AFC East title yet again.

Aaron Schatz: The Cardinals came back with a touchdown and two-point conversion to tie things, and I just kept wondering where the hell the Dolphins pass rush had gone. But they didn't need it. The rain was enough. Palmer botched the snap when the Cardinals got the ball back with 2:00 left, which led to a three-and-out and the Dolphins getting the ball back.

With 40 seconds left, Matt Moore took the pressure from a blitz and launched it deep to Kenny Stills. The ball hung but Stills adjusted to it better than Justin Bethel did and caught it at the Arizona 1 (with a declined DPI flag to boot). The Dolphins tried really hard to screw up this almost-sure win, handing the ball off for a 2-yard loss, then wasting time getting set up, and running another play with 10 seconds left anyway... and then Damien Williams wouldn't go down, fighting for a pointless yard for 9 seconds. The Dolphins got lucky when he went down and Adam Gase, standing next to the official, called the timeout immediately. Andrew Franks field goal, Dolphins win. I'm not sure what happens to their playoff odds now, because the word is that Ryan Tannehill has a torn ACL, which means we're talking the Matt Moore show for the rest of the year.

Pittsburgh Steelers 27 at Buffalo Bills 20

Bryan Knowles: You'd think the winter storm conditions would slow down the road team, while the home team would be more prepared. So far, however, Pittsburgh has 134 total yards, and Buffalo has minus-1. So, you know. That's not going fantastic. The Bills defense has an interception, but that's about it -- they do not, at the moment, seem prepared to stop Le'Veon Bell in any way, shape or form.

Scott Kacsmar: Only a pair of Ben Roethlisberger interceptions has kept this one close (14-7) at halftime. The Steelers are running their normal offense in the snow, but Roethlisberger has been off on a few passes that killed promising drives, including a red zone pick to start the game. Le'Veon Bell has basically been unstoppable with two touchdown runs and an 80-yard first quarter. The Buffalo offense has yet to put a long drive together, only scoring on a short field after the second interception. Tyrod Taylor has been pressured and has also taken some pretty bad sacks. He came into the game holding the ball longer than any quarterback this season, and it has shown today. But the Bills have taken advantage of some mistakes by Pittsburgh's rookie defensive backs. Artie Burns was caught for holding to wipe out a William Gay pick-six, and safety Sean Davis was beaten easily for a touchdown by Sammy Watkins in the red zone.

Bryan Knowles: I've never seen this before.

Super-snowy, of course, so during halftime, the grounds crew used snow-blowers to blow off the excess snow. All well and good -- except it also, apparently, blew off all the ground-up rubber pellets that form the base for the artificial surface. So the sidelines and end zone are littered with black rubber, and the field is currently being re-rubbered; it's unsafe to play on at the moment. And, of course, by the time they remove all of them from the sideline and re-apply them on the field, it's going to be covered in snow again.

Nice little day for Le'Veon Bell. 236 rushing yards -- a Pittsburgh franchise record -- 62 receiving yards, and three touchdowns. A helpful performance in the first round of the fantasy playoffs. let me tell you. The passing game never really got going in the snowy conditions -- Roethlisberger ended up throwing three interceptions -- but who needs passing when you've got performance like that on the ground?

Scott Kacsmar: The best game of Bell's career bailed out one of Roethlisberger's worst. You just wonder how many more weeks Bell can sustain such a big workload, but maybe DeAngelo Williams will be back soon. Then again, the Steelers haven't shown any willingness to actually use another back with any real frequency as long as Bell is healthy.

Houston Texans 22 at Indianapolis Colts 17

Aaron Schatz: This may be one of my favorite descriptive tweets of all-time.

Chicago Bears 17 at Detroit Lions 20

Vince Verhei: Lions lead 10-3 at halftime, and the game hasn't been any more exciting than that sounds. Ultra-conservative schemes by both teams have led to a bunch of first downs, but few big plays or red zone conversions, and only one three-and-out. It's just a bunch of eight-play drives ending in punts or field goals. The only exceptions have been Marvin Jones' 48-yard catch on a bomb (where I thought the Lions' offensive line got away with holding, but anyway) that set up a field goal, and then Detroit's two big plays on their late touchdown drive: Tracy Porter's 38-yard DPI in coverage against Jones, and then Anquan Boldin's 16-yard touchdown catch, where it looked like Matthew Stafford was actually throwing to a guy running towards the back corner of the end zone, but Boldin came over on a crossing route and leaped to "intracept" the ball.

With Detroit taking a 13-3 lead and threatening to put the game away, Chicago keeps itself alive with a 31-yard touchdown pass down the sideline from Matt Barkley to Cameron Meredith. Darius Slay was in coverage on the play. I know that Slay had made noise this season about getting top cornerback money, and his charting numbers this season (5.0 yards per target, 60 percent success rate in coverage) have been pretty good, but I kind of feel like you can't be a No. 1 corner if you're giving up long touchdowns to Matt Barkley and Cameron Meredith.

And then Detroit is threatening to extend its lead, but Matt Stafford's pass into the end zone bounces off Bryce Callahan and Golden Tate before Demontre Hurst reels in the interception. This has basically been every Detroit game this season, with the roles reversed. This time Detroit is the superior team letting the underdog hang around with a chance to win at the end.

The Bears punt after that interception, but they pin the Lions inside their own 10. A run and an incompletion puts Detroit at third-and-5, and then Cre'Von LeBlanc jumps an out route to Boldin and returns it 24 yards for a touchdown. Chicago now leads 17-13. That's two interceptions for Stafford today after he had thrown only one in Detroit's last eight games.

Bryan Knowles: We all had Chicago taking the lead over Detroit thanks to a couple key interceptions by Matthew Stafford, right?

Stafford threw an interception in the red zone to Demonte Hurst, his first red zone pick since Week 16 of 2014. Chicago ends up not being able to do anything off of that turnover, but on the ensuing possession, Stafford is picked off by Cre'Von LeBlanc, who is apparently an actual person and not a random collection of syllables. LeBlanc takes it all the way back to the house. 17-13, Chicago, and they're not mathematically eliminated yet…

Bryan Knowles: Detroit will eventually run out of fourth-quarter comeback magic, right? Right? Right?

Their 20-17 comeback win, keyed by Matthew Stafford running over everyone on his way to the end zone, keeps them atop the NFC North, and officially eliminates the Bears.

Vince Verhei: After a couple of holding penalties set the Bears back in a first-and-30, the game ends when Barkley's fourth-and-11 pass bounces off Jay Bellamy's shoulder pads. Detroit's string of fourth-quarter comebacks and nail-biting wins continues.

Denver Broncos 10 at Tennessee Titans 13

Tom Gower: Titans lead 13-0 at the half. Great to be up 13-0, but Titans have really dominated the first half to an extent even greater than that. Denver can't put together anything on offense, with a fumble by newly acquired Justin Forsett and a pair of third-and-1 failures among the biggest miscues. In fact, they have failed on their last 15 third downs dating back to the Kansas City game, and it's not because they have been in third-and-longs. I wonder how much the foot is affecting Trevor Siemian -- he has attempted just one deep shot, which Emmanuel Sanders should have caught but failed to haul in after the corner tipped it -- because almost everything else has been short, shorter, and shortest even morseo than I think of from the Denver offense. And the offensive line isn't where it needs to be.

I was concerned about today's matchup for the Titans offense, because DeMarco Murray had been terrible the last two games before the bye (minus-30 DYAR each game, despite facing horrible Indy and mediocre Chicago), but the Titans ran the ball pretty effectively in the first half. Murray looks better with the extra rest, they've been getting Marcus Mariota involved (which says something about how much of a priority they put on winning this game), and Derrick Henry was involved from the very first series. And when they have gotten to third downs, they have done a good job of getting an extra set of downs -- 6-of-10, including Murray's score on the opening drive of the game.

More impressively, the Titans have done it getting about as little as you would have expected from the wide receivers. They have one catch, a Harry Douglas play for 10 yards that was negated by a 10-yard penalty (so, repeat third-and-7) that was basically a delayed swing pass behind the line of scrimmage. The only other passes wide receivers have caught have been when Delanie Walker has committed offensive pass interference on short crossers to get them open. Very obvious. Denver's corners have also gotten away with some physical play in the secondary -- more physical than you normally see defenses get away with, but I guess it's that kind of day. Oh, and Harry Douglas also decided to cheap-shot Chris Harris, going with a helmet to the knee. Aqib Talib went after Douglas the next play, unsurprisingly. Thankfully, Harris was able to return (I root against any and all injuries).

Bryan Knowles: The AFC wild card race continues to get a bit more complicated. Sixth-seed Denver, attempting to drive for a game-tying field goal, lose a fumble on a short pass from Siemian to A.J. Derby. The Titans fall on it, and are able to run out the clock. That'll probably knock Denver out of playoff position at the moment, with Miami likely to take that slot. It continues Tennessee's outside chance at a late run for the AFC South, and keeps San Diego and Cincinnati mathematically alive for another week. Great result for chaos, there.

Tom Gower: Tennessee wins, 13-10. Titans offense in the second half was about like I thought it would be all game. They started out with a couple first downs running, got to midfield, then punted, and went three-and-out their next five possessions. They had precisely one good offensive play, but it was a big one. Mariota hit Rishard Matthews (a wide receiver!) for 26 yards on a slot fade. Perfect placement, and Matthews did well to put the ball in the outside hand so Talib couldn't rake it away from him. Titans took the passing a bit too far in the four-minute situation, though, and followed it up with a couple of incomplete passes to let the Broncos keep their timeouts with under three minutes to play.

Broncos offense... they completely abandoned the run, finishing with 54 dropbacks to nine runs. Nine their 18 rushing yards came on Forsett's fumble. Abandoning the run so completely made sense. But they didn't get much deep. Siemian finally found Demaryius Thomas for a 34-yard gain in the fourth when he outmuscled Valentino Blake for the ball, but their second-longest gain was 17 yards. They finally converted a third down, but you have to be more efficient than they were when you're not getting explosive plays. They finally found the end zone in the fourth quarter, but that drive started at the plus-26 following a good punt return and a penalty on Tennessee. Of course, that punt was set up by going for it on fourth-and-goal from the 4 down 13-0 early in the fourth, a decision that made perfect sense but a play that caused me to wonder more still about Siemian's injured foot as he air-mailed a throw with coverage after the scramble. I know, he's not a strong-armed passer, but I think he's normally better than he was today. Kubiak kicked the field goal to make it 13-10 with 4:33 left; holding all three timeouts and at fourth-and-goal from the 16, it made sense. But the final possession was much too casual, and the Titans got their second forced fumble of the game and the season against A.J. Derby, and for the first time since they won the 2011 season finale Tennessee won a game and was over .500 after the month of September.

New York Jets 23 at San Francisco 49ers 17 (OT)

Vince Verhei: The first three plays from scrimmage of the Bryce Petty era: Matt Forte run for 2; interception thrown right to Jimmie Ward that probably should have been a pick-six; Colin Kaepernick hits Carlos Hyde off the play-fake for a 7-yard touchdown that might well prove to be the game-winner. The game is 63 seconds old.

I went to the bathroom after that last email, and by the time I got back the Jets had already gone three-and-out and punted. The San Francisco defense was 29th coming into the weekend, 28th against the pass and dead last against the run.

Ensuing drive: Carlos Hyde run for 11, Kaepernick-to-Patton for 19, Hyde run for 47, Shaun Draughn 4-yard touchdown run. That's four first downs for San Francisco in five plays. They had ten first downs in a whole game last week. It's 14-0 San Francisco and we're not even five minutes into the game.

Bryan Knowles: By DVOA, the Jets had the second-best rushing defense in the league coming into the week. For all their faults, they have only allowed four teams to have 100-yard days on the ground.

Carlos Hyde's already at 141 rushing yards, and we haven't hit the two-minute warning in the second quarter yet. Hyde's career high is 168, set in the 49ers' trademark Surprising Week One Victory last season. He might top that before halftime.

Vince Verhei: Hyde has 141 yards... on seven carries. I think that second total is just as important as the first.

Bryan Knowles: To add to that, the 49ers overall have 13 rushes for 180 yards. When you can get 13.8 yards per rush, you're probably doing pretty good.

The 49ers should actually be up by more than their 17-3 lead; Phil Dawson missed a pair of makeable field goals.

It should be noted, though, that the 49ers are 1-8 in games in which they scored first this season, so if any team could blow this lead...

Scott Kacsmar: The 49ers have a fourth-quarter lead for the first time since Week 1, a 28-0 win over the Rams. Coincidentally, the Rams are down 28-0 to Atlanta right now.

Bryan Knowles: That fourth-quarter lead? Gone. The Jets just kicked a field goal, bringing the score to 17-17 with 38 seconds left.

Who's ready for some bonus football in THIS one? Woo! Woo? Woo.

Of course, the first game between two mathematically eliminated teams would go to overtime. Of course. Big draft ramifications in this one -- a Jets win probably means the Browns roll to the top pick, with the 49ers needing a loss to keep pace.

Really, both teams should swap uniforms and play overtime, because a win is only a moral victory for either franchise at this point -- and how much of a moral victory can you have when you've had to go into overtime against the 49ers or Jets? A loss and better draft position is much more valuable now.

And mercifully, it's over. Bilal Powell rumbles in for a 19-yard touchdown, and the 49ers pick up their 12th straight loss. A clutch performance there, pulling defeat from the jaws of victory in order to maintain that high draft spot.

Seattle Seahawks 10 at Green Bay Packers 38

Vince Verhei: First drive of the game, Davante Adams scorches Jeremy Lane on an out-and-up for a 66-yard touchdown down the sideline. Would Earl Thomas have been able to at least make a tackle from centerfield? We'll never know, but Steven Terrell had no chance.

Bryan Knowles: Seattle's offensive line issues reared their heads again -- facing a third-and-short inside Green Bay's 10-yard line, the Packers just swarm, with Jayrone Elliott and Jake Ryan stopping Thomas Rawls behind the line, forcing Seattle to settle for just a field goal. Rawls may have slipped on the icy turf there, but still, huge stop in a near must-win game for the Pack.

Vince Verhei: Interesting situation here as Green Bay's primary runner today, Christine Michael, is still Seattle's leading rusher this season. He's understandably running hard against his old team and getting some good gains, but then on third-and-3 at the edge of field goal range, he goes the wrong way on a play, Aaron Rodgers has nobody to hand off to, and the quarterback ends up going down for a loss. That leads to a 51-yard field goal try, and Mason Crosby pushes it right.

Carl Yedor: As was mentioned on the broadcast, Russell Wilson has had two receivers open deep for what would've been touchdowns that he overthrew. Instead, the Seahawks have managed 3 points from their first two drives. Part of it could be the cold weather, but he'll definitely need to be sharper moving forward. Green Bay will now start the second quarter with the ball inside their own 20.

Vince Verhei: Packers take a 14-3 lead on a Ty Montgomery touchdown run. That was set up by Morgan Burnett's interception of Russell Wilson. Jimmy Graham slipped and fell on that play, but as Troy Aikman pointed out on commentary, Burnett had great position on the play and it wasn't likely to have been completed anyway. This isn't like early in the season or the Tampa Bay game where Wilson was under constant pressure and being forced into mistakes. He's just making bad throws. A very bad game for him so far.

Carl Yedor: Rough end to the drive for K.J. Wright there. On a big third-down conversion to Ty Montgomery, Wright trips over Jared Cook's foot, leaving him unable to make the tackle short of the sticks. Then, down on the goal line, Wright slips trying to change directions and Jordy Nelson gets free for the touchdown. 21-3 now with 5 minutes to go in the first half.

Aaron Schatz: This is a miserable start for Seattle, down 21-3. The Packers' coverage has been awful this year, but not today. There are a number of plays where Wilson has nobody open. And when he does have someone open, he's missing them. A few overthrown, and he just threw way too low to Doug Baldwin on what should have been a third-down conversion.

Vince Verhei: Welp. After Green Bay goes up 21-3, Seahawks put together a drive and threaten to score, but then Wilson tries to throw back to the right after scrambling to the left. Had the pass been two steps earlier Doug Baldwin would have had a long touchdown, but Damarious Randall had time to make a great play and cut in front of Baldwin for the pick. As bad a day as Wilson has had in a long time. 

Meanwhile, Aaron Rodgers and the Packers are just shredding the Seahawks defense. Or, more specifically, whichever outside corner is not Richard Sherman. It has just been a parade of deep balls down the sideline against either Jeremy Lane or DeShawn Shead, and it's working way more often than not. At halftime, he's got the perfect passer rating of 158.3. They've been stopped twice, once on the blown handoff, and once when a receiver was open down the sideline and Rodgers overthrew him. 

Really, that's the story of this game. Rodgers has hit almost all of his opportunities for big plays. Wilson has missed almost all of his.

Great stat from Danny O'Neil of KIRO radio: Russell Wilson had two interceptions in his first 342 attempts this season. Now he has five in his last 78.

It's 31-3 with less than 11 minutes to go and Russell Wilson is still out there throwing passes.

Bryan Knowles: This Seattle performance will probably top the Tampa Bay game for the worst DVOA game in recent Seattle history.

Assuming the Green Bay game and Tampa Bay game will remain below -50% DVOA after adjustments, that'll be nuts -- they had zero such games from 2012-2015, and now two in three weeks.

Vince Verhei: And both without Earl Thomas (though the defense played OK against Tampa Bay).

Seahawks get a touchdown to Tanner McEvoy and then a fourth-down stop, and down 31-10 with about six minutes left, you start doing math and wondering if this is really possible -- and then Wilson throws a pass that Troymaine Pope has to jump for in the backfield, and it bounces off Pope's hands into Micah Hyde's. And then on the next play Jeff Janis takes an end-around 19-yard touchdown to make it 38-10. Davante Adams blocked the snot out of Richard Sherman, knocked him down three times on one play.

Bryan Knowles: Seattle's loss means they won't be clinching the NFC West this week, though obviously that's not exactly at the top of their mind at this point in time. Wilson ends with five interceptions in this game, and only Ryan Fitz-Six-Picks has topped that in 2016. A day to forget all around.

Scott Kacsmar: Had Seattle's competitive streak continued in Tampa Bay, it would have ended at exactly 100 games with this loss in Green Bay, a true gut punch to fans of round numbers. Really, this was a weird game and I'm not sure it says too much about either team going forward. Yeah, this was more like an old-school Green Bay home game where the Packers came out hot, Aaron Rodgers was super efficient, and turnovers led to an avalanche of points. Similar to the 2014 NFC Championship Game, Russell Wilson alternated between terrible throws and bad luck to finish with five interceptions. No crazy comeback this time, but it's not like the Packers were driving up and down long fields. The final 31 points came on just 144 yards of offense with no drive longer than 48 yards (four drives of 32 yards or less). Gifts left and right from Seattle to facilitate the scoring. Semantics debate over, we can now all agree that the Seahawks have finally been blown to smithereens in a game in the Wilson era. This outcome may have ended the Seattle DVOA dynasty. And yet, the Packers are still the ninth-place team in the NFC where there doesn't seem to be much of a difference between second (now Detroit) and ninth. It's Dallas' conference to lose at this point.

Vince Verhei: Two final thoughts on Seattle:

1) With Atlanta, Tampa Bay, and Detroit all winning, Seattle is now a half-game behind the Lions, and just a half-game ahead of the Bucs and Falcons, for the second first-round bye in the NFC. This race is going to come down to the fourth quarter of Week 17. 

2) This Thursday night's game between the Seahawks and Rams is going to feature two teams that lost today by a combined score of 80-24. In Color Rush uniforms. Probably on a cold, rainy night. Enjoy!

New Orleans Saints 11 at Tampa Bay Buccaneers 16

Andrew Potter: Another absolute squib of an offensive opening for the Saints against the Buccaneers. Midway through the first quarter, New Orleans has one first down and it came on a facemask penalty against Lavonte David. Two plays (and one delay of game) later, Drew Brees threw over the middle to a covered Coby Fleener, Kwon Alexander tipped the ball, and Vernon Hargreaves intercepted it. Each of the previous two drives went three-and-out mainly thanks to solid coverage by the Buccaneers secondary.

On the other side, Tampa Bay punted on their opening drive but has scored on all three drives since then -- two Roberto Aguayo field goals and a goal-line touchdown for Doug Martin. In a quirky footnote to our previous conversation, the Buccaneers were given first-and-goal at the 1-yard line not once, but twice by defensive pass interference penalties (neither of which was really debatable).

Saints finally get a drive together as I type this, but it stalls out around the Buccaneers 25-yard line and Wil Lutz drills a 42-yarder.

Now Josh Huff, in his first game for the Buccaneers, completely screws up fielding a bouncing kickoff at the goal line and the ball squirms out of bounds at the 1. That inexcusable error costs his team a safety on the next play when the Saints defense rocks the Buccaneers offensive line backward at the snap and Paul Kruger tackles Doug Martin in his own end zone.

Following the safety, Bryan Anger sends the free kick out of bounds and the Saints get the ball at midfield. Wouldn't like to see Tampa Bay's special teams rating for those two plays, directly turning a received kickoff into minus-2 points and opponents' ball at the 50. Drew Brees fails to make them pay further when he badly overthrows Brandin Cooks on a play-action deep post. The Saints do get points off the drive, however, as Wil Lutz knocks through a 34-yarder to end the half.

Third quarter in Tampa Bay resulted in only a field goal each way, on exactly two drives each. The Saints took a five-minute drive to the Buccaneers 4, but settled for three thanks in part to Brandin Cooks failing to haul in what would have been a Drew Brees touchdown pass -- the play was initially called a touchdown on the field, but was possibly the most obvious replay overturn of the year. On the next drive, the Buccaneers also took a long drive into the red zone but settled for three -- this time because Jameis Winston threw late for an open Russell Shepard on an end zone slant, and Sterling Moore knocked the ball away. Big missed opportunities for both sides.

The first drive of the fourth quarter for the Saints results in the second tipped Brees interception of the day, knocked in the air by Keith Tandy -- who jumped the slant in a slant/flat combo -- and intercepted by Brent Grimes. Generally, Tampa Bay feels in control of this one, but they're not quite translating their superiority on the field into superiority on the scoreboard, with Mike Evans noticeably quiet under the coverage of Delvin Breaux. Breaux went out injured during Tampa Bay's long third-quarter drive, however, which moves B.W. Webb into coverage on Evans. That might well be a matchup to watch if Breaux can't return.

It's a genuine shame that his horrible safety free kick went out of bounds earlier, because Bryan Anger has had a terrific second half. He has now pinned the Saints at the 1 and the 3 on consecutive punts, with his other punt being a 57-yarder.

The only thing that has the Saints in this game is that horrible special teams sequence I mentioned earlier, yet they now have a chance in the two-minute drill to gain an unlikely come-from-behind victory. Fortunately for Tampa Bay, their punter has made that a lot harder than it might otherwise be by pinning New Orleans at their own 3.

The comeback attempt ends abruptly at midfield when Keith Tandy jumps another slant route for another Bucs interception. Brees has now thrown zero touchdowns and six interceptions in the past two weeks, including two game-sealing picks.

It was comfortable in the end for the Buccaneers, apart from that bizarre 60-second sequence in the first half. Especially encouraging will be the fact that they managed the win without a big performance from their offense -- under 300 total yards, and only one touchdown.

Atlanta Falcons 42 at Los Angeles Rams 14

Bryan Knowles: Another rough outing for Jared Goff so far. He just threw his second interception of the game, as Deion Jones was reading him the entire way. Jones jumped on the slant and took it to the house, and the Rams are already in a 21-0 hole.

To be fair, Goff could really use an offensive line, or some functioning receivers -- but that pick was all him completely failing to see Jones. Growing pains for the rookie.

Cian Fahey: Vic Beasley's development has been spectacular and the Rams are feeling the full force of it in this game. Beasley has a couple of sacks and has generally been unblockable coming off the right side of the offense.

Bryan Knowles: The Rams loss officially, mathematically eliminates them from contention this year. But hey, at least they have their head coach and starting quarterback locked up, right?

Dallas Cowboys 7 at New York Giants 10

Aaron Schatz: I realize that my first comment nearly 25 minutes into this game should be more concrete than just a tossed-off five-word phrase, but... man, Ereck Flowers is awful.

OK, so, at halftime, I think this game is a good example to people of why I've been saying all year that the Giants defense is pretty good and their offense is not. Every first-half drive ended in a fumble or punt and only one of them went more than four plays. Even Odell Beckham dropped a deep pass. Everything is just so meh, and the bad offensive line makes it impossible to really develop stuff.

Meanwhile, Dak Prescott is having his second straight bad game. Ezekiel Elliott had 15 carries for 86 yards in the first half and it barely mattered because the Cowboys couldn't convert the good third-down situations he got them into. The second quarter featured such drives as:

  • Elliott 4 yards, Elliott 4 yards, interception.
  • Elliott 15 yards, Elliott 4 yards, sack, incomplete, punt.
  • Elliott 14 yards, Elliott 4 yards, incomplete, 4-yard pass on third-and-6, punt.

Scott Kacsmar: This game is also doing statistical wonders for the Dallas defense even though it has mostly been poor New York offense. I really have no idea what Eli Manning was thinking on some of these throws. Barry Church had a really bad dropped interception that could have made this 10-0 or 14-0 right now. The Giants are hanging around thanks to that defense again, but I expect the Dallas offense to find its way in the fourth quarter.

Aaron Schatz: Here's what Eli Manning is thinking on some of these throws: "Oh my god, Ereck Flowers... I'M GOING TO DIE."

Well, the problem with a defensive battle is that if you give up one big play, suddenly you're behind. So one big Odell Beckham 61-yard touchdown right through the Dallas coverage, and suddenly it is 10-7 at the start of the fourth quarter.

I love Ezekiel Elliott too but come on, Dallas, did you just run halfback toss left on third-and-ELEVEN?

Scott Kacsmar: This season kind of deserves a late Sunday afternoon game in Dallas on divisional weekend with the Giants coming for the 3-0 sweep. It could be like the 1999 Jaguars going 15-3 with all the losses to the Titans.

Posted by: Andrew Potter on 12 Dec 2016

119 comments, Last at 17 Dec 2016, 4:12am by christmas

Comments

1
by jtr :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:27am

>Andrew Potter: ...and now Ertz is also hurt, injured long-snapping on a Donnie Jones punt. According to Pam Oliver, the Eagles have no idea who's going to snap for them if neither Ertz nor Dorenbos can return.
We just had the remarkable sight of the Eagles holding sideline tryouts for a third-string long snapper, with Dorenbos out with a wrist injury and Zach Ertz questionable to return with a stinger

Celek was the one who did some backup longsnapping before getting hurt. Ertz played a good game at TE with no longsnapping or injuries to his name.

2
by Andrew Potter :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:34am

You're right, and as my previous comment would attest, I knew that. Don't know where Ertz came from -- probably heard his name on the broadcast while I was typing my comment. Anyway, fixed. Thanks!

116
by Winterguard78 :: Tue, 12/13/2016 - 5:10am

I didn't watch ARI/MIA game, but I imagine Marcus Peters was chilling after dominating Oakland on TNF. Maybe you guys meant former Chief CB Marcus Cooper?

13
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:01pm

m.KENDRICKS ALSO DID SOEM LONG SNAPPING ON SIDELINE BEFORE T. Burton volunterred and got the job. Dorenbos did magic tricks on "America's Got talent" in summer 2016 seaosn. Was in finals

3
by hscer :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:35am

If Brees doesn't get out of this funk we might be seeing his 2014 Peyton season. And speaking of Mannings, is Eli going to have many more productive years? He was already always on the brink. You'd think he'd have done better in his second year under McAdoo. (At least his team is.)

Anyway, I might just be hyperventilating on both QB's. I guess it's as likely we're seeing 2013 Brady from Brees and Eli being Eli instead. But they are both getting up there in years.

27
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:13pm

Brees is leading the league in passing yards and, before yesterday and Rodgers having a good game, was leading in TD passes. He's a long ways from 2014 Peyton; he had two TDs yesterday that hit receivers right in the hands and were dropped. He's still very, very good, but his supporting cast isn't exactly helping.

29
by dmstorm22 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:19pm

At this point in 2014, Peyton probably led the NFL in TDs (he finished 2nd with 39 - Luck had 40), and probably was up there in yards as well (finished 4th).

Peyton in 2014 was ridicoulously better than him in 2015, even when you factor in the bad last 5-6 games. Peyton Manning mid-way through 2014 was more efficient in many ways than he was in 2013.

33
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:40pm

I in no way completely confused 2014 Peyton and 2015 Peyton when I posted, because that would be . . . wrong. I still don't think it really applies, because Peyton was physically fading, and I don't think Brees is at this point. I think his receivers are inconsistent as heck, but he can still make all the throws. I would be curious to see Brees' splits by quarter; he was noticeably forcing the ball more in the second half yesterday, and I wonder if he gets frustrated and starts forcing the ball more as the game goes by because he gets progressively more pissed off that Jimmy Graham and Colston aren't out there catching everything he throws their way.

34
by dmstorm22 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:44pm

Fair enough, but with a lot of non-Peyton QBs that just fell off, it wasn't so apparent. With Peyton we knew arm strength was going to be a problem so it was more visible. With Brees, maybe it isn't. Maybe it's a slow-down in decision making or accuracy, or something.

37
by Andrew Potter :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:00pm

I've commented on that a few times watching Brees this season. There's more than one occasion I think he's been guilty of trying to do too much.

106
by Jimmy Oz :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 6:21pm

Michael Thomas was out. Probably the best rookie WR this year. FO loves him for his high catch rate.

4
by jtr :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:36am

How's the Buffalo O-line this year? I didn't get to see the Pittsburgh game this week, but it looks from the statsheet like they got some serious pressure. That's four weeks in a row of successful pass rush after an abysmal first half of the season, but the last three weeks came against the wretched and/or injured o-lines of the Browns, the Colts, and the Giants. I haven't quite decided if the surging pass rush is for real or a mirage of playing against easily-pressured offenses.

26
by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:06pm

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert on Buffalo's OLine, but I will say that the Steelers improving pass-rush is a function of 3 things.

1- Blessing in disguise of Heyward injury- Butler is letting Tuitt play all over the DL and do a lot of things. (Instead of slotting him to 1 role when Heyward is healthy 99% of the time). And we're seeing he is as good or better than Heyward when he is allowed to play more 'in space' accordingly.

2- The secondary is playing a bit better. Rookies growing into the scheme (not making mental errors) seems to have Butler sending some more blitzers; this is especially important because he is blitzing Timmons a lot (which removes his liability in coverage) . Although he's also blitzing Shazier a lot (and I'd like to see him covering the TEs more than he has Safeties doing.

3- Bud Dupree. He's no second coming of Derrick Thomas, but he's a legit NFL starting caliber OLB, unlike Jarvis Slownes, who the team would probably be better suited just putting 10 men on the field than playing. He still is almost a purely raw athlete with no defined technique, but he showed the last 2 weeks that his explosion and bend on inside twists/etc to the guard is almost unblockable. He also showed ridiculous range tracking down Taylor on that outside scramble. The team can probably be more creative in using him next year if they draft another fast ILB like Shazier (to replace Timmons). Conversely, the team could try moving Timmons to OLB /3rd down situational rusher if they are determined to keep him on the roster and want to draft more DBs early next year. He couldn't do worse than Slownes.

--------------------------------------
The standard is the standard!

5
by jtr :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:40am

>then Cre'Von LeBlanc jumps an out route to Boldin and returns it 24 yards for a touchdown

I hadn't heard of this guy before, but that's an awesome name. How the hell did John Fox let Cre'Von LeBlanc slip off his list of cool names this week? That's definitely up there with Captain Munnerlyn and Elvis Dumervil.

15
by mansteel :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:05pm

Just saw yesterday that Univ of Tennessee's basketball team has a player named Admiral Schofield. Guess he's Captain Munnerlyn's boss.

17
by Otis Taylor89 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:25pm

He was in camp with NE this year and was fantastic, but lost out in a numbers game situation - one that many in NE didn't agree with.

48
by TomC :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:37pm

Yeah, the Bears poached him after seeing him a lot in joint practices. He was pretty bad in his first few games, but he was great yesterday (he had some very nice pass breakups in addition to the pick-6).

6
by James-London :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:45am

The collapse of the Miami D after 3 quarters seemed to be a function of the the Cardinals coaches finally working them out.
Miami have a great D line, but arguably the worst LBs in the league and a bad secondary, so throw short quick passes and carve them up (See the Ravens game from last week). Arizona spent the majority of the game asking their O-line to give Palmer time to throw the deep ball in a monsoon. It went as poorly as you might expect. 4th Quarter, and Arizona do the smart thing resulting in them going the length of the field twice.

I like Arians and his "f*ck it" approach, but that was poor, and cost his team the game

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

7
by James-London :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:48am

I'd also add I'm not looking forward to the Matt Moore experience. He did OK starting in 2011, but hasn't taken meaningful snaps in 5 years. Miami is going to miss Tannehill now they don't have him

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

10
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:55am

Jared Gigg, Matt Moore and Bryce Petty in netxt two stand alone games (rmams bs seashnawks in lime green and Folphins a t Jets sat nite) going to be exciting id you like shaky passing attakczs. although must say watching T. Austin, J. landry, Q. Enunwa and R. Anderson cnan be nice. Austin flea, Landry scrappy, Enunwa big, physical guy makes good cathes, Anderson stick figure. Some of thoe more fun wideouts to watch. Plus, Seahwks in insano green

35
by johonny :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:46pm

I think Moore is a decent backup. HE is replacing a guy very low on the stats here on this website. But Tannehill on his best days, out plays the best Matt Moore days. To me that's the difference. He might win 1 out of 3, but it won't be enough. They certainly can't win a playoff game even if they made it. AFCeast the more things change...wait nothing changes ever. I have trouble watching the NFL these days. I watch Miami games on Sunday mornings and that's about it. The NFL has so little to offer most of its fan base and I've found since it isn't offering me anything then I don't feel bad not watching.

8
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:49am

no quarterback worth drafting reral high it doesn't seem, so going in was not sure 49ers or jets woudld o well to lose. at some poiht, a tema and its fanabase just wamnts to win a game.

totally different story if guy like Aikman P. m,anning or Elway or Lick ios available in up[coming draft.

hate idea of tanking in sports. also hate people making fun of a crappy team for winnign a game

109
by mehllageman56 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 8:06pm

Losing would help the Niners more than the Jets, but I agree with you on this one, for this year at least. The top five players on Walter Football's big board for the draft are: 1. Myles Garrett, DE Texas A& M 2. Leonard Fournette, RB LSU 3. Jonathan Allen, DL Alabama (3-4 DE, or 4-3 DT) 4. Malik Hooker, S Ohio State (unfortunately, he's leaning toward staying in school) 5. Dalvin Cook RB FSU. I'll include number six because Hooker's probably not coming out: 6. Malik McDowell DL Michigan State. Number 7 is an Alabama corner, so let's take a look at this from a Jet's perspective. Garrett would be great for them, as would Hooker, but Hooker isn't coming out, and everyone else is at a position they're stacked at (also true of the Niners, actually), or a running back. Or they can draft Marlon Humphrey and hope he's not the return of Dee Milliner. And yeah, both running backs in that game went over 100 yards, so let's waste a top five pick on a running back.

Walter's top ranked quarterback is DeShone Kizer from Notre Dame. He's completing 58 percent of his passes this year. Kizer is the only quarterback in the top 50. Personally, I think Mitch Trubisky from UNC should be high up in there, but everyone pretty much agrees it is a poor draft for quarterbacks.

111
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 8:16pm

Hooker good. Cook good. Not big fan of Alabama cornerbacks. Everytime I wagtch lsu game, Fournette either injured or bottled up (last two lsu games bvs Alabama). so still don't know whaty to think of fournette. guess he will be good becuause everyone else seems to thinks o.

florida gators have some good corners supposedly.

big fan of D. King, Iowa.

think jets and 49ers should try to trade down and stockjpile extra selectrions

112
by mehllageman56 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 8:31pm

For the Niners, depends who's available. I think Trubisky will be good, so if he's there and fits their offense, perhaps they should take him. Garrett would be worth the second pick. The Jets should just trade down, they need more young players. Not sure what teams would offer them though.

And yeah, I like Desmond King too. Not sure if he fits a man defense, but he's going to be good.

118
by Karl Cuba :: Tue, 12/13/2016 - 9:09pm

I think I'd take Garrett, I'm not sold on the qbs that high (though I reserve the right to change my mind).

9
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:51am

did nto like cbs putuing yard numbers in black.
ideal field goal lime, first down line, other graphics- fine.
but making yard line numbers bold and black not my bag

11
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:59am

liked Giants in white pants. not as good as gray but white is fine. saw complaints abotut hat last nite. also, people didn't like Gaints wearing different socks. some all white like p. perkins if remember right and some all blue, some mixture. if you are sock aficionado then Giants game lats night was probably fun for you.
also, d. Jackson, WR, Washington Squirrels, had his socks different style than rest of tema. but pretty sure he does that most weeks

12
by mansteel :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 11:59am

Thanks for not trashing the Dal/NYG game because the defenses outplayed the offenses. I know everyone's tendency in a defense-dominated game is to jump on how offenses didn't play well, but that's often not true and last night was a case in point. Both defenses got good pressure, had good coverage, and didn't miss tackles--it wasn't that the offenses were bad...well, except for Ereck Flowers. Good god.

I know I'm in the minority, but I love watching good defense much more than watching good offense, and last night's game was a joy for me (not least because I'm a Giants fan).

14
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:04pm

last nights cwoboys vs Gaints game very nice.

like a good solid 10-7 game like that (and clots vs CVhiefs 1995 playoff game when L. Elliott kicked like drunk man) more tghan some 49-31 game leik when Raiders drilled Chiefs in 2000. e. grbac put up all fancy stats in that one buyt Raiders had lead mucyh of day. not really a trhilling game.

18
by dmstorm22 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:25pm

That was an awesome game, I thought.

The Giants defense was fantastic. Spagnuolo has done a great job this year. At this point the defense reminds me a lot of the work he did in 2008, the year when Osi tore his ACL in preseason Strahan had retired, and he started blitzing safeties like mad.

19
by mansteel :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:37pm

I can't tell you how glad I am to see the back of Perry Fewell and his love of the three-man rush on third-and-long. Spags' blitzing schemes have been working great. Strange how little success--both as Rams head coach and as Saints def coord--he had in between his stints with the Giants.

20
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:38pm

I'd have to go back and watch more closely, since I was doing othr stuff while watching the game, but my impression was that Prescott's protection wasn't too bad; he just wasn't locating receivers well, or the receivers just weren't open.

38
by Dales :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:04pm

My impression was that in the 2nd half, and particularly the 4th quarter, the Giants were more successful in generating pressure than in the 1st half.

Again going just off of perception, it feels to me like where the Cowboys o-line wears teams out by the 4th quarter, the Giants' DL wears them out instead. Maybe this is just the result of trying to move Snacks and Hankins around for 3 quarters. (Or maybe my perception is wrong)

45
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:21pm

I thought Dak started to panic and perceive pressure. HIs accuracy and decision making fell apart at the end.

I hated the Giants playcalling at the end of the game. They were up 3. 3!!! Any other time you keep giving a team chances at the end and it will come back to ultimately kill you.

This is the second week in a row Eli has looked horrible. This is definitely not the Eli of the past who would show plenty of throwing competency mixed with terrible decisions. This is looking like a permanent can't hit throws on a regular basis type malaise. I'd be seriously concerned if I were a Giants fan. Its not like his receivers aren't really good.

50
by commissionerleaf :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:47pm

I didn't watch the whole game, but I think Eli is on the borderline of being unable to function because his protection is just that bad. He's never had a good offensive line (since the oughts, anyway) but Ereck Flowers is a step down from Beatty... who was a good swing tackle on any other team.

Also, apart from ODB, his receivers aren't great. Cruz has lost all his explosiveness and apparently a fair amount of his desire for the football to injury (he flat out gave up on a couple of catchable balls). Shepard is a nice player but decidedly nonspecial.

Eli Manning has always been a goofy, inaccurate version of his brother. He's less accurate, but he has the same basic advantages of reading defenses and avoiding sacks. For both of them, their front offices have read this the wrong way, and neglected / drafted badly for the offensive line.

117
by Lebo :: Tue, 12/13/2016 - 9:37am

If Eli is good at avoiding sacks, then doesn't it make some sense to (relatively) under-invest in the o-line?

49
by TomC :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:45pm

I know I'm in the minority, but I love watching good defense much more than watching good offense, and last night's game was a joy for me (not least because I'm a Giants fan).

I love watching good defense too, and there was a lot of that, but there was also some bad football (several dropped interceptions, Eli's unforced fumble...)

96
by BlueStarDude :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:29pm

Kind of thought the game stunk. From the Giants receivers dropping passes, to Dak throwing ducks, to the Dallas defense dropping three easy interceptions (two by the broken-armed Barry Church and one by Durant), to the penalty flags on what seemed like every other punt, to Church’s angle on the OBJ TD. Even Elliott,pretty much the best offensive performer of the night not wearing a number in the 50-79 range, made a couple of bad decisions, too quickly bailing on plays where he was going to have blocking in front of him if he were more decisive. Sean Lee was awesome though.

16
by big10freak :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:13pm

The Packers offensive line played lights out yesterday. And for all the hue and cry about the Josh Sitton release Lane Taylor has been solid more games than not. And he definitely gets a push on running plays that Sitton did not but then nobody compares to Sitton in pass protection where he is the standard.

Seattle's special teams played well but GB did not allow them to be a difference maker which is a bit suprising.

Wouldn't be a Packer game without a totally pointless McCarthy challenge. Some day MM will get this whole challenge thing understood. Figure about 2031

24
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:58pm

The Vikings right guard Brandon Fusco, who, to be sure has been terrible while being the only guy on the ol to not lose time to injury, suffered a concussion yesterday. If he doesn't get back on the field by next Sunday, I think the Vikings will start their 14th or 15th different starter at the 5 positions. You can't run red zone offense under those conditions, absent HOF performers at the ball handling spots. In any case, it appears that Harrison Smith's high ankle sprain is really bad, so he's likely done for the year. Even if they won out, to finish 10-6, the tie breakers are against them, so I'd say they have practically zero chance of getting to the playoffs. If they do hang tough and win out, the players and coaches deserve enormous credit. Even 9-7 will have been a pretty damned good performance.

As to the rest of the league, somebody's gonna get healthier/remain healthier the rest of the way, get hot, and win 3-4 playoff games. I have no idea who that will be. I guess I still like Dallas, simply because they are the one team that could lose their starting qb, and be improved as a result.

It'd be interesting to see a piece on Dak Prescott, looking at the all-22 for the last two games. Is he not identifying guys who are open? Is their indication that the Cowboys are still restricting their offense for a rookie qb, and thus becoming too predictable? Could Romo be getting them into plays at the line of scrimmage that Prescott is not yet ready to do yet, and thus the Cowboys are missing opportunities? On the other hand, the Cowboys defense continues to outperform expectations.

25
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:00pm

Zimmer has no shot at coach of the year, but he really deserves consideration. Being in the playoff hunt until the very end, given the bad luck and injuries they've endured, is very impressive. I mean, the only thing that hasn't gone wrong is the stadium roof collapsing.

28
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:18pm

I'm a sucker for fights to the last man, in hopeless causes. The reason why Cris Carter, who I always appreciated, became one of my all time favorites, was due to a game late his career, in Pittsburgh, late in about a 5 win season for the Vikings. The game may even have been out of reach, I can't remember. I just remember the Vikings were about on their own 30, and ran a screen play to a running back. They catch the Steelers in a stunt, so the rb has some room, gets well downfield, 50 yards or so, before the Steelers dbs cut him off, or try to, because Carter, in his mid 30s, on his last contract, is busting his a$$ down there, throwing two or three blocks. I swear, a play in a nothing game, late in a nothing season, might be one of my favorite offensive plays that I have seen in too many decades of watching the Vikings play.

If this bunch can rally 'round the flag, and finish the season with a halfway effective charge, with bayonets fixed, I'll tip my hat to them.

21
by BroncFan07 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:44pm

Two weeks in a row, Bennie Fowler has failed to come up with a tough but makeable catch late that would potentially have won both games for Denver. Of course, it kind of sums up Denver's entire problem on offense that Bennie Fowler is getting important throws at the end of games.

115
by Grendel13G :: Tue, 12/13/2016 - 1:53am

Yep. The end zone drop this week was pretty bad.

22
by Lebo :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:54pm

I don't know who Mina Kimes is, but she's hilarious. If I did twitter, I'd totally follow her.

23
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 12:58pm

Had been writing for ESPN for a while, not sure what she does now. She's a frequent guest on Bill Barnwell's podcast, and she's quite good...both for the wit and for the football knowledge.

30
by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:28pm

for those who are better at data mining or simply know where to find the stat(s) in convenient form,

what is the list of all time YPC season average for RBs who averaged more than 3 receptions per game? 5 receptions per game?

also, fark you captcha
--------------------------------------
The standard is the standard!

42
by jtr :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:17pm

Here's the list for seasons with 3 rec/game post-merger (I set it as 48 receptions in a season, since I don't think PFR lets you sort by rec/game. I also set a minimum of 100 rush attempts in a season, as that's the qualifying mark for league leader in YPC):

http://pfref.com/tiny/5VSbh
The leader is 2009 Chris Johnson, with 5.6 YPC and just barely over 3 rec/game.

Here's 5 rec/game (ie 80 receptions in the season):

http://pfref.com/tiny/ntuBf
Not terribly surprising, prime Marshall Faulk sweeps the top three.

51
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:48pm

I totally forgot how many receptions Priest Holmes got.

Also: Larry Centers was the weirdest blocking FB ever. He was like an early H-back, except he didn't play wide.

100
by Mike B. In Va :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:25pm

Centers won me a fantasy championship one year in a league where RBs got two points per reception, plus yardage. He had one of the quietest very good careers ever, especially considering where he played.

114
by BroncFan07 :: Tue, 12/13/2016 - 12:26am

Larry Centers also lived over by the In-N-Out burger.

54
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:52pm

--dupe caused by forced redirect ad--

36
by Travis :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:53pm

Here's a post-merger list, though you have to mentally remove the many guys who PFR has improperly categorized as running backs. Adding a minimum qualifier for rushing attempts gives you a better picture.

41
by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:13pm

Thanks you two.

So as I suspected, Leveon Bell and David Johnson are basically in the only-Marshall-Faulk was consistently-this-good-since-the-salary-cap territory.

--------------------------------------
The standard is the standard!

47
by runaway robot :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:27pm

Here's another fun Lev Bell fact:

Most Scrimmage Yds - Player's 1st 10 Gms of Season
1963 Jim Brown 1,704
2016 Le'Veon Bell 1,616
1975 O.J. Simpson 1,609

Can't vouch personally for the figures; I just copied and pasted from a Steelers fan board.

80
by ammek :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:02pm

Seeing Lionel Train James and Gary Anderson in there reminds me of why the Chargers were, for a time, my second team, and why I still have a soft spot for them in spite of all the Spanosery.

Spectacular and varied as the offense was, those mid-1980s San Diego defenses were far worse than the 2000 Vikings or 0-16 Lions, although they weren't soft, just exorbitantly young and out of their depth.

A post-merger Best Of San Diego roster would be one of the most talented of any, and almost certainly the most fun to watch. If only Fouts, James, O'Neal, Seau, Tomlinson and Gates could have peaked together!

31
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:37pm

I felt quite confident that, based on a difficult schedule, Tampa was going to have a season where they'd play much better and gel as a team, but still go about 6-10 or so. Really glad to be proved to be a bit of an idiot.

That was really possibly the three worst consecutive plays I've seen as a Bucs fan that didn't involve Josh McCown Josh McCowning the hell out of everything. Huff literally just slaps the ball out of bounds rather than letting it bounce into the end zone right at about the six-inch line. Then, a safety where the corpse of Gosder Cherilus got pushed around, then a punt out of bounds . . . a punt out of bounds, after a safety? Really? Bryan Anger pinning two punts inside the three in the fourth quarter makes up for it, as that was a huge thing.

Nobody on the Tampa offense was sharp at all in that game; Martin was boom or bust, there was no consistent passing game, and Winston had his "score a TD via passing or rushing in every game" streak snapped when he threw behind an open Russell Shepard in the end zone and Vonn Bell knocked it away. Vonn Bell, a safety, a position of need for Tampa in the offseason, who was drafted by the Saints a few slots after the Bucs traded up to draft a kicker.

Every time Roberto Aguayo lines up to kick it's astoundingly stressful, because every time he misses I become irrationally angry at drafting up to trade a kicker.

Keith Tandy has always been an athletically limited backup safety for the few years he's been on the roster, and has been the guy not good enough to beat out Chris Conte. Two games in a row, he's had the game-sealing interception, and he was also responsible for making a break on the ball and tipping it so Hargreaves could get his first pick. I don't know if he's actually any good or is just having an unexpected bout of good luck, but I do know he's not Chris Conte, and that has to be a good thing, right?

The Saints win this if they don't drop two TD passes that hit the receivers right in the hands. Brees wasn't great, but he was better than the statline says.

Also, when did Charles Davis become good at color commentary? I recall him being completely awful when he started, but he was really good yesterday. Every time Chris Spielman would chime in with his macho crap I'd cringe, but Davis was good at pointing out all sorts of little subtle things like blocking assignments and coverage.

44
by bravehoptoad :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:19pm

I saw Charles Davis for the first time doing SF-Miami, and he was amazing, as in, I learned something cool on every other play. Sometimes he'd be so bursting to say something interesting about how Chip Kelly just shifted his 2nd tight end pre-snap that he'd interrupt some inane play-by-play stuff.

He single-handedly made a game featuring a 1-9 team one of the best I've seen this year.

43
by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:17pm

" because every time he misses I become irrationally angry at drafting up to trade a kicker."

LOL

--------------------------------------
The standard is the standard!

53
by TomC :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:50pm

Also, when did Charles Davis become good at color commentary? I recall him being completely awful when he started

Huh, I've always liked him and don't remember him being very different when he started.

82
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:11pm

thought Charles Davis was good first time I heard ghim do a college football telecast some years bakc. maybe that was 10, 12 yhears ago. something like that.

32
by johonny :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 1:39pm

Mia/Ari This is the worst I felt after a game since Mario blew out his Achilles. I'm pretty sure the Brady rule was put in to protect more than Tom Brady. That no flag was thrown on that play in a game where everything was flagged is disgusting. Worse to hear its the second time that player went knee hunting this season. I expect a Suh sized fine coming down this week, not that it really helps. IDK maybe Matt Moore wins out (doubtful) and they make the playoffs but its looking more like another lost 8-8 9-7 season. The NFL wonders why ratings are down I merely point out the last time the AFC east was won outright by another team not called the Patriots it was won by a team no longer in the division. It's hard to get all worked up season after season of predictable bland football. AFC east update Pats) Let's face it they won the division since camps opened. 2) Mia- I think Moore wins one of three and they lose a tie breaker for the wild card (yes I think 9-7 might get the last wild card but only might) 3) Bill-I think they got a good chance to win out and feel like Miami very bitter of another pointless season. 4) Jets-did they really want to come back and win this week? They needs a QB to start rebuilding around. I assume Miami is now on the QB clock come offseason as Tannehill won't likely start week 1 :(

39
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:12pm

Apparently the Dolphins announced it's an ACL sprain, not a tear. Still means he's done for the season, but it's good news as far as next season goes.

60
by James-London :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:00pm

If it is a sprain that's good news. Put Tannehill on IR in any event but at least you can plan for next season with him ready to go on day one next yea, and Tannenbaum's less likely to trade for Cutler; which won't stop him doing something else equally dumb.

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

64
by RickD :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:09pm

With only 3 games left there really isn't a good reason to not put Tannehill on the IR. Gase is saying that he'll definitely miss "more than one game". I hope nobody is thinking of having him suit up for Week 17. That's a good way to beg for an ACL tear. As you say, if they put him on the IR now, he'll be back in game shape next Summer, but a completely blown ACL would make recovery much, much harder.

72
by James-London :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:33pm

I can't fathom circumstances where Tannehill plays again this year. In the unlikely eveny Miami are playing late in January, are you going to sit Moore for a guy with a bum knee who hasn't played for weeks?

IR and have him ready to go next year.

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

105
by johonny :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 6:21pm

I've not heard anything about IR. I think they'll keep him active until they're eliminated from the playoffs. The worse would be to start him week 17 injured in an RG3 situation...but so many writers have thrown out the comparison I doubt Miami would risk it unless he was truly healthy.

107
by mehllageman56 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 7:51pm

The Jets defense certainly celebrated that fourth down stop in overtime, so I think they decided they want to win, perhaps sometime in the second half. As opposed to the business decisions made last Monday night.

I agree they need a quarterback to rebuild around, but the only guy worthy of that is Trubisky, and the Niners will take him. That's assuming he comes out. Everyone else with potential doesn't deserve to be drafted in the first round. Jets fans griping about winning late and moving down the draft board need to time travel back to 2014, and kidnap Geno before he beat Tennesee and Miami. The upper part of this draft isn't worth tanking for, except Trubisky, Myles Garrett and maybe the Alabama defensive tackle Jonathan Allen. And if the Jets draft him they'll need secret service protection for the entire organization.

108
by mehllageman56 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 7:54pm

And oh yeah, Johonny, sorry about Tannehill. Hope he does come back as good next year. I agree with your point about no flag as well. As bad as Mark Sanchez was, it seemed he never got the protection Peyton and Brady got. Against the colts in the playoffs one year somebody cheapshotted Sanchez on a hand off and the refs called offensive holding. It needs to be a general rule, not just for a few superstars.

40
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:13pm

Yesterday was a kind of final straw for me as a colts fan. I'm not ready to bail on the team permanently or anything - but its so frustrating to watch a perennially soft team over and over again. The epitome of the game was the final 4th and 1 play. That call tells me you have no faith in your line to block for 1 yard or to hold up in pass pro long enough to have their receivers uncover.

Sometimes, its talent and sometimes its a coaching philosophy that runs through the entire organization.

46
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:23pm

Being a fan of a soft team is the worst, worst, worst, regardless of w-l record. The 2000 Vikings team that made the conference championship, and almost had playoff HFA, is the Vikings teams that I have hated the most, even more than the 1984 Les Steckel debacle. The 1984 team just mutinied against a completely incomepetent head coach. The 2000 team, oline in decline, while Culpepper flung it up to Moss and Carter, defense populated by marshmallows, was disgusting to watch.

56
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:55pm

There are Lions and Browns fans on this board. By comparison, yours are first-world problems, like your caviar being insufficiently spherical.

I'm concerned that Cleveland has a real shot to match Detroit's overfeated season.

61
by RickD :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:05pm

I thought getting the Bengals at home was their best shot. They have to go to Buffalo, then home for the Chargers, and they finish at Pittsburgh. While the Bills and Chargers are out of the playoff race, neither would be considered a very bad team. And the Steelers are likely going to need to win their Week 17 game to get into the playoffs.

63
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:09pm

I've actually been rooting for Cleveland to win a game, because that 0-16 season is ours, dammit! There's something nice about having singular accomplishments, even if they're singularly awful.

68
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:15pm

I don't think there's much of a chance Cleveland wins a game this year; they've only lost by one score or less in four games, and are basically functionally awful in every possible way. It's OK, Detroit fans; you'll always have "Dan Orlovsky running out the back of the end zone" to keep you warm.

75
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:45pm

Thinking about Dan Orlovsky doesn't keep me warm. He terrifies me. He's currently the backup. When I heard Stafford dislocated his middle finger, I had terrifying visions a Packers d-lineman chasing Orlovsky out the back of the endzone, losing the game by two points, and ending the Lions' playoff hopes.

83
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:12pm

Orlovsky is still our backup.

Orlovsky could still start for Cleveland.

67
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:14pm

True. Though there are many flavors of heartbreak. Take my 49er friends. They emotionally checked out of the season a while back so even an embarrassing loss like yesterdays didn't do much.

The browns deserve this. I don't think the head coach or the players have quit, but the organization made a decision to tank this season. They should get what they deserve.

73
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:34pm

I will maintain forever that the 2000 Vikings had the worst defense in NFL history. I don't care what Browns and Lions fans say.

88
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:21pm

The 2000 Rams were probably an even more extreme version of those Vikings.

A historically good offense that had to manage to outscore its historically bad defense. They lost two games in which they scored 34 or more.

2004 KC has a shot, too. That offense was as good or better than the 13-3 team in 2003, but the defense fell off a cliff.

95
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:29pm

Boy, I'd forgotten that the Rams went from #3 defense by DVOA in 1999, to 27, in 2000.

98
by Damon :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:44pm

Well, in DVOA era (1989-2015) Football Outsiders had the 2000 Vikings as the 2nd worst defense behind the 2015 Saints and not to be outdone, the 2004 defense was 6th worst.

78
by apk3000 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:56pm

Never underestimate the Chargers' ability to lose in the most perplexing way possible!

66
by Damon :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:12pm

That whole Culpepper/Moss 2000-2004 era was like that though, it was the equivalent to the Lakers in NBA having Kobe Bryant waste 3 years in his prime dragging around Smush Parker (the defense), Kwame Brown (the special teams) and Chris Mihm (Mike Tice coaching).

How they screwed up draft after draft on defense with the exception of Kevin Williams still baffles me.

69
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:16pm

Kobe didn't help the cause by being a huge pain in the ass to deal with. It took Phil Jackson's coaching to coax enough unselfish play out of Kobe to get them to win. For all the plaudits Kobe gets and deserves, he was never an efficient player - as evidenced by his generally low shooting percentage.

70
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:19pm

I tend to think of them screwing up more on offense than defense; they drafted the incredibly inconsistent Michael Bennett, the incredibly inconsistent Bryant McKinnie, the incredibly inconsistent Percy Harvin, the, well, awful Troy Williamson . . . it's one thing to draft just plain bad guys you're willing to move on from, but inconsistent guys who you just keep around waiting for the light to come on, those are the ones that drive you crazy.

The Vikings drafted a lot of guys who felt like they could have been good, but weren't consistently. Oh, and Kevin Williams, who was great.

71
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:32pm

By 2003 the Vikings o-line was back on the upswing, Birk in his near-HOFpeak, Mckinnie playing effectively before he decided to scarf down 72 donuts a day. Williams, as you note, being a monster at d-tackle. They got lucky on Williams, since they wanted to draft Ryan Sims, but screwwd up the pick.

After they drafted Chris Doleman, they didn't draft a good defensive end until Brian Robison, who has had an underrated career. They were unlucky with Kenechi Udeze, who was more effective than his sack totals showed, before being diagnosed with cancer.

74
by big10freak :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:42pm

Ted Thompson's worst draft track record is with d-linemen. He screws up most first round chances when drafting defensive linemen but then will get a Mike Daniels in the 4th round. This year he may have done it again in the 4th round as Dean Lowrey (from Northwestern of all places) has really come on in being able to use his hands and get pressure.

All the measureables in the world won't tell you if this guy can keep an o-lineman from locking him up. Daniels was undersized for his position but what onlookers missed is that there are no handles on a bowling ball.

104
by ZDNeal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:59pm

The best use of a D draft pick in recent Vikings history was trading it for Jared Allen. Between him and Williams/Sims the Vikings owe KC a share of that 2009 NFC title game appearance.

52
by big10freak :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:48pm

On a minor note likely only resonating with Packers fans I am just completely bewildered that it took the Packers coaching staff apparently 2.5 years on how to use Jeff Janis on offense.

As a quick refresher, Janis is the guy who caught the two desperation passes against the Cards last season in the playoff game. Janis is pretty fast, strong for a receiver, has ok hands but apparently cannot run a proper route even with a map and directional arrows painted on the grass.

He has been a special teamer whiz but little else. I guess desperate times call for desperate measures as MM finally determined that maybe a jet sweep might be a Janis contribution. Last two weeks 2 rushes for almost 40 yards.

Better later than never

65
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:12pm

Outside of the "OK hands" portion, he and Cordarelle Patterson should maybe hang out together sometime.

76
by big10freak :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:45pm

It could take days for them to find each other.

77
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:52pm

They really need to get on the same team, so the o-coordinator can show jet sweep motion from both ends of the line of scrimmage on each play. Once in a while they could have a head-on collision behind the qb, just to really confuse the defense. Yes, I know this would be against the rules. I DON'T CARE!!!!!!

85
by big10freak :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:14pm

On a separate but somewhat related note I do not understand why MM does not once a game use Janis or Davis to run a fly route and have Rodgers heave one downfield. Not every pass has to be guaranteed success. Mike wastes challenges, timeouts and runs by James Starks. Why he cannot bring himself to have number 12 air one out every so often puzzles me.

90
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:24pm

So long as they lie motionless for more than one second, it's legal, isn't it?

One of them can even writhe, so long as it's backwards.

94
by MilkmanDanimal :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:29pm

The main problem I have with this idea is I'm not sure Patterson knows which way "backwards" even is.

101
by Mike B. In Va :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:37pm

Damn, that was awesome.

55
by DGL :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:54pm

How long until some clever HC has a defender throw a shoulder pad into the opponent's long snapper's knee on the first PAT attempt of a key game, exchanging a meaningless 15-yard penalty on the kickoff for (literally) crippling the opposition's punting and placekicking for the rest of the game?

58
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:58pm

Don't give Harry Douglas any ideas.

59
by Bright Blue Shorts :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:00pm

I guess John Harbaugh might see that as innovation after his abuse of the holding rules on end of game 4th downs.

But players generally have a code that avoid completely cheapshots because if you did that someone returns the favour. Most of the renowned cheapshot artists do it in the grey areas of the rules like during returns or late hitting.

Remember how Schiano's Tampa team really didn't want to have to contest those kneeldowns.

57
by RickD :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 2:57pm

" Hilariously, Doug Pederson just challenged an incomplete pass to Jamison Crowder in hopes of having the outcome reversed to a catch and fumble."

Jay Gruden was the one who threw the challenge flag there, not Doug Pederson. It was pretty obviously not an incomplete pass. It was also obvious that Crowder was down before the ball came out. It was one of those reversals that were so obvious that one wonders why the officials blew it in the first place.

87
by Kurt :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:19pm

On top of that, when Crowder lost the ball it stayed right in front of him and he immediately covered it up; even if it had been ruled a fumble Washington would have kept the ball.

62
by Southern Philly :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:05pm

"Crowder did make the catch, but was then down by contact before he lost the ball, so we got the outstanding result of an incomplete pass being overturned into a 33-yard completion because of a successful challenge by the DEFENSE."

Incorrect. Gruden challenged that play.

79
by James-London :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 3:59pm

Wow. Fisher's gone. Thought he was indestructible. I guess yesterday was the last straw

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

81
by TomC :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:07pm

Holy crap!

In other news, I have opened the sewer cap on my corner, dropped the end of a big dryer hose down the hole, connected the other end to a pump in my bank account, and turned on the motor.

Can ownership fire itself now?

84
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:12pm

now J. Fisher wll coach defense for some team. maybe become interim head coach in some future year or maybe never be nfl hea coacg again

86
by Will Allen :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:19pm

It's hard to imagine, but I do think he was a not bad coach in the 1st half of his career. Man, did he ever devolve, though. When it was credibly reported after the opener that the Rams had done such a crappy job at quality control that the Niners knew every Rams play in advance simply by personnel, down and distace, and formation, you knew total collapse had arrived.

Talk about phonin' it in!

89
by dmstorm22 :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:24pm

I actually think his Titans tenure is underrated to some degree. He had to deal with a near unprecedented level of change with the team moving from Houston to Memphis to Nashville (believe they played at Vandy stadium one year).

The peak Titans went 13-3, 13-3, 11-5, 12-4 in a 5-year span, made a Super Bowl, AFC Title Game, and lost two very close divisional games to the eventual Super Bowl winner (they really could have beaten the 2003 Patriots).

Even in 2008, that team overachieved.

Personally, he seemed to not care at all the past couple years. Hard to really judge people off of Hard Knocks, but he seemed to be by far the least impressive, least engaged coach from recent years.

93
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:28pm

I made this comment in the other thread. He was a good coach, but his philosophy really hindered the team because the running game has been in decline for a long time now. Running isn't just less efficient than passing, it has itself become less efficient over time in comparison to the past. This trend basically accelerated anyone who stood by the edict of run the ball to establish .

99
by Mr Shush :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:02pm

I would be perfectly happy if Houston forwent the forward pass entirely for the remainder of the season...

102
by ammek :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:38pm

The Rams are running on less than 39% of offensive plays this season. Sure, they're playing from behind a lot, but equally, they're starting Keenum/Goff at QB. Also, as noted, the Rams have invested lots of draft value in their passing offense in recent years, but the players have not panned out. Fisher is clearly doing a poor job of preparing his team, but for this season at least he has not been running the kind of throwback offense of which he is often accused.

103
by theslothook :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 5:48pm
91
by jtr :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:26pm

If this ends up being his last HC gig, then he'll end his career tied for the most losses in NFL history. That he ends up disappointingly tying the record, rather than outright claiming it, is perhaps the most Jeff Fisher thing he's ever done.

92
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:28pm

Wonder if Lane Kiffin will leave Florida Atlantic after a whole day for that job.

97
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 4:31pm

I thought he was bulletproof, too. However, I was thinking that if any single game could get him, it would be yesterday's performance by the Rams, who looked utterly unprepared to play a football game. There may be plenty of owners who are indifferent to winning as opposed to making profit, but no owner wants to be embarrassed.

On another note, I pity the poor soul who will be the interim coach and has to prepare to play a pissed off Seahawks team in 3 days.

110
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 8:11pm

pretty sure if orica jumped over stone wall to freedom it would drop dead. that wouyld mean it jumped over some wall at sea woirld or something. doing that to g o into another pool at sea world wouldn't accompli9syh snything. tyhen if oprca jumped over stone wall to outside body of water, pretty sure it would be jumping into Florida pond. would die due to type of water. snf woulfd get stuck in Florida underwater plants like lilly pads and other crap. next thing orca would know it is getting bitten by alligators or maybe a python

113
by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Mon, 12/12/2016 - 9:37pm

All of those things make perfect metaphors for what usually usually happens when the Texans call a pass play.