Talk amongst yourselves
9/1: Updated ADP data.
8/31: Updated at 3 p.m. EDT with further final cuts.
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09 Sep 2009
Finally! Talk about the Week 1 games here.
Posted by: Bill Barnwell on 09 Sep 2009
129 replies , Last at
15 Sep 2009, 9:24am by
Fnor, did you ever add SSL support to your server, and if so, what port?
Wow, quiet tonight
Yeah. Is nobody else watching the game?
well, I had to hunt for where this was, so maybe people just don't realize where the discussion is now.
Nice look off by Ben there... followed by a nice td pass.
Poor Rob Bironas, had 2 chances for the first points of the year.
Interesting contrast for the last 2 minutes compared to the first 28.
Hilarious Favre commercial for Sears.
Yeah, that was pretty awesome. Say what you will about Favre, but he has a great track record of giving monosyllabic acting performances in funny material.
...So, he's got that going for him.
Wondering where the usual bunch of commenters is.
Wondering where Fisher's defensive adjustment is. Roethlisberger has been passing with relative ease.
It's nice to stop the run, but the Titans let the Steelers march down the field with the passing game the last three drives of the game.
I know it's only one game of one week, but that DVOA projection for the Titans' special teams looks scarily accurate tonight. I hereby suspend my misgivings about the other odd-seeming projections until further informed.
If the (#7 projected) Colts Special Teams are good Sunday, I'll never doubt DVOA again (at least not on STs).
Saw the 4th quarter and OT of this one. Big Ben was great. The O-line did a decent job on pass protection when the Titans rushed four (I imagine that's where the Titans will miss Haynesworth), giving him time to pick apart the zone, and when the Titans' pass rush did get through, he was very quick to check down for 7-8 yard pickups. The defense looked good too, but the Titans have no receivers and an average-at-best QB, so any weaknesses were probably well hidden.
An encouraging first game, though, at any rate, assuming that Polamalu wasn't seriously injured.
The Steelers offense moves only when they pass, pass, pass, and then only when they operate out of the shotgun. You get the sense that the lingering feeling that we're the Steelers and we have to run the ball, dammit, is holding them back from their fairly obvious optimal offense operating out of a shotgun base with mostly Mewelde Moore at RB.
Just relying on Roethlisberger to drive them down the field at the end of each half worked great last year, but with Polamalu out at least a month, they may find themselves giving up a few too many points to get away with that now. This offense needs to open up a little. They can't run the ball, period, and the sooner they accept it and let Roethlisberger throw 30 or 35 times a game, the better they'll be for it.
The game was won up front in the end - give Ben enough time and he started picking the Titans apart pretty easily. Was it a tired Titans pass rush? Bad scheming from Fisher? Or excellent protection? Either one, it was a shadow of the 1st quarter where Ben was getting pummelled. Kudos for Ben for getting the job done with some nice pump fakes and generally being quite accurate.
Titans could feel a little unlucky. If Bironas kicks those 2 FGs it could have been quite different. They certainly deserved to have been leading at the half, but couldn't capitalise on their superior start. Collins played pretty well for me, and was let down by a couple of drops by Gage. Pity Jared Cook wasn't playing as he could have made a few interesting matchups out there instead of constantly throwing to Scaife and sometimes Crumpler.
Does anyone else the Vegas lines might not be taking into account the power of the Schwartz? If they're right on all other factors, that would make the Lions underrated, right?
I'm not planning on putting any money on them, but I will be pulling for the Lions and their statistically inclined coach. Will he win? Who knows? The 49ers stink and they're the only team that I know uses stats to help them in the draft.
I don't think the 49ers use stats to help them in the draft. And there are most definitely other teams that do.
Bill, any chance of getting the full +/- 5% list posted on the site before 1:00? It would be greatly appreciated!
The football team from my geographic area is superior to the football team from your geographic area. We will win and you will lose.
Very hard for me argue with that... (living in the UK)
Perhaps I should be lnyched for bringing up Favre, but I really like the Sears commercial with him buying a tv.
Be sure to join a star-studded cast of your favorite FO posters for another season of IRC football chat! Server: bendenweyr.dyndns.org, channel #fo
Brief tutorials for the IRC-shy:
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- enter #fo as the channel, pick a nick, hit go
Brees has picked up where he left off.
The new RedZone channel is perfect for those with ADD - you're basically giving someone else the remote and decide what you get to see.
But no commercials. And lacking Sunday Ticket on FiOS, it's not a horrible thing.
Any non-US readers have NFL Gamepass and actually able to get the games?
I have been watching the crappy NFL Network content ok all week, checked half an hour before kickoff and everything was ok. As soon as the games roll round I am kicked out and the service has completed vanished, no response from https://gamepass.nfl.com at all.
So stuck with no games and $240 out of pocket. Thanks NFL!
field pass radio is working in the UK.
I am having exactly the same problems. Got on to see the first half hour after hitting refresh a lot and now can't get near the site at all. I have tried sending in an live help complaint but..
Same problem here in France. I watched the first 20 minutes, then bam, my browser crached and when I restarted it, I can only rarely get to the login page and never past that. Once, I tried to login and it told me I was in a restricted territory (hmm, is France a US outlying territory? Dunno, but I think "non"...); each other attempt leaves me with a "la connexion a échouée" message.
Yeah, same shit here. Not really acceptable, frankly. I seem to remember this is often a problem near the start of the season.
I need to talk to cadillac's surgeon. He looks amazing.
Uh, yeah. Frankly, if he has a good year and stays healthy, I can handle the expected lousy Bucs season. He deserves it after all the crap he's been through.
Then again, Ward's looked really good as well. I'm torn between being pleasantly surprised that Tampa's offense actually has looked good and thinking that Dallas' defense must be stinking awful.
Jake Delhomme so far has thrown an INT and had a fumble taken back for a TD. It's like 2008 never ended for him.
Billick and his lackey are making my ears bleed. "Darren" Bevell? Calling a touchdown-negated post-challenge field goal an extra point?
I may be forced to turn off the commentary and let the bare competence of these two teams speak for themselves.
Hey, Detroit still sucks.
Edit: Wait, they get the ball deep in Saints territory on a Bush punt return fumble, and Stafford throws a pick on the next play and it comes back 50 yards, plus a 15-yarder on top of that for somebody on the bench running into an official. Detroit still REALLY sucks.
I went online to the NFL's contractor's site (neulion.com). I waited 15 minutes for my online chat request to be answered.
The person that finally did answer put in this response:
NFL Field Pass: We are aware of an issue related to slow page loads on NFL.com related sites - that issue should be resolved if you can try logging in again.
Then they disconnected directly, before I could even communicate with them.
Needless to say (perhaps), logging in again still doesn't work.
Having a lot of fun watching this Eagles game. But...as I say that McNabb's gone down holding a knee - oh crap. Anyway was just asking myself why the Panthers hadn't tried a couple more screens and then they try one that picked by Akeem Jordan. Pick #3 for Jake - but hey at least he's getting paid well for them...
Looked like it was McNabb's lower back. Hopefully he doesn't have the same back surgeon as Shawn Andrews.
Is it just me or is this the week of the shitty (tight end) player. Im skimming over the stats and every awful player i can think of is putting up a good week via luck or actually playing good. Dwayne bowe is awful. But wait.... 2 yard touchdown pass. Now hes decent after 1 retarded play. Shockey??? wtf. Brent celek now theres a superstar. NOT. Roy "1 year wonder" williams for 60 yards! I can only imagine that it was blown coverage. Im being honest when i say i could probably cover him 1 on 1. Jamal lewis. BOOYAH. Gotta love one of the worst players in the league putting up a solid 5 yards per carry. Ill probably get homer fans from all these players talking their players up but its only a matter of time before they remember that they arent good players. They arent even decent players. Someone get me a tissue cause i cant stop crying. I waited 8 months for this?!
Why hasn't Reggie Bush been cut yet?
Adrian Peterson is ridiculous.
That run was amazing to watch, even taking into account the bad tackling.
At halftime I sent my father the following mocking message about his Vikings: "Purple Jesus=ineffective and Sir Almighty Penis=Captain Checkdown." (I think it's obvious enough who the latter is but why is a long story.)
I shall not ever again mock Adrian Peterson.
SCREW YOU KELLEN WINSLOW
Gus Johnson just put the bar out of reach on that ridiculous Broncos TD.
I switched to a different game literally right before that play. @#$!!!!
Ahh, the Bengals.
So far the Seahawks game has had a fumbled kickoff, a dropped TD pass and a pick in the endzone and the game is 3 plays old. NFL fever!
Since then there have been personal foul penalties, another Seahawks fumble which led to a 3rd and long play where the Rams couldn't snap the ball and 2 time outs burned on back to back play and then a completely wasted challenge... Sheesh.
Yep I'm watching Rams-Hawks too trying to see if the FO Rams might be the unstoppable juggernaut in the NFC West. It's been an awful display by both sides so far, it's a shame there has to be a winner in the NFC West really.
Maybe you had to be there?
/I need an Incognito jersey
//I love how he plays
I watched the game on TV, and throughout the first half I thought the crowd kept the Seahawks in the game. The defense looked like it was getting pushed around, and the offense was doing next to nothing with the ball. They were a boneheaded Rams penalty (12 men on the field) away from going into halftime tied 7-7.
And then Mora must have given them a heck of a halftime speech, because they finally got their act together. And the Rams suddenly remembered that they're the Rams. Unfortunately, the Seahawks are not going to have the luxury of playing like crap in the first half all season and they're not going to be playing the Rams each week.
There were absolutely some pluses: Julius Jones ran hard, Forsett gives an amazing change of pace . . . and Burleson looks like he was never injured. There was a nice 4th quarter pass rush, which is hard to muster. And the play where Seneca came on the field and then caught the pass from Hasselbeck was magic (too bad it was snuffed out by Hasselbeck with an INT).
It was just an odd feeling: I watched a 28-0 blowout and thought, "they could absolutely lose in SF next week if they play like this again."
The 'boneheaded penalty' might have had something to do with the kick block and subsequent return. It wasn't a guy getting caught trying to get off the field, they actually rushed twelve guys.
I'm a Skins fan, but I think Moss should have been tossed there (for punching Cory (Corey?) Webster. Instead nothin' but offsetting penalties.
Good job. Still sucks.
Anyone else get a laugh out of the fact that Denver won the game on an 87 yard TD pass with 20 seconds remaining from arguably the weakest-armed QB in the league to arguably the slowest WR in the game?
Yeah, that's probably not happening again. Dhani Jones almost caught him, for god's sake.
1) Who was doing play-by-play for the national broadcast of Jacksonville-Indianapolis? He was quite good at mentioning how many DBs were on the field.
2) Freeney was way too much for Monroe to handle. So to speak.
3) Does Del Rio not trust any of his backup halfbacks? The only guy I remember relieving MJD was backup FB Montel Owens.
DeAngelo Hall continues to suck in coverage, but still coming up with the big play. This time he got beat by Steve Smith, but the ball was tipped and the ball just fell like a snowflake into his arms...
Richie Incognito has to get some kind of recognition for this display...
I find it interesting that Baltimore went for it on 4th & goal from the 1, up by a touchdown with 36 seconds left, having failed to convert it the play before. Why would you NOT kick the field goal there for the essentially automatic win? The only thing the touchdown really did was cause them to beat the spread in bizarre fashion.
Seriously, that move really pissed me off.
Because Harbaugh wanted to cover, of course...
Actually, I think it is the smart play. With a field goal you can have a botched snap or blocked kick returned for a TD, whereas if they fail to run it in KC has to go 99 yards with no time outs. KC already blocked a kick for a TD earlier, so that was probably on harbaugh's mind.
Why is Al Michaels wearing such a horrible rug?
Jay Cutler looks completely dazed and confused. Not exploiting obvious blitzes, tries to throw two picks, succeeds on his third attempt. He better get it together
Its not helping that the Bears line is absolutely terrible.
This feels like a preseason game from both quarterbacks. Rodgers is overthrowing receivers downfield. Cutler is throwing to the other team.
Chicago makes the right decision in going for it. Cutler gets it with the sneak, and hits Hester with a bomb for a TD on the next play.
10-9 Green Bay.
Woodson, Harris, Hawk, Matthews, Bigby...
The Green Bay defense leads the league in hair.
fake punt and they're stopped!
4th and 11 in a two point game
odd call by Chicago
Michaels: "And Lovie's thrown the challenge flag."
Collinsworth: "Maybe on his own call."
Lovie with his second challenge of the game, this time saying Clay Matthews did not get off the field before the snap.
I'm tired of the announcers saying that there was no upside in the quick snap attempt (if it had worked). The upside is that you get a free chance to try a fake punt.
It was weird. The punter didn't even try to pretend it was a bad snap or anything.
That is true but you do need to pick up 11 yards. I dont know what the odds of that are, but it seems to me you need to be pretty damn sure its free.
And even if you pick up the first down, you're still way out of field goal range. There's not much upside to the move.
Well yeah. It was a dumb play poorly executed but it wasn't quite as dumb as the announcers made it out to be.
Sorry double post.
urgh, blown call right there kills Green Bay.
"Illegal contact" and an undeserved automatic first down for Chicago.
Specifically, Hester lined up one yard back of the LOS, leaving the tackle uncovered (but no call!), causing the official that threw the flag to think that the contact occurred six yards deep (instead of five).
Unless Green Bay can drive down the field for the winning score, a blown call will have decided the outcome of tonight's game.
TOUCHDOWN GREEN BAY!
Rodgers goes deep to a wide open Jennings. Play action pass on 3rd and 1.
and they're going for two
They make it.
Jennings just roasted Nathan Vasher.
Cutler throws one to Harris and that's it!
So to put this in perspective, is the Chicago line really bad or is the GB defense really good? Of course there is the wussy option of it being the combination of the two...
Cant it be that Cutler and especially forte are massively overrated? Forte is a below average runningback getting the bulk of the touches (last year). Like i have said all summer.... forte makes the bears offensive line look bad by being ineffective on a per play basis.
Give it more weeks to develop before ripping my head off ladies.
Well I think ALL the Bears offense sucked. Cutler was probably their best player, maybe Earl Bennett - and that's damning with faint praise. There was no running push, little protection and the WRs made some awful route running errors as Collinsworth pointed out on a few of Cutler's bad plays.
In fact, by the end I kinda felt bad for Cutler because he'll be the easy target for the loss. Plus I was getting a little sick of all the smoke being blown up the Aaron Rodgers/Green Bay tailpipe this week (including half the FO staff seemingly picking GB for the Super Bowl haha), so I found it a bit easier to support the Bears.
Yeah I thought it was noticeable that Bill Barnwell — the writer who covers the NFC North — was one of the few Outsiders not getting overexcited about the Pack. His chapter in FOA identified the offensive line as a problem, and going from last night it sure looks like one.
I thought Collinsworth called a good game — it's rare to get insight on WRs, as color commentators tend to be ex-QBs or offensive line specialists.
They sucked in the first half, but improved a lot in the second. I'd give the responsibility for the first half sucking to 1) the blocking, 2) Cutler, and 3) the receivers/runners, in that order. It was interesting that a couple of the biggest route running errors came from the one guy with experience, Desmond Clark, not going where he should on Cutler's first interception or on the near touchdown pass in the back of the end zone. Still, Cutler never should've thrown that pass on the first interception (or on his 3rd int, or on a couple of the near ints).
The protection improved in the 2nd half and Cutler looked better when he had more time to stand in the pocket and throw the ball. The announcers, who overall did a pretty good job, noticed that he was looking more poised standing in the pocket, but they never pointed out that this was because his line was finally giving him a pocket.
I'm just curious to know if it's a fact that offensive lines take some time working together to become good. There was a lot of terrible play by the offensive lines in this game - granted, the defenses are good and coached well, but I was just stunned at how QB's on both sides were running for their lives and that at critical moments the run game lacked any sort of push.
I'm also curious to know if these lines - for both teams - really have the potential to become that good.
Off-topic: I also saw Philadelphia and Carolina today. I'm an Eagles fan and I was worried about the line but not worried about the defense. Yes, fumbles and kick returns are random events that count as luck, I think I remember you guys saying. But wow, that felt good.
I think the refs do not understand the so-called "Brady rule". Vince Wilfork was just flagged for what would have ordinarily been thought to be a normal hit.
Agree. Bad call.
Was he blocked into the quarterbacks legs? No. Is that where he tackled him? Yes. Life's tough, he's paid millions. He can figure it out.
And Thomas deserved that one too. What an idiot.
> Is that where he tackled him?
Last time I checked, the waist is not considered part of the legs.
If you're tackling someone and your face is in his nuts, you're diving at his legs.
/You dirty cheater.
Nuts are also not part of the legs and its only the knees and below that is a no-no.
Naw, there are a lot of rules. When people bitch about shit like this, what they're usually saying is Favre and Brady should be treated like fine china, but open season on the other guys without that NFL Icon status. Brady gets the tuck rule, but for Shaun Hill "It's really a fumble and the officials should realize at somepoint it's football." Screw that. Clowns calling games only encourage that ... I'm tempted to call it "thinking."
Granted, the rules are what they are, and they may be byzantine or simply ill-concieved. But if that's too much of a burden for highly paid professional football players, perhaps a regular job is more their speed. Good luck with that.
If people want open season on the quarterbacks, at least that viewpoint has the virtue of consistancy. But let's remember what that did to the careers of some of the other rare talents. Combine that with the players size and speed now? Well, Brady would already be retired.
The squishy millionaire, of his own volition, dove for a guys legs, hit his knees in the process of burying his face in his nuts. Because of the privilege of the man's position, it is a no no. He can eat his 15 and new downs.
I agree with you that Thomas has to stop when the officials blow the whistle, but if you're going to penalize Wilfork's hit, you might as well just blow the whistle whenever there's a defensive player coming unabated to the quarterback. (EDIT: and let the Steelers renege on Big Ben's contract extension.)
Agreed. I thought there was a case for the Thomas scoop slam, though the commentators were harping the wrong issue (the slam itself, not the timing). I saw nothing wrong with what Wilfork did.
Why, McKelvin, why? (Patriots run out the hands team but kick it deep; McKelvin fields the ball with his teammates in position to recover an onside kick and turns the ball over while trying to get a good return.)
TD Watson (pending what should be a formality of a review), to give the Patriots the late lead.
Fumble! why oh why would anyone bring that out of the end zone anyway?
Running it back isn't a bad idea because, with 2:06 on the clock, you can eat up the 2 minute warning. Fumbling? Well, that's just magic beans for you.
If that was his goal, why not just stand in the end zone without taking a knee? Heck, move to the back corner. That way the Patriots have to run that much farther to get to you, and you just take a knee when they get close.
Could you really run off 6 seconds that way? Seems like a long time to me given that the clock only starts when the ball is caught.
I'd say 2 maybe three seconds at the most.
watch the replay. he got the time to the 1:59 mark before he would have been down. I was telling my dad that it would be huge for buffalo to run it past the 2 min mark and he was skeptical. But it was clearly 7 seconds that would have ran off on that return
Whether or not you think he could've wasted the extra time or not, I think the moral of the story isn't so much that you shouldn't run it back in that situation as that you shouldn't drop the ball in that situation.
He brought it out of the endzone to run the clock to under 2 minutes; if he doesn't fumble, it worked perfectly (and would have bought the Bills an extra 40 seconds of running out the clock).
That was his second fumble on a kickoff return of the half, too.
The Bills seem to have a particularly special ability to find new, excruciating ways to lose football games.
On the bright side, they're still not the Bengals.
And Russell starts the season off right. Interception in under 5 minutes...nice
Al Davis suddenly doesnt look completely insane. Lets see if this feeling can persist for 5 minutes.
33 yds to a tie game, let's see what happens...
Small sample size theater:
Michael Bush currently on pace for 407 carries, Darren McFadden on pace for 570.
All tied up. grigg, it lasted at least 10 min :)
How was the Louis Murphy overturned TD different than the Ben Watson TD that was not overturned?
Ball didn't really roll around for Ben?
I think it was a questionable call; to me it seemed that the ball was still under his arm when his ass was flat on the ground.
Ben Watson wears a Patriots jersey?
We've been transported to some kind of bizarro world where the Raiders stuff runs and sack the quarterback!
Not Bizarro World. Norv World.
I think they just showed a guy in the stands wearing a Heyward-Bey jersey.
Is this the worst announcing crew of them all?
"There is no rational reason [Tomlinson]'s not on the field."
I'm getting flashbacks to Theisman-Maguire-Patrick...
WTF? Chargers ran 5 plays after a touchback, and ended up right back where they started after 20 yards of penalties on one down?
This game is so horrible. Bad offense. Bad announcing. San Diego somehow making Oakland look respectible. And constant commericals between all the three and outs and San Diego injuries. And yet I must watch to see how my fantasy week plays out. Damn you Norv Turner! Damn you to hell!
My fantasy team is already screwed, now I just want to drag everyone else down with me.
The one player that really impressed me in the Charger raider game was Chris johnson. This Raider defense had to make raiderjoe happy. They really looked great. Its only 1 week but it has all the implications of being an elite unit this year. Rivers didnt try to force anything and took everything that was given to him. No bad passes from him the whole game and yet the Raider defense outplayed them.
I don't think the raiders will be raideresque this year
Hahahahahahahaha!!!!! Oh my god!
I always like how there's more offense in last minutes of an NFL game than the 3 plus quarters before it. Just see:
San Diego v. Oakland
Cincinnati v. Denver
Tennessee v. Pittburgh
Chicago v. Green Bay
Prevents you from winning.
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