If you're a Football Outsider you're a TRUE player and true players don't stick to one passion only, so here's something else to excite you while you're waiting for the game to start. How about a free $30 chip to play slot machine games for as long as you want?
Talk about the Week 1 games here, starting on Thursday with Minnesota-New Orleans!
Posted by: Bill Barnwell on 07 Sep 2010
465 replies , Last at
15 Sep 2010, 12:12pm by
Mr Shush
1
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Key19 :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 1:30pm
I think the Saints win, and possibly by a significant margin. The Vikings have only gotten worse since the NFC Championship, and the Saints have remained the same for the most part. And since neither team has new tape on each other really, I expect a similar game to what we saw in the NFC Championship. However, without Rice for the Vikes, I see it being more lopsided.
Excited for the game; too bad I will be working for 2/3 of it. But that's why they made DVR.
2
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by bkjsun :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 7:39pm
I think the Vikings will win by running AD as much as possible - the saints can't stop him. Although it hurts not to have Rice, I think the passing game will be successful enough with Harvin having a big game and Berrian getting a couple nice plays. The saints will keep it close until the end but the vikings will protect the lead in the 4th quarter. No way they fumble the game away this time.
3
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 8:42pm
Wooo! Football! Go Sports!
4
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by gryfyn1 (not verified) :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 8:47pm
Is it too early to say 'uh-oh'
5
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 8:49pm
That was quick. I wonder, which is better. 15 yards on the kickoff and increased chance of a touchback, or 1 yard on the PAT and better odds of converting a two point conversion?
18
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:13pm
Obviously a little bit late for this comment, but I was thinking they might try an onside kick since they were kicking off from the 45 yard line.
6
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by D :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 8:49pm
Missed the first drive, can anyone give me an update?
7
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 8:52pm
The Saints are really good at passing the ball. The Vikings are not so good at defending the pass. The Saints had 1 third down and 1 incompletion on the drive.
Saints Screen game apparently not working on the vikes who shut down a WR Screen and one to Bush before Brees over throws on 3rd down for a 3 and out.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by gryfyn1 (not verified) :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 9:03pm
I thought petereson was supposed to be carrying the ball different ala Tiki Barber to solve his fumbling issues -- he's obviously not - so just waiting on the fumbles i guess.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dan :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 9:45pm
Classic Favre.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Zheng :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 9:46pm
Shoulda held on, Brett.
15
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tally :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 9:47pm
Old dog =/= new tricks.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Zheng :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 9:56pm
And I was just going to say the Vikings were having trouble getting the pass game going.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by t.d. :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:02pm
I'm reminded that the Vikings were probably the best team in football last year.
19
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:21pm
pierer thomas do nothing in first half but come alive on this drive in 3rd eriod
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Powers That Be :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:25pm
Saints look great on the first drive of each half - wonder if they'll stall out in the rest of this half like they did in the first.
21
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by underthebus :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:27pm
And Pierre Thomas shows why he's the DVOA darling.
22
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by jimbohead :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:29pm
is it just me or does NO's kickoff and punt coverage unit look really really good?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 4:46am
yup. don't know about the yardage on punts, but the coverage looked really good.
23
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:54pm
I think Kleinsasser did catch it, but they won't overturn because there is no conclusive picture.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big Johnson :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:20am
Big Johnson likes this
52
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by nat :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:47am
That was my first thought, too. Then I thought about it like a referee.
His hands were clearly underneath the ball. But the ball bounces up - and is thus clearly not yet under his control. The only question is this: did the ball touch the turf at all in the process of bouncing off the hands? If it did, it touched the ground before being controlled.
We've gotten used to the idea that the ball can touch the ground and still result in a catch. That's true, but only if the ball is under control at that instant. A bouncing ball is another beast altogether.
So, while it was a close call, I think this wasn't a case of "no conclusive evidence". Simply a close call correctly made.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:59pm
Vikings run defense is a far cry from what it used to be. I'm sure overplaying the pass is a part of it... but this used to never happen. You saw signs of it late last year, too.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 4:47am
Maybe Pat Williams is getting old, I didn't think Leber looked good and as Collinsworth mentioned, those guards are very... very good.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by agauntpanda :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:04pm
Gametracker has Kleinsasser with a tackle... is he playing both sides of the ball, or is that an error? Hutchinson has tackle credit on the Favre INT.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:05pm
Maybe he plays on special teams.,..
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by agauntpanda :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:07pm
Ah, of course
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 6:34am
yeha maybe was spexcial teams tackle. thought maybe he tackled Vilma on int but saw replay again and saw it was Huthcinson who tckle Vilma
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 8:09am
He's not on the play by play with a tackle, nor does he have a tackle in the box score.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by agauntpanda :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:38am
Must have been an error in the CBS game log that they then fixed.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:05pm
Gee, the line was 5 wasn't it?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:22pm
Ballgame.
Who'd have thought the Vikings would lose from their inability to stop the run.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:24pm
What a totally anticlimactic game.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tally :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:25pm
Is it me or was this a surprisingly unexciting game?
32
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:26pm
I thought it was too.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:06am
Yeah. I'm liking less and less the liberalized passing rules.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:26am
So many missed opportunities. Brees gift wrapped the Vikings a pick, and the guy can't hold on. The Saints missed two field goals. Malcom Jenkins can't stay in bounds on his pick. The Kleinsasser non-catch.
A bunch of near big plays.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by johonny (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 10:00am
If this is what two elite teams look like after 4 preseason games, I wonder what they will look like after only 2?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Alexander :: Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:31pm
Vikings cover!
Seriously sloppy game though.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:07am
I thought the Viking's defense looked OK for the most part, but it seemed like sideline routes were there whenever the Saints wanted them (and could hold onto the ball).
Favre did not look so good. I'm not sure exactly what is was, but he just seemed off to me. However, this is probably just rust from not practicing all off season, and he'll be just fine and tear up the Bears later this year.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:11am
I think the Vikings were roughly about where they were around the open of last season except they were playing a much better team (last year was Browns).
There were a couple of times where I felt if they'd just kept running Peterson they could have run them out of the building, but just then they'd get a holding penalty or Childress would put Albert Young in and the drive would sputter.
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My 2 cents
by galactic_dev :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 1:11am
With the final score of 14-9, clearly both defenses dominated two very hyped, high-scoring offenses. When the Saints came out passing right at the start, they cleaved up the Vikings secondary for a quick touchdown. But they wouldn't score again in the first half, despite Brees completing many passes (and them not even bothering to try to run).
The New Orleans special teams reduced the score on both sides, by blocking an extra point and missing two field goals. Without them, the final score would be 20-10.
Favre throws difficult balls to catch, and we watched many Vikings receivers just miss their catches. Bernard Berrian never seemed to be open. Shiancoe (TE) seemed to be the only effective receiver they had.
Sean Payton outcoached the Vikings, by passing almost exclusively in the first half, and then running a ton in the second half, often right through the Williams wall. Eventually the ran out the clock by running for first downs to seal their ugly victory.
The defenses didn't dominate the stats, each giving up plenty of yards and collecting only 1 sack apiece. The only turnover was a Favre interception that he threw while avoiding a sack. But both defenses, under intense pressure, kept the score low and within one possession the entire game. Favre had no magic last drive this time.
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Re: My 2 cents
by Arkaein :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:55pm
Disagree that either defense dominated. If NO makes the first FG and don't drop an open TD the final score is 24-9, and the Vikings D looks anything but dominant. I felt NO's defense was a little more consistent, though they also benefited from Vikings drops and missed throws.
No one can say that the Vikings run D looked dominant they way the Williams Wall was shoved sideways late in the game. Pat Williams in particular just looked old.
I think NO can clean up it's problems more easily over the course of the season, I just doubt they drop that many passes in another game. The Vikings will be in trouble until Sydney Rice returns. The other WRs will probably play better, but Rice is a step above the rest. The backup RB position is clearly a downgrade from Taylor.
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Re: My 2 cents
by Will Allen :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 1:17pm
It is often a mistake to try to read trends from one game. A younger Williams Wall got run on in early 2007, in Dallas, in the 2nd half, when the offense could not sustain drives in the 2nd half. Jimmy Kennedy provides the best depth at defensive tackle, so if he makes it back onto the field soon, that alone may give Pat Williams a better rotation, and more effectiveness. They really need the offense to provide leads in the 2nd half, however. If they can be at 4-4 at midseason, the schedule gets easier, and hopefully they have Rice back. I did not completely jump on the Sidney Rice bandwagon last year, but holy smokes, when he is off the field you really start noticing how lacking in ball skills other Viking receivers are.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Will Allen :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 1:31am
Both qbs seemd to play fairly well, but the receivers for both teams had very mediocre games, it seemed to me.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 2:06am
I agree, though I would probably use a more negative term than "very mediocre."
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Will Allen :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 2:40am
Yeah, for some reason, I was being polite. The receivers for both teams sucked. The only really good play on a ball may have been the Kleinsasser grab that was initially ruled a catch, then overturned by a 2nd Zebra, without conclusive video evidence. The irony is that Kleinsasser is mostly paid to block, not catch, while a guy like Shiancoe is supposed to earn his living with ball skills, and frequently falls short.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by RichC (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 8:50am
Shianco was the only reason the Vikings were even in the game at the end of the first half. He's pretty much the only one Favre was completing passes to.
The saint's defensive plan in the second half was basically "take away Shiancoe"
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Will Allen :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:56am
Yes, Shiancoe had the most balls thrown to him, at least in the first half. He does not consistently display good ball skills, and frequently fails to catch eminently catchable balls. For a guy who is primarily paid to display good ball skills, this is not wonderful.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Will Allen :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:59am
delete repeat
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Bobby Wommack (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:03am
Chilly completely abandoned the running game in the second half. AP only got 18 carries and was running real well. Too bad Chilly had to defer to Favre and let him throw almost 30 times when he clearly wasn't playing well.
Typical Chilly.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Birdman (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:08am
Agreed. Peterson was playing really well, and then Childress just stopped using him.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 10:15am
2 opposite gameplans.
Minnesota: run the ball, pass when we really need to. As if Childress knew that Favre wasn't in rythem yet. Or he's just in love with AD and *shudders* wanted to set. Up. The. Run.
Saints: pass the ball by neutralizing their best pass rusher; run out the clock second half behind your best lineman and dink and dunk.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Birdman (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 9:19am
Both teams left points on the field. The Saints had the two missed field goals and the dropped catch in the end zone. The Vikings had the Kleinsasser non-catch that should have been overturned, plus the interception Vilma got by wrapping up Shiancoe. To balance things out, the refs let Loadholt get away with a facemask in the fourth quarter. Also, both teams were very close to getting an interception.
This game could have gone either way, except for the Saints' one major advantage: coaching. It looked like New Orleans made two major halftime adjustments: going back to the run with the cutback play, and taking away Shiancoe. The Vikings' halftime adjustment: stop running Adrian Peterson. Good work, Childress!
In an unrelated note, Collinsworth was insufferable last night. On a nice Peterson run, Collinsworth spent the entire replay talking about Favre's handoff. In the second half, Collinsworth kept talking how Favre and the receivers weren't on the same page. It took until about five minutes left in the game to mention how maybe Favre missing training camp might contribute to that problem.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 10:16am
I usually like Collinsworth but agree that he was awful.
Building on that Favre handoff sequence, he came back to it later, saying something about how the downside of his being great at handoffs (I believe he called him "a magician with the ball") was that he turned his back to the defense and missed things. And that that helped lead to the interception (which was one of at least a dozen obvious calls the crew missed). But then they showed the highlight, and on the INT he never turned around. Whoops.
It was an up and down night for everyone. The officials let two blatant holds go in the first drive but then later started calling everything, only to stop again after that. Gregg Williams had some great calls balanced out by some awful, predictable, ineffective blitzes that didn't come anywhere near hitting home. Fave threw dumb passes off his back foot and got lucky a few times, but then tossed a perfect ball into a tiny window over the middle that got dropped. Brees came out looking incredible, like they'd be up 14-0 before you could blink, but then overthrew (Henderson?) wide open on the sideline without being pressured and killed a drive. Even Payton had some lapses (though it was hard to top the pedal to the metal feel of the first drive).
But it's the first game of the season. I wouldn't get concerned unless they're not better than this in a month. I still don't have high expectations for the Vikings, but they'll definitely get better.
And if the Saints do as well... look out. Still not quite sure why noone at all seems to have them picked for the Super Bowl.
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Re: the ball over the middle that got dropped
by Joseph :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 10:46am
I don't have DVR, but I thought that Vilma(?) tipped it slightly, and that's why it was dropped. Not for sure, though.
Re: the game in general.
As a Saints fan, the offense had it's moments, but is definitely shaking off the rust. Couple of penalties that killed drives. The one sack appeared to be 1/2 good blitz design by the Vikes, 1/2 mix-up in blocking assignments. RT Stinchcomb was trying to block 2 guys. Since Evans should have blocked the inside rusher, and had a hold, not his best game either. The only positive I saw was that the running game did its job at the end when it was needed. The O gets a C+ (just enough to pass).
The defense played better than I expected. Except for the two catches by Shiancoe at the end of the first half, they pretty much shut the Vikes down. Sure, AD had some good runs--he does every game. But there were a decent number of plays where he didn't have a successful run. A couple of times that he did, Vilma couldn't make the tackle as he normally would because of his groin injury. It was also noticeable on the TD pass. All in all, the D gets an A-.
The special teams gets graded in two parts. The "defensive" special teams get an A+ (included in this grade is the blocked XP). The Vikes KR/PR got NOTHING. However, the "offensive" special teams gets a D-. The ONLY thing that saves it from an F is decent kickoff returns.
Overall--as someone else mentioned, this looked like a 5th preseason game, and I also felt like, outside of the Saints' opening drive, had this game been played on Sunday, it would have been better (3 more days of practice).
But--a win is a win, and I have felt since preseason that this game could have tie-breaker implications.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by sommerswerd (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 11:52am
About Favre's handoffs, I was actually watching for this. I can't say too much about the handoffs, but the tranisition of the handoff itself looked very odd. When a RB takes a handoff, he's supposed to basically take it in the torso; Peterson, at least on the handoff I was watching, clearly grabbed at the ball with his hands.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MJK :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 11:36am
I think people are overstating the ineffectiveness of the Saints offense, probably because they were expecting the high-flying ways of last year to continue.
Fact is, the Vikings apparently forgot how to stop the run about halfway through the third quarter, and then the Saints didn't NEED to pass. When you're picking up 8 yards a pop by handing off to Pierre Thomas, you're going to keep doing that until the Vikings stop you...and they never did. And when one team just keeps running, running, running, the clock keeps ticking ticking ticking, and the final score for both teams ends up being low. I think this is more the reason for the Saints "low" point total than the Vikings' defense. Don't forget that Meacham was open in the end zone and couldn't hold onto a somewhat overthrown but catchable ball, and then the Saints missed the FG. If Meacham catches that, and the Saints don't miss an earlier FG, then they score 24 points, not 14, which wouldn't have made their offense look so bad, especially considering how few drives there were because they ran it so well.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by nat :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:13pm
The Saints had eleven drives, which is pretty much what they averaged last year (see drive stats).
One drive was a short one at the end of the first half. One was the game ending drive in which scoring was not the object. That still leaves 9 drives. So you might want to think of their offense as scoring 14 points in 9/11 of a game. That works out to about 17 points per game.
So, no, their low output wasn't really due to just running out the clock.
You're more on target with the missed field goal and dropped TD pass. The Saints offense was playing better than 14 or even 17 points per game, and I suspect DVOA will agree.
61
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Ezra Johnson :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:04pm
Those little player intros ("Jonathan Vilma, the U") have got to go. Either that, or they have to stop acting like they're auditioning for "Bad Guy #2" on Law and Order. Also, Al's little editorial on the players' show of solidarity was totally crass and unneccesary.
63
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by pazz (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 12:27pm
wow i know its early but the 2 biggest things i came away with from last night were:
Behind that line AP is gonna get overworked and eventually hurt by having to juke at least one guy behind the line of scrimmage all the time and Percy Harvin is not an outside reciever
66
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by jds (not verified) :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 3:52pm
The two biggest things I came away with from last night were: The Vikes really are going to miss Rice (and who knows how long before he is effectively back), and the person most pissed off by the game is probably Peyton Manning, because when the twilight of his career approaches, no coach is going to let him skip training camp (a la the purple guy QB).
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 4:36pm
I also thought that Manning would be pissed, but for a different reason: The incredible pictures of Favre's unbelievably purple thigh and ankle a few days after the NFC Championshp Game. Had Favre and the Vikings not choked away the NFC Championship Game, he likely would have been severely affected by those injuries in the Super Bowl. With Favre's ankle and a huge portion of his thigh matching the team's primary color, I think the Colts would have won the Super Bowl against the Vikings.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Fri, 09/10/2010 - 10:53pm
The Colts would have absolutely destroyed the Vikings. No secondary, a fumbling RB, a hobbled QB and Chilly calling the plays....
- Alvaro
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:05pm
Deleted by Submitter.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DA Baracus (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 12:58pm
1) Why is Jim Mora Jr calling games?
2) Why is he calling the Falcons game?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:18pm
1.) He sent his resume to Washington.
2.) They weren't interested.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:04pm
Uuuuugh. Nantz and Simms on the Patriots game.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:06pm
Aromashadu just dropped a TD. He's already gotten two targets.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:07pm
3rd and 2 is an obvious passing situation? Thanks, Simms.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:09pm
Once again, uuuuugh.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:10pm
I'm watching Det@Chi instead largely to avoid Simms.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by PatsFan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:12pm
Nice job by Fred Taylor to save Brady on that play. Stoned the blitzing DB.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:13pm
On the first drive, Cutler threw four passes--three to Aromashadu and one to Hester.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:16pm
Very good opening drive by the Patriots. Love the call for the TD, but does anybody know why Cincinatti only left two DBs over there? Surely they must have seen that coming?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:17pm
Roy Williams (safety) Pac-Man Jones, TO, and Chad Ochocinco? Are the Bengals just collecting all troublemakers, in the theory that the negative influences will counteract eachother?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DA Baracus (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:20pm
How is Roy Williams a trouble maker?
83
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:36pm
Maybe they signed the wrong Roy Williams? I never said the Bengals Front Office was smart.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DA Baracus (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:47pm
Neither Roy Williams is a trouble maker, so I have no idea what you mean. The WR is a headcase, but he's not comparable to Jones or Benson.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by JIPanick :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:17pm
And the first Sunday touchdown of the season is Brady to Welker. This bodes well for my fantasy team.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:24pm
Cutler just threw a pick worthy of [Vikings QB].
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:30pm
Fred Taylor rolling back the years in this one, featured back and looking good for it.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:37pm
The Bears are protecting Cutler considerably better than I expected. Even when Detroit has gotten some pressure, he's been able to get away.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:37pm
The Colt OL looks AWFUL.
Wayne draws the first 15 yard helmet to helmet/defenseless receiver call of the year.
Textbook call, according to the new rule. But boy, what a stupid rule. That happens almost every play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:43pm
Greg Olsen, trying to prove that he should be the first tight end in a Mike Martz offense to put up big numbers, fumbles the first time he's targeted on the year. Detroit recovers.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DA Baracus (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 1:51pm
Matt Ryan is trying too hard to get the ball to Tony Gonzalez on nearly every play. He's got to spread it around more.
89
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:04pm
The Bears' offense has moved the ball well, but they've turned it over three times now (one INT, a fumble by Greg Olsen, and a fumble by Matt Forte). Martz makes his presence felt.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MilkmanDanimal :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:09pm
As one of the five people in the country watching Bucs-Browns, I can say with some pleasure that last year's way to easily beat the Bucs (running up the middle) appears to be somewhat fixed; Gerald McCoy has made a series of very nice plays in the middle of the line. That being said, several of the other ways to beat the Bucs still exist, being that the Bucs have absolutely zero pass rush; they can't get anything even vaguely resembling outside pressure.
Delhomme made a couple of utterly terrible throws in the first quarter, none of which the Bucs could capitalize on at all. Sigh.
92
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:09pm
Pick Six. Gary Guyton. Ballgame.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:17pm
News flash: Bob Sanders hurt. We now resume your normal Sunday.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Overrated (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:05pm
Pretty sure that is part of a normal Sunday.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:07pm
Yeah hi, sarcasm.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:24pm
Jeff Reed hits the post on a 55 yarder. The announcers credit Mike Smith for calling a timeout to try to ice him. Nah, it couldn't be that it was a long kick, it had to be because of a timeout that they were expecting.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:25pm
Cliff Avril is leaving the game for the Lions. Worse, they force us to listen to "Livin' on a Prayer" on his way out.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:30pm
Peppers hits Stafford, who fumbles. Tommie Harris recovers. Urlacher called for a late hit after the recovery. Stafford is slow getting up but does walk off on his own power.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:34pm
Stafford now has his pads off on the sideline, so the announcers are concerned. He did land squarely on his right shoulder when he got hit.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:47pm
And Stafford has not returned after halftime.
Billick: "Shaun Hill, he's been in, so he'll do fine."
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:49pm
Official word: Stafford's return is questionable.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:40pm
Dear Offensive Coordinators,
Fade routes in the corner of the End Zone don't work. Stop using them.
Sincerely,
The Last 20 Years of Football
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:24pm
Dear The Last 20 Years of Football,
Hell yeah they do.
Sincerely,
Vince Young
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:46pm
After a few tries Tony Gonzalez gets his 1,000th reception. Hooray for arbitrary benchmarks!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 2:58pm
In Oakland vs. Tennessee, Jay Campbell scrambles and makes a tremendois butt slide...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:05pm
In "WTF Moments in the 2010 NFL Season", Oakland attempts to do two passes: Campbell to #15, then #15 to Campbell. Campbell caps the play by going to a small town called "nowhere".
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:14pm
"The Black Hole": a term used to describe current Oakland Raiders.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by notreallyBrianBillick (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:05pm
Brian Billick:
"Where's the Beef? It's in Detroit"
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:09pm
In the Panthers vs. Giants game, TMQ will have a field day with Tom Coughlin not going for it own fourth down for the consecutive time on the FG drive. 17-16, Giants.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:22pm
In the Colts game, they've punted from the 38 and 34 yard lines... for a total net of 32 yards.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MilkmanDanimal :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:14pm
Every time Cadillac Williams carries the ball I grin. Seriously, after all he's been through, I love watching the guy play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:29pm
I grin too, but that's for the far more selfish reason that I have him on my fantasy team.
I very much agree that it's great to see him playing after all he's had to work through.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:17pm
These announcers are killing me. Of course the Falcons defense looks good today, they're going up against the Steelers 3rd string QB.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:19pm
Cutler fumbles on a sack. They've been keeping tight ends and backs there to help protect him, and in the first half it worked pretty well (plus Cutler's athleticism got him out of some trouble), but not so in the second half.
I watched this game in part to see Martz's offense, but it has not looked like Martz's offense.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:20pm
I have no idea what offensive holding is anymore.
Or quite frankly if it's even called.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ebongreen (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:31pm
As I kill time watching Detroit vs. Chicago in anticipation of the Packers/Eagles slugfest, I've gotta say - that's some mighty sloppy football. Before Stafford went out it was a bad game; now it's even worse. It's got all the charm of watching a week's worth of automotive head-on crash tests without the talkative dummies. "What's the most exciting event in the near future - another Cutler interception or a Detroit punt?"
If Detroit wins this by holding onto a one-point lead after losing Stafford before halftime, it'll be an unparalleled indictment of Martz and Lovie Smith as game-day coaches.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big-Hairy-Andy :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:40pm
I'm loving it. Somehow Kyle Vanden Bosch has 19 fantasy points for me - crazy.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:33pm
Ocho Cinco for seis!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MilkmanDanimal :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:36pm
Josh Freeman just does not have zip on the ball, his thumb is clearly bothering him. He can't make deep throws, they're all short and the balls coming out wobbly. Thanks to the general suckiness of the Browns they're still in the game, but I have to wonder if . . . I can't believe I'm saying this . . . Josh Johnson should come in.
And as I type Freeman misses a wide-open Mike Williams for what would have been a TD. He can't throw, why is he playing?
Edit--I take it back! Beautiful throw to Michael Spurlock for a TD.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:36pm
The Bears recover on a strip sack inside the Detroit one yard line. I would not be surprised if they end up kicking a field goal.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:38pm
Shockingly, the Bears make the right decision and go for it on 4th down still at the one. They don't get in.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ebongreen (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:38pm
But no - it's worse than that. Bears = points-free zone.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:37pm
ATL/PIT: The ball hits the ground on an incomplete pass and the refs call it an interception.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:37pm
The Colts' Defensive line is getting abused by Houston.
Between Garcon and Collie dropping passes and anybody Houston puts in there at RB running for +10 yards at will...the Colts look like a .500 team at best.
Just terrible.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BywaterBrat :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:38pm
I'm praying Colts-Texans is on Replay this week...wondering if Belichik puts the gas down then we could get a switch here in the dirty dirty.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by InTheBoilerRoom :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:40pm
And Matt Forte is picking up right where he left off with last year's goal line performance.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:41pm
Anybody know what's going on in the Denver-Jacksonville game? The FOX ticker says "DELAY" instead of the quarter and has for some time.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:42pm
They stopped the game so everyone in the stands could touch Tim Tebow.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:43pm
Ah, I should have known.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:46pm
NFL.com now says the game is delayed due to severe weather.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:52pm
Yeah, it's pretty foggy out there. Thankfully, the light provided by Tebow ensures that the game continues to be seen.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:56pm
It appears to be back on.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:45pm
4:00 to go in the Falcons/Steelers game and there's been a grand total of 4 plays in the red zone.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:47pm
Nice audio feed at the Houston game.
FCC isn't going to like that string of "F-bombs".
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:49pm
Manning has now thrown 55 passes. About 50 of which were made under extreme duress.
As bad as the OL has been, the D has looked worse in the 2nd half, which is why they'll lose.
They should onside kick here. A Texan recovery just takes less time off the clock, which is still a good outcome.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:55pm
And Matt Schaub and Gary Kubiak looked to the sky, and they thanked Tim Tebow and the football gods...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dennis :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:51pm
How could the Bears not kick the FG there? I know you need to have confidence to score from inside the 1, but in that situation you need to take the lead.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:56pm
Steelers driving near midfield and the Falcons get back to back sacks to end the drive, the last on a 3 man rush.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:58pm
Only to have Ryan throw a pick on the first play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 3:59pm
Given a chance to go win the game, Ryan gets picked by Polamalu at the 30. Steelers in position now...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:08pm
Only to have Jeff Reed go wide left...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MurphyZero :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:10pm
Actually it was wide right. Plus it was headed for dead center and then wind, or a curve on it takes it to the right. Tomlin had his arms up and then the look on his face as it curved away was priceless. Nice breakthrough by Mendenhall for the game winner though/
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:19pm
I stand corrected. :)
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:01pm
Cutler just completed his first deep pass of the day for a 28-yard TD to Matt Forte.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:02pm
The Texans beat the Colts, so that means they're going to the playoffs, right? The pre-game shows said the Texans needed to beat the Colts to make the playoffs, and they did, so time to book the tickets.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:05pm
Reed misses another! What an ugly game.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:09pm
Atlanta better score fast in OT because I don't want to miss any of the Eagles game.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:16pm
Quick enough for you? Wasn't Atlanta, though.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:18pm
They cut NY vs. CAR off on my side. Good run by Mendenhall, sloppy game by both teams.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:11pm
David Garrard, the [Vikings QB] to my John Madden.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:14pm
Shaun Hill just threw a jump ball to Calvin Johnson, but it's ruled an incompletion. Weird play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DrunkenSuperman :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:15pm
Lions just got absolutely, completely robbed by rulebook idiocy, and I'm speaking as a Bears fan.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jerry F. (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:22pm
I agree, but we got absolutely completely robbed by Lovie Smith idiocy, so it evens out, right?
(More rationally, the refs had no business awarding the Lions a touchdown on that goalline play that was anything but indisputably a touchdown. Still, Lions got hosed by a dumb rule.)
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:32pm
Yeah, but I'd argue the refs did Chicago a favor by awarding the non-TD, as it gave Bears the time to score, which they would not have had as much after an actual TD (almost certain from 3 inches out). So I'd say that broke even.
I don't even understand how the "process" rule applies though, CJ and the ball were both clearly down before he let it go, and I thought ball down = dead ball = play over. Whatever. NEXT TIME, CHICAGO, NEXT TIME.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:30pm
Same here.
There were a few questionable calls this game. The roughing the passer when the Lions defender brushed Cutler's helmet and the holding call on Kreutz were both extremely marginal in my mind.
The only thing that comforts me is that the Bears should have won this game easily, I mean before that last drive it was like 400 yards of offense to about 100. So I guess the Lions were due some bad luck. Yes, I am rationalizing.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:15pm
Falcons doing everything they can to lose this game. Steelers are returning the favor.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:18pm
Case in point: Mendenhall almost fell down on his own in the open field on the game winning TD run.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by notreallyBrianBillick (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:18pm
As a Bear's fan, all I can say is I do not know how that was not a touchdown for the Lion's. That rule seems to be qualitatively at odds with breaking the plane on a running play. Megatron unfortunately should have tucked and rolled, but appeared to be confident he had made a touchdown and appeared to be breaking his fall. Ughh Detroit Fans, when it rains it pours.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by RickD :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:03pm
Lions were robbed.
This was inevitable with the ridiculous "finish the process" rule. I'm sure Megatron thought he had finished the process. He had control of the ball in the end zone (albeit with only one hand - it's a big hand!) He let go of the ball because he thought the play was over.
Terrible ruling, terrible rule.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DGL :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:30pm
Troy Polamalu agrees with you.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Phil :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:58pm
Dumbest rule in pro football. It had to resurface in a big spot at some point. I had no rooting interest in that game, but I was so angry about that ridiculous interpretation. Silver lining? Hopefully they change the rule to reflect, ya know, common sense. It was nice when a guy could catch a ball in the end zone with two feet in bounds for a TD, without having to worry about whether or not he took the ball back to the bench with him afterwards.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by zlionsfan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:16pm
Yeah, this was pretty much the worst-case scenario for that ruling ... it basically means that in that situation, a DB should be able to level the receiver because the ball is still "live". Of course, if an official has ruled that possession was established, then that suddenly becomes a late hit, and given the attention the NFL is placing on hits on defenseless receivers this year ...
Now that time has passed, I do at least have the perspective to realize that it didn't cost the Lions the game: not only did they have two more tries at the end zone, they also had a ton of plays before that on which they did something stupid. The timing of the play gave it a greater impact than if it had happened in the first quarter, but the effect is the same: just another bad thing that happened to a bad team.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big Frank (not verified) :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 9:08am
You forget the 'defense-less receiver' rule.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:26pm
... What's going on in Cards vs Rams? The Cards turn it over on their own 20. The Rams, kindly enough, decide to give the ball right back.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:31pm
I thino that, despite two weeks of gameplanning, no one was ready to play football. Either that, or no one WANTED to play football.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:33pm
Double post. Go football.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:34pm
Cards punt, Bradford arm=punts. Is anyone actually going to score here except by accident?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:38pm
Welcome to the NFC West.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:26pm
Going through the mind of Derek Anderson: ouch.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:31pm
I LOVE the Eagles throwbacks.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 4:33pm
I was wondering why their uniforms looked different.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 12:59am
I strongly dislike them--they make the team look slow and ridiculous.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:01pm
On the Eagles-Packers game, why were the commentators talking about widescreen TVs?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:02pm
Because this year FOX is putting the SD feeds in widescreen.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:07pm
Interesting.
Combine that with them having Pereira on live broadcasts explaining rules (even the dumb ones) and score two big points for FOX.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:06pm
Nasty looking injury to Leonard Weaver there, bad blow for the Eagles if they lose him
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BucNasty :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:25pm
He just got knee-barred. Very nasty looking hyperextension.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:18pm
And Green Bay's O-Line woes from the beginning of last season seem to have resurfaced
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by shake n bake :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:27pm
The Colts Pass Pro and Run D were horrendous, but they actually could have won without some key mistakes/poor execution on O.
If they can get simple competence from the OL and run D they'll be a contender.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:30pm
Stewart Bradley just got knocked the hell out. He looked stumbled down drunk. Weaver hurt, Ryan Grant can't put any weight on his right leg, Kolb got hit hard. They're piling up.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Powers That Be :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:39pm
And he's back in a couple of plays later.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:46pm
Yep, nice to see all the pre-season bluster about increased awareness of concussions go out the window once we are into a game that matters.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:59pm
DOn't be naive. He's ok now. And I'm sure he is and feels that way. Right now? Fine. Tomorrow? Sore, but that's normal.
And 2 years from now he doesn't remember.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:30pm
And the first linebacker on the Eagles goes down...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:37pm
I found the HB injury a lot uglier. He must have torn something. Hopefully is't just a week thing, worst it's a ligament and a year thing.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:42pm
Yeah, I cringed when I saw the replay. It was really good camera work; they definitely got the best angle for it. But yeah, that was not pretty.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:31pm
This game getting really brutal now. Kevin Kolb gets pounded into the dirt and is very slow getting up. Then Ryan Grant hobbles off with what looks like an ankle sprain, and Stewart Bradley gets knock unconscious on consecutive plays. Difficult to watch.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:32pm
1st play of the Eagles season:
Illegal formation, 6 men on the line of scrimmage...
Nice 'wrinkle' dude. Did that take you all off seasons long to think of that?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:33pm
Jennings makes an unbelievably great catch, and Bradley comes back a few plays after.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:35pm
Funny note.
I have Payton Manning. Loses 24-34... 35 fantasy points.
My opponent has Matt Schaub. Win 24-34... 8 fantasy points.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by shake n bake :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:25pm
QBs facing the Colts are rarely good plays. If the Colts win your QB more than likely was forced into an awful situation late trying to attack deep on a D designed to take that away. If the Colts lose it your QB probably spent the vast majority of the game handing off and dinking/dunking.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by lloyd :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:40pm
So... that Mike Williams play was a TD but Calvin Johnson's wasn't?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:42pm
No. He was down at the one.
And he was running with the ball and in clear possession of it, so it's not really comparable at all.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by lloyd :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:51pm
OK then.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:55pm
Bradford threw his first TD pass, score is tied...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by jpg30@earthlink.net :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 5:59pm
Alex Smith: Not an NFL calibre quarterback.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:13pm
Yet somehow, this fact still hasn't been established yet.
P.S. Bring in Troy Smith.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:05pm
What was the line in the Bears/Lions game? If it was Bears -4.5, that would explain the overturned TD.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:10pm
Bears -7
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:15pm
Crap, there goes that conspiracy theory.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:08pm
The line given on the big sports radio show here in Detroit on Friday was Bears -4, iirc. Don't know where they got the number though.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:08pm
Kolb and Bradley out with concussions. Great.
Nice run by Vick.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:09pm
Wey hey! Vick in for a concussed Kolb in Philly. First play: scramble left end for 23 yards. Turnover 2 plays later. Urngh.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:10pm
Some guy with Vick on the back of jersey runs for 23 yards, only to see Eldra Buckley fumble on the next play. Perhaps Buckley needed a vapor rub?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:12pm
I want Max Hall to get into the ARI/STL game so that it's a battle of rookie QBs, one of which was the #1 pick the other being undrafted. And the latter to do better.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:12pm
So Bradly Wasn't concussed and Kolb was.
There you go. Answeres any answer your question askes.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:14pm
that're my bestest gramars
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:19pm
is poster drunk?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:00pm
I'll let Raiderjoe answer that one.
Can you also react on the subject raised?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:16pm
I'm as big a Rodgers fan as anyone, but the talk of him being MVP seems premature to me. He still makes too many bad decisions and bad throws to break into that elite category (unless you share John Clayton's definition).
But man, when he's on... what a QB. Such an amazing arm.
So far today he's waffled from great to bad a few times. Eliminate the mistakes and this game would be a 30 point blowout. (OK, as it is it's now 20-3. So that's not that bold a claim, I guess.)
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Arkaein :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 10:27am
You do realize he only threw 7 INTs all of last year, right? Can't reconcile that with too many bad decisions.
This was not his best game, however he really only made one bad throwing decision (the first INT, second seemed to slip out of his hands), and even that was on a 3rd and 15 from midfield so it was as good of a time to force a ball down the deep middle as any.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Tue, 09/14/2010 - 12:25am
As a big Rodgers fan, I can assure you that I'm well aware of his statistics.
The term decisions encompasses more than the throws he makes.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by lloyd :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:17pm
Packers OL seems to have regained their composure as of halftime. And man, is Kuhn a bruiser.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:18pm
You know, Coach Wisenhunt, there's an old saying that says: Those who cannot trick, get tricked easily.
Wow...that statement's more confusing than the center snapping the ball to Derek Anderson while Fitzgerald is going in motion...
209
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:26pm
Dear San Fransisco,
Release. Alex. Smith.
Sincerely,
49ers/Football Fans
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:28pm
Vick driving the Eagles down the field. And now Jason Peters is hurt.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:29pm
Mike Vick and Matt Hasselbeck are playing rejuvenated today. It's almost as if the disappearance of Mora breathing down their necks... Ah screw it, I just wanted to bash Mora.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Stabs :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:36pm
Derek Anderson is making me very tired.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:40pm
The Eagles defense is full of fail today.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Led :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:44pm
I hope McNabb doesn't injure himself doing the watusi during this Iggles/Pack game. I may need some points from him tonight.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ebongreen (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:48pm
I wish Joe Buck would shut his trap. Vick didn't have room to run for a first down just now - Clay Matthews was on spy duty, and I think Michael has had enough of getting hit by Clay. Just once would be (and was) enough. You'd think that even if Joe didn't notice, Troy would chime in.
Then a fair catch by the Packer punt returner is ignored by an Eagle tackler. That's a lot of shooting oneself in the foot (or other body parts) going on for the Iggles today.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by mvhuber :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 6:53pm
Does anyone think that Ken Whisenhunt and Larry Fitzgerald wish that they hadn't cut Matt Leinart? Derek Anderson isn't fit for the Arena League.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:00pm
So how close are we to a QB controversy in Philly?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Powers That Be :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:04pm
Close? There's been a QB controversy in Philly since the first quarter.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:05pm
of 1999.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:07pm
That's not fair- there was a 20-minute stretch during the 2000s where the Eagles fans liked McNabb.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:06pm
I was on the road for most of the first half, I missed that part of the game. My apologies.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:02pm
So Alex Smith sucks, Hasselbeck is good and Vick is good. My time machine works!!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:11pm
Careful. You don't want to bring back 2005 Kyle Orton.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:13pm
Sure we do. He was a lot of fun to watch- then again, I wasn't a Bears fan and I enjoy crappy QB play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:25pm
However, as a Denver fan, I would prefer to keep the current Kyle Orton as opposed to bringing back the rookie version.
I would guess that DDF will agree with me on that.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:29pm
I agree, for once.
CuTlEr RuLeZ.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:32pm
I have decided against ever again discussing the Second Coming.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by lolzer (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:04pm
Ryan Clady gave up 2.5 sacks today. Maybe it's the knee injury? oh but this is after 7-8 sacks given up last season. And he still can't runblock very well. But I guess the internet meme that says he's the best young LT in the game hasn't been affected one jot.....amazing what an overhyped rookie season can get you.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:14pm
Cutler > Orton
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:04pm
ealges are too late,
game over. Buck think\s its not
he is quite naive
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Powers That Be :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:07pm
You are too early.
Another interception.
Eagles coming back?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ebongreen (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:08pm
Then again, perhaps not...
229
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Flounder :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:10pm
Suck it, Easterbrook
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:08pm
Joe Buck: "Nate Allen was drafted, ironically, with a pick the Eagles got from trading Donovan McNabb."
Ironically? This is an especially egregious use of the word.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:13pm
80% inlcuding the dumb people think they understand irony.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by AlanSP :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:33pm
I thought the exact same thing when he said that. Not sure what he could possibly think is ironic about that.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:19pm
Vick gives the fans a crash course in Decision-Making 101. Wow, he had better choices on that 3rd-and-goal play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:31pm
duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
That's what I feel like after wathcing that.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Theo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:16pm
27-20, kickoff 5.43 in the 4Q...
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:18pm
Derek Anderson. Just. Wins. Games.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Human Spider :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:25pm
Two time-outs burned with 5 minutes left in the 4th quarter. The Andy Reid School of Clock Management never ceases to amaze me.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Flounder :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:32pm
Well, he save like a minute and a half doing that. If he hadn't, they would have just turned it over on down with 30 seconds left instead of 2 minutes.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by AlanSP :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:37pm
That was actually optimal use of those time outs (unusual for Reid). The best thing you can possibly do with a time out when you're trailing is to extend the game clock by 40 seconds. 40 seconds saved with 5 minutes left count just as much as 40 seconds saved with 2 or 3 minutes left. Offensive timeouts save much less than that because you have far more control of the clock on offense.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Flounder :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:07pm
Exactly
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:56pm
Why would it have taken the Eagles 40 seconds to get a play off there had Reid not called a timeout? The clock was stopped for the measurement, giving them plenty of time to choose two plays, one for 4th and short, one for 1st down.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:13pm
Seeing as they were on defense, the Eagles really didn't have any control of how much time would elapse before the next snap, unless they called a timeout.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:53pm
Yeah, Reid actually did save some time with his clock management (not that Buck and Aikman figured this out or understood it). The only problem I can see with what Reid did is that burning all of his timeouts meant that he couldn't challenge a play if there was a questionable call in the few minutes before the two minute warning. (Since I didn't watch the entire game, I don't know if the Eagles had used up their challenges. I assume they had not done so.)
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Flounder :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:31pm
Clay Matthews just never stops. What a beast.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BucNasty :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:31pm
If I'm gonna run Vick, it's gonna be to the outside.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:32pm
Oh look, Reid used his timeouts improperly and can't stop the clock, so the game will end on kneeldowns.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by AlanSP :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:43pm
There is no mathematically possible way that those timeouts could have better been used to extend the game. Had he not used them when he did, the Packers would have simply run those 2 minutes off the clock earlier rather than later. 40 seconds is 40 seconds.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Dave :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:35pm
Got it. I was mistaken about the use of one of them
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:37pm
Surely you have to use the running back if you are going to run straight up the middle in that situation? I mean at least he has a chance of ploughing through the traffic for a couple of yards unlike, say, a quarterback.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:38pm
Fitzgerald has 3 catches on 15 targets?!
He may be showing up in Quick Reads, in a bad way.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DEW (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:59pm
That's the kind of stat that raises all kinds of questions about "chemistry and/or timing between QB and WR," given the time missed by the injured Fitz and the fact that Anderson wasn't on the team last year and wasn't on the *first* team until the third week of preseason. That's 12 out of 19 incompletions thrown to Fitz.
But seriously, is it just me or do the Cardinals have basically no OL? We knew that they can't run-block (especially with their best back injured), but we've seen Warner lose games out there when they decide that pass-blocking is also optional, so I don't even want to see the blood and gore when they apply that to Anderson.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MidnightAngler (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:32pm
welcome to the derek anderson era!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Q (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:51pm
That Rams 2 Minute Drill might be the Worst that I have ever seen. The most ridiculous had to be the Draw up the middle on 3rd Down with 10 seconds left in the game when trailing 17-13 from the 40 yard line.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by MilkmanDanimal :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:56pm
That, or the fact that Bradford was throwing two-yard passes while down four points with 30 seconds left in the game at midfield. Um, the end zone? It's way down that way.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by The Powers That Be :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 7:58pm
That was a fourth down play, which does make a difference. They either take their one shot at the end zone on that play, or try to get a few more yards with a high percentage of getting the first down, and then try their shot. Not a terrible choice, in my mind.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by DEW (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:02pm
Agreed; it's the dinking and dunking leading up to that point that was the problem (to say nothing of NOT taking the TO after the :37 catch). 1:21 and three time-outs should be more than enough time for any team to either get down the field successfully or at least fail to do so because the defense actually stopped them/forced incompletions/etc., not because of an unwillingness to run plays designed to gain the needed yardage.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by bigtencrazy (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:11pm
Vick was playing against a defense that was in borderline prevent most of the fourth quarter. If Reid lets himself get fooled into thinking that Vick can complete enough passes to be a starter he is not as smart as I thought.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:39pm
The thing I love about Cowboys games is they inevitably send my buddy Brian the Cowboys fan into a meltdown 2-3 times a game where he unloads on Wade, Garrett and Jerry.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:46pm
More meltdowns this game by Cowboys fans or Eagles fans, do you think?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BJR :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:42pm
Nice cheap shot from Jay Ratliff on McNabb on his first attempt.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:49pm
I'd say that this first drive shows what a huge improvement McNabb makes for Washington.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Shattenjager :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:56pm
Dez Bryant and DeAngelo Hall are in an argument. Who's shocked?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 8:57pm
Marion Barber isn't a quarterback, it turns out. Nice wildcat try though.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:03pm
And the 'Boys miss a FG. Why does it seem like Dallas is always having kicker problems?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:24pm
I'm going to go ahead and assume it's because they chose to go with a kicker that couldn't even fill in for two games last year, even though he was already on the gameday roster as the kick-off specialist. But that's jsut me...
- Alvaro
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:14pm
Ray Lewis, nobody wants to hang out with you. Cause we're afraid of getting stabbed.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:53pm
Ahh, the Cowboys.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by semigruntled Eagles Fan (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:55pm
I enjoyed that ending to the first half. I actually think Choice was considering throwing the ball, thinking that Romo lateraled it backwards to him.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 9:56pm
Brilliant way to end the half, Wade....
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:03pm
I can't wait to hear Joe Theismann criticize the play on NFL Network. I hope one of his colleagues then brings up the name "Jack Squirek."
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by wr (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:03pm
Touchdown Herm Edw - er, DeAngelo Hall!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:13pm
Timeouts? We don't need no stinkin' timeouts!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:22pm
This game feels like both teams just seeing how poorly they can play.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by agauntpanda :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:22pm
What the hell is going on in this game? Gametracker is making it seem like they canceled the football game and brought on the Blue Man Group or something.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:23pm
So somehow, that whole series post Scandrick's jumping off-sides somehow works out in Dallas' favor?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Rocco :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:26pm
Insert the cliche about never taking points off the board here.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by AlanSP :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:29pm
Punting on 4th and 1 down 10 on your opponent's 41 is pretty weak.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:35pm
Well... in hindsight, with that crappy Washington punt, it wasn't so bad.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ASmitty (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 10:57pm
I will never watch another NFL game. I'm not even a Lion's fan, but a team goes through all that only to be cheated out of a win by a completely nonsensical rule. Changing the rule now doesn't help Lions fans, goodbye NFL.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:02pm
Really? I didn't watch the game and have no vested interest in the game, but I've seen PLENTY of sporing events with teams I DO care about get jobbed out of victory due to crappy calls. It happens all the time. If you're willing to give up a sport for this, I'm guessing you weren't much of a fan to begin with.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:27pm
He's either a troll, or someone who just watched his first NFl game this week. That's all I can conclude from that statement.
- Alvaro
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by ASmitty (not verified) :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:05pm
Bad calls are bad calls. They happen. Bad calls that stand up to multiple reviews despite being obviously wrong are embarrassing. I was ashamed for the NFL watching an obviously wrong call get "justified" a number of different ways. Why have replay if you're going to make that call?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:10pm
Fair enough. Again, I haven't seen the play so I don't know. But don't give up the whole game!
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:30pm
Well, except for the fact that it WASN'T a bad call. It was the correct call 100%. You may disagree with the rule (which I personally don't) but, just like with the tuck-rule, the rule not being what you think it should be doesn't change the fact that the rule must be called correctly and consistently. Under the current rule-book, calling that a touchdown WOULD have been a very bad call.
- Alvaro
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Big Johnson :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 3:07am
except that there are two ways to interpret the rule.
A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground.
B) the receiver must contain possession till he is down on the ground (for a couple seconds).
I interpret it as the first scenario. Once his two feet are in he needs to complete the motion to the ground, if it is part of the catching motion. Once his left knee hits the ground it should be ruled a touchdown as the finishing move, in my interpretation. The calvin catch should have been a touchdown if thats the interpretation. Im personally not understanding why he would need to maintain control after his knee is down. he would have been ruled down on any other yardline on the field. The lions lost a game that they won due to a misinterpretation of the rule. but hey thats just me.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by RichC (not verified) :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 8:41am
"A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground."
Except the NFL has never interpreted it that way. Never.
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Mon, 09/13/2010 - 7:17pm
"except that there are two ways to interpret the rule.
A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground.
B) the receiver must contain possession till he is down on the ground (for a couple seconds)."
Or C) The way the NFl has always interpreted it: The reciever must mantain control until the montion of falling ot the ground is over, ie, his momentum from the fall ends.
"The calvin catch should have been a touchdown if thats the interpretation. Im personally not understanding why he would need to maintain control after his knee is down. he would have been ruled down on any other yardline on the field."
No he really, really, REALLY would not have been. As seen (by now I'm sure you can all say it with me kids!) on every other game it has happened in the middle of the field.
"The lions lost a game that they won due to a misinterpretation of the rule. but hey thats just me."
Seeing how every single comentator who has chimed in, from Pereira who we can probably call the foremost authority on teh subject, to Kirwan who thinks the rule should be changed and generally couldn't find his own behind with a map, to the Head Coach of the Detroit Lions, agree that the rule was called correctly, I'm pretty confident in saying that yes, it IS just you.
- Alvaro
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:09pm
I hate the play-call of a toss to the short side of the field. If you're relying on speed to get to the outside and cut forward to get 2 years, why not use the far side where you have an extra few yards to outrun the other team?
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Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 09/12/2010 - 11:14pm
I've never understood this either, Lance. The reason it's done seems to be, "Well, it just is." I could see doing it occasionally, as a change-of-pace, but it really seems that the majority of toss plays go to the short side.
RSS Feed
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I think the Saints win, and possibly by a significant margin. The Vikings have only gotten worse since the NFC Championship, and the Saints have remained the same for the most part. And since neither team has new tape on each other really, I expect a similar game to what we saw in the NFC Championship. However, without Rice for the Vikes, I see it being more lopsided.
Excited for the game; too bad I will be working for 2/3 of it. But that's why they made DVR.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I think the Vikings will win by running AD as much as possible - the saints can't stop him. Although it hurts not to have Rice, I think the passing game will be successful enough with Harvin having a big game and Berrian getting a couple nice plays. The saints will keep it close until the end but the vikings will protect the lead in the 4th quarter. No way they fumble the game away this time.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Wooo! Football! Go Sports!
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Is it too early to say 'uh-oh'
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
That was quick. I wonder, which is better. 15 yards on the kickoff and increased chance of a touchback, or 1 yard on the PAT and better odds of converting a two point conversion?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Obviously a little bit late for this comment, but I was thinking they might try an onside kick since they were kicking off from the 45 yard line.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Missed the first drive, can anyone give me an update?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
The Saints are really good at passing the ball. The Vikings are not so good at defending the pass. The Saints had 1 third down and 1 incompletion on the drive.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Saints ball: passing, TD.
Vikings ball: run-run-run-punt.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Thanks guys
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Brees to NO WRs. TD.
AP, meet D-line.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Saints Screen game apparently not working on the vikes who shut down a WR Screen and one to Bush before Brees over throws on 3rd down for a 3 and out.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I thought petereson was supposed to be carrying the ball different ala Tiki Barber to solve his fumbling issues -- he's obviously not - so just waiting on the fumbles i guess.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Classic Favre.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Shoulda held on, Brett.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Old dog =/= new tricks.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
And I was just going to say the Vikings were having trouble getting the pass game going.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I'm reminded that the Vikings were probably the best team in football last year.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
pierer thomas do nothing in first half but come alive on this drive in 3rd eriod
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Saints look great on the first drive of each half - wonder if they'll stall out in the rest of this half like they did in the first.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
And Pierre Thomas shows why he's the DVOA darling.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
is it just me or does NO's kickoff and punt coverage unit look really really good?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
yup. don't know about the yardage on punts, but the coverage looked really good.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I think Kleinsasser did catch it, but they won't overturn because there is no conclusive picture.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Big Johnson likes this
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
That was my first thought, too. Then I thought about it like a referee.
His hands were clearly underneath the ball. But the ball bounces up - and is thus clearly not yet under his control. The only question is this: did the ball touch the turf at all in the process of bouncing off the hands? If it did, it touched the ground before being controlled.
We've gotten used to the idea that the ball can touch the ground and still result in a catch. That's true, but only if the ball is under control at that instant. A bouncing ball is another beast altogether.
So, while it was a close call, I think this wasn't a case of "no conclusive evidence". Simply a close call correctly made.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Vikings run defense is a far cry from what it used to be. I'm sure overplaying the pass is a part of it... but this used to never happen. You saw signs of it late last year, too.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Maybe Pat Williams is getting old, I didn't think Leber looked good and as Collinsworth mentioned, those guards are very... very good.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Gametracker has Kleinsasser with a tackle... is he playing both sides of the ball, or is that an error? Hutchinson has tackle credit on the Favre INT.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Maybe he plays on special teams.,..
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Ah, of course
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
yeha maybe was spexcial teams tackle. thought maybe he tackled Vilma on int but saw replay again and saw it was Huthcinson who tckle Vilma
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
He's not on the play by play with a tackle, nor does he have a tackle in the box score.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Must have been an error in the CBS game log that they then fixed.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Gee, the line was 5 wasn't it?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Ballgame.
Who'd have thought the Vikings would lose from their inability to stop the run.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
What a totally anticlimactic game.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Is it me or was this a surprisingly unexciting game?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I thought it was too.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Yeah. I'm liking less and less the liberalized passing rules.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
So many missed opportunities. Brees gift wrapped the Vikings a pick, and the guy can't hold on. The Saints missed two field goals. Malcom Jenkins can't stay in bounds on his pick. The Kleinsasser non-catch.
A bunch of near big plays.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
If this is what two elite teams look like after 4 preseason games, I wonder what they will look like after only 2?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Vikings cover!
Seriously sloppy game though.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I thought the Viking's defense looked OK for the most part, but it seemed like sideline routes were there whenever the Saints wanted them (and could hold onto the ball).
Favre did not look so good. I'm not sure exactly what is was, but he just seemed off to me. However, this is probably just rust from not practicing all off season, and he'll be just fine and tear up the Bears later this year.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I think the Vikings were roughly about where they were around the open of last season except they were playing a much better team (last year was Browns).
There were a couple of times where I felt if they'd just kept running Peterson they could have run them out of the building, but just then they'd get a holding penalty or Childress would put Albert Young in and the drive would sputter.
My 2 cents
With the final score of 14-9, clearly both defenses dominated two very hyped, high-scoring offenses. When the Saints came out passing right at the start, they cleaved up the Vikings secondary for a quick touchdown. But they wouldn't score again in the first half, despite Brees completing many passes (and them not even bothering to try to run).
The New Orleans special teams reduced the score on both sides, by blocking an extra point and missing two field goals. Without them, the final score would be 20-10.
Favre throws difficult balls to catch, and we watched many Vikings receivers just miss their catches. Bernard Berrian never seemed to be open. Shiancoe (TE) seemed to be the only effective receiver they had.
Sean Payton outcoached the Vikings, by passing almost exclusively in the first half, and then running a ton in the second half, often right through the Williams wall. Eventually the ran out the clock by running for first downs to seal their ugly victory.
The defenses didn't dominate the stats, each giving up plenty of yards and collecting only 1 sack apiece. The only turnover was a Favre interception that he threw while avoiding a sack. But both defenses, under intense pressure, kept the score low and within one possession the entire game. Favre had no magic last drive this time.
Re: My 2 cents
Disagree that either defense dominated. If NO makes the first FG and don't drop an open TD the final score is 24-9, and the Vikings D looks anything but dominant. I felt NO's defense was a little more consistent, though they also benefited from Vikings drops and missed throws.
No one can say that the Vikings run D looked dominant they way the Williams Wall was shoved sideways late in the game. Pat Williams in particular just looked old.
I think NO can clean up it's problems more easily over the course of the season, I just doubt they drop that many passes in another game. The Vikings will be in trouble until Sydney Rice returns. The other WRs will probably play better, but Rice is a step above the rest. The backup RB position is clearly a downgrade from Taylor.
Re: My 2 cents
It is often a mistake to try to read trends from one game. A younger Williams Wall got run on in early 2007, in Dallas, in the 2nd half, when the offense could not sustain drives in the 2nd half. Jimmy Kennedy provides the best depth at defensive tackle, so if he makes it back onto the field soon, that alone may give Pat Williams a better rotation, and more effectiveness. They really need the offense to provide leads in the 2nd half, however. If they can be at 4-4 at midseason, the schedule gets easier, and hopefully they have Rice back. I did not completely jump on the Sidney Rice bandwagon last year, but holy smokes, when he is off the field you really start noticing how lacking in ball skills other Viking receivers are.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Both qbs seemd to play fairly well, but the receivers for both teams had very mediocre games, it seemed to me.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I agree, though I would probably use a more negative term than "very mediocre."
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Yeah, for some reason, I was being polite. The receivers for both teams sucked. The only really good play on a ball may have been the Kleinsasser grab that was initially ruled a catch, then overturned by a 2nd Zebra, without conclusive video evidence. The irony is that Kleinsasser is mostly paid to block, not catch, while a guy like Shiancoe is supposed to earn his living with ball skills, and frequently falls short.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Shianco was the only reason the Vikings were even in the game at the end of the first half. He's pretty much the only one Favre was completing passes to.
The saint's defensive plan in the second half was basically "take away Shiancoe"
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Yes, Shiancoe had the most balls thrown to him, at least in the first half. He does not consistently display good ball skills, and frequently fails to catch eminently catchable balls. For a guy who is primarily paid to display good ball skills, this is not wonderful.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
delete repeat
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Chilly completely abandoned the running game in the second half. AP only got 18 carries and was running real well. Too bad Chilly had to defer to Favre and let him throw almost 30 times when he clearly wasn't playing well.
Typical Chilly.
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Agreed. Peterson was playing really well, and then Childress just stopped using him.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
2 opposite gameplans.
Minnesota: run the ball, pass when we really need to. As if Childress knew that Favre wasn't in rythem yet. Or he's just in love with AD and *shudders* wanted to set. Up. The. Run.
Saints: pass the ball by neutralizing their best pass rusher; run out the clock second half behind your best lineman and dink and dunk.
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Both teams left points on the field. The Saints had the two missed field goals and the dropped catch in the end zone. The Vikings had the Kleinsasser non-catch that should have been overturned, plus the interception Vilma got by wrapping up Shiancoe. To balance things out, the refs let Loadholt get away with a facemask in the fourth quarter. Also, both teams were very close to getting an interception.
This game could have gone either way, except for the Saints' one major advantage: coaching. It looked like New Orleans made two major halftime adjustments: going back to the run with the cutback play, and taking away Shiancoe. The Vikings' halftime adjustment: stop running Adrian Peterson. Good work, Childress!
In an unrelated note, Collinsworth was insufferable last night. On a nice Peterson run, Collinsworth spent the entire replay talking about Favre's handoff. In the second half, Collinsworth kept talking how Favre and the receivers weren't on the same page. It took until about five minutes left in the game to mention how maybe Favre missing training camp might contribute to that problem.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I usually like Collinsworth but agree that he was awful.
Building on that Favre handoff sequence, he came back to it later, saying something about how the downside of his being great at handoffs (I believe he called him "a magician with the ball") was that he turned his back to the defense and missed things. And that that helped lead to the interception (which was one of at least a dozen obvious calls the crew missed). But then they showed the highlight, and on the INT he never turned around. Whoops.
It was an up and down night for everyone. The officials let two blatant holds go in the first drive but then later started calling everything, only to stop again after that. Gregg Williams had some great calls balanced out by some awful, predictable, ineffective blitzes that didn't come anywhere near hitting home. Fave threw dumb passes off his back foot and got lucky a few times, but then tossed a perfect ball into a tiny window over the middle that got dropped. Brees came out looking incredible, like they'd be up 14-0 before you could blink, but then overthrew (Henderson?) wide open on the sideline without being pressured and killed a drive. Even Payton had some lapses (though it was hard to top the pedal to the metal feel of the first drive).
But it's the first game of the season. I wouldn't get concerned unless they're not better than this in a month. I still don't have high expectations for the Vikings, but they'll definitely get better.
And if the Saints do as well... look out. Still not quite sure why noone at all seems to have them picked for the Super Bowl.
Re: the ball over the middle that got dropped
I don't have DVR, but I thought that Vilma(?) tipped it slightly, and that's why it was dropped. Not for sure, though.
Re: the game in general.
As a Saints fan, the offense had it's moments, but is definitely shaking off the rust. Couple of penalties that killed drives. The one sack appeared to be 1/2 good blitz design by the Vikes, 1/2 mix-up in blocking assignments. RT Stinchcomb was trying to block 2 guys. Since Evans should have blocked the inside rusher, and had a hold, not his best game either. The only positive I saw was that the running game did its job at the end when it was needed. The O gets a C+ (just enough to pass).
The defense played better than I expected. Except for the two catches by Shiancoe at the end of the first half, they pretty much shut the Vikes down. Sure, AD had some good runs--he does every game. But there were a decent number of plays where he didn't have a successful run. A couple of times that he did, Vilma couldn't make the tackle as he normally would because of his groin injury. It was also noticeable on the TD pass. All in all, the D gets an A-.
The special teams gets graded in two parts. The "defensive" special teams get an A+ (included in this grade is the blocked XP). The Vikes KR/PR got NOTHING. However, the "offensive" special teams gets a D-. The ONLY thing that saves it from an F is decent kickoff returns.
Overall--as someone else mentioned, this looked like a 5th preseason game, and I also felt like, outside of the Saints' opening drive, had this game been played on Sunday, it would have been better (3 more days of practice).
But--a win is a win, and I have felt since preseason that this game could have tie-breaker implications.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
About Favre's handoffs, I was actually watching for this. I can't say too much about the handoffs, but the tranisition of the handoff itself looked very odd. When a RB takes a handoff, he's supposed to basically take it in the torso; Peterson, at least on the handoff I was watching, clearly grabbed at the ball with his hands.
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I think people are overstating the ineffectiveness of the Saints offense, probably because they were expecting the high-flying ways of last year to continue.
Fact is, the Vikings apparently forgot how to stop the run about halfway through the third quarter, and then the Saints didn't NEED to pass. When you're picking up 8 yards a pop by handing off to Pierre Thomas, you're going to keep doing that until the Vikings stop you...and they never did. And when one team just keeps running, running, running, the clock keeps ticking ticking ticking, and the final score for both teams ends up being low. I think this is more the reason for the Saints "low" point total than the Vikings' defense. Don't forget that Meacham was open in the end zone and couldn't hold onto a somewhat overthrown but catchable ball, and then the Saints missed the FG. If Meacham catches that, and the Saints don't miss an earlier FG, then they score 24 points, not 14, which wouldn't have made their offense look so bad, especially considering how few drives there were because they ran it so well.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
The Saints had eleven drives, which is pretty much what they averaged last year (see drive stats).
One drive was a short one at the end of the first half. One was the game ending drive in which scoring was not the object. That still leaves 9 drives. So you might want to think of their offense as scoring 14 points in 9/11 of a game. That works out to about 17 points per game.
So, no, their low output wasn't really due to just running out the clock.
You're more on target with the missed field goal and dropped TD pass. The Saints offense was playing better than 14 or even 17 points per game, and I suspect DVOA will agree.
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Those little player intros ("Jonathan Vilma, the U") have got to go. Either that, or they have to stop acting like they're auditioning for "Bad Guy #2" on Law and Order. Also, Al's little editorial on the players' show of solidarity was totally crass and unneccesary.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
wow i know its early but the 2 biggest things i came away with from last night were:
Behind that line AP is gonna get overworked and eventually hurt by having to juke at least one guy behind the line of scrimmage all the time and Percy Harvin is not an outside reciever
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The two biggest things I came away with from last night were: The Vikes really are going to miss Rice (and who knows how long before he is effectively back), and the person most pissed off by the game is probably Peyton Manning, because when the twilight of his career approaches, no coach is going to let him skip training camp (a la the purple guy QB).
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I also thought that Manning would be pissed, but for a different reason: The incredible pictures of Favre's unbelievably purple thigh and ankle a few days after the NFC Championshp Game. Had Favre and the Vikings not choked away the NFC Championship Game, he likely would have been severely affected by those injuries in the Super Bowl. With Favre's ankle and a huge portion of his thigh matching the team's primary color, I think the Colts would have won the Super Bowl against the Vikings.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
The Colts would have absolutely destroyed the Vikings. No secondary, a fumbling RB, a hobbled QB and Chilly calling the plays....
- Alvaro
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Deleted by Submitter.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
1) Why is Jim Mora Jr calling games?
2) Why is he calling the Falcons game?
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1.) He sent his resume to Washington.
2.) They weren't interested.
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Uuuuugh. Nantz and Simms on the Patriots game.
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Aromashadu just dropped a TD. He's already gotten two targets.
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3rd and 2 is an obvious passing situation? Thanks, Simms.
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Once again, uuuuugh.
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I'm watching Det@Chi instead largely to avoid Simms.
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Nice job by Fred Taylor to save Brady on that play. Stoned the blitzing DB.
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On the first drive, Cutler threw four passes--three to Aromashadu and one to Hester.
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Very good opening drive by the Patriots. Love the call for the TD, but does anybody know why Cincinatti only left two DBs over there? Surely they must have seen that coming?
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Roy Williams (safety) Pac-Man Jones, TO, and Chad Ochocinco? Are the Bengals just collecting all troublemakers, in the theory that the negative influences will counteract eachother?
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How is Roy Williams a trouble maker?
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Maybe they signed the wrong Roy Williams? I never said the Bengals Front Office was smart.
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Neither Roy Williams is a trouble maker, so I have no idea what you mean. The WR is a headcase, but he's not comparable to Jones or Benson.
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And the first Sunday touchdown of the season is Brady to Welker. This bodes well for my fantasy team.
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Cutler just threw a pick worthy of [Vikings QB].
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Fred Taylor rolling back the years in this one, featured back and looking good for it.
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The Bears are protecting Cutler considerably better than I expected. Even when Detroit has gotten some pressure, he's been able to get away.
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The Colt OL looks AWFUL.
Wayne draws the first 15 yard helmet to helmet/defenseless receiver call of the year.
Textbook call, according to the new rule. But boy, what a stupid rule. That happens almost every play.
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Greg Olsen, trying to prove that he should be the first tight end in a Mike Martz offense to put up big numbers, fumbles the first time he's targeted on the year. Detroit recovers.
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Matt Ryan is trying too hard to get the ball to Tony Gonzalez on nearly every play. He's got to spread it around more.
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The Bears' offense has moved the ball well, but they've turned it over three times now (one INT, a fumble by Greg Olsen, and a fumble by Matt Forte). Martz makes his presence felt.
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As one of the five people in the country watching Bucs-Browns, I can say with some pleasure that last year's way to easily beat the Bucs (running up the middle) appears to be somewhat fixed; Gerald McCoy has made a series of very nice plays in the middle of the line. That being said, several of the other ways to beat the Bucs still exist, being that the Bucs have absolutely zero pass rush; they can't get anything even vaguely resembling outside pressure.
Delhomme made a couple of utterly terrible throws in the first quarter, none of which the Bucs could capitalize on at all. Sigh.
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Pick Six. Gary Guyton. Ballgame.
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News flash: Bob Sanders hurt. We now resume your normal Sunday.
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Pretty sure that is part of a normal Sunday.
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Yeah hi, sarcasm.
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Jeff Reed hits the post on a 55 yarder. The announcers credit Mike Smith for calling a timeout to try to ice him. Nah, it couldn't be that it was a long kick, it had to be because of a timeout that they were expecting.
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Cliff Avril is leaving the game for the Lions. Worse, they force us to listen to "Livin' on a Prayer" on his way out.
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Peppers hits Stafford, who fumbles. Tommie Harris recovers. Urlacher called for a late hit after the recovery. Stafford is slow getting up but does walk off on his own power.
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Stafford now has his pads off on the sideline, so the announcers are concerned. He did land squarely on his right shoulder when he got hit.
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And Stafford has not returned after halftime.
Billick: "Shaun Hill, he's been in, so he'll do fine."
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Official word: Stafford's return is questionable.
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Dear Offensive Coordinators,
Fade routes in the corner of the End Zone don't work. Stop using them.
Sincerely,
The Last 20 Years of Football
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Dear The Last 20 Years of Football,
Hell yeah they do.
Sincerely,
Vince Young
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After a few tries Tony Gonzalez gets his 1,000th reception. Hooray for arbitrary benchmarks!
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In Oakland vs. Tennessee, Jay Campbell scrambles and makes a tremendois butt slide...
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
In "WTF Moments in the 2010 NFL Season", Oakland attempts to do two passes: Campbell to #15, then #15 to Campbell. Campbell caps the play by going to a small town called "nowhere".
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
"The Black Hole": a term used to describe current Oakland Raiders.
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Brian Billick:
"Where's the Beef? It's in Detroit"
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In the Panthers vs. Giants game, TMQ will have a field day with Tom Coughlin not going for it own fourth down for the consecutive time on the FG drive. 17-16, Giants.
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In the Colts game, they've punted from the 38 and 34 yard lines... for a total net of 32 yards.
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Every time Cadillac Williams carries the ball I grin. Seriously, after all he's been through, I love watching the guy play.
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I grin too, but that's for the far more selfish reason that I have him on my fantasy team.
I very much agree that it's great to see him playing after all he's had to work through.
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These announcers are killing me. Of course the Falcons defense looks good today, they're going up against the Steelers 3rd string QB.
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Cutler fumbles on a sack. They've been keeping tight ends and backs there to help protect him, and in the first half it worked pretty well (plus Cutler's athleticism got him out of some trouble), but not so in the second half.
I watched this game in part to see Martz's offense, but it has not looked like Martz's offense.
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I have no idea what offensive holding is anymore.
Or quite frankly if it's even called.
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As I kill time watching Detroit vs. Chicago in anticipation of the Packers/Eagles slugfest, I've gotta say - that's some mighty sloppy football. Before Stafford went out it was a bad game; now it's even worse. It's got all the charm of watching a week's worth of automotive head-on crash tests without the talkative dummies. "What's the most exciting event in the near future - another Cutler interception or a Detroit punt?"
If Detroit wins this by holding onto a one-point lead after losing Stafford before halftime, it'll be an unparalleled indictment of Martz and Lovie Smith as game-day coaches.
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I'm loving it. Somehow Kyle Vanden Bosch has 19 fantasy points for me - crazy.
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Ocho Cinco for seis!
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Josh Freeman just does not have zip on the ball, his thumb is clearly bothering him. He can't make deep throws, they're all short and the balls coming out wobbly. Thanks to the general suckiness of the Browns they're still in the game, but I have to wonder if . . . I can't believe I'm saying this . . . Josh Johnson should come in.
And as I type Freeman misses a wide-open Mike Williams for what would have been a TD. He can't throw, why is he playing?
Edit--I take it back! Beautiful throw to Michael Spurlock for a TD.
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The Bears recover on a strip sack inside the Detroit one yard line. I would not be surprised if they end up kicking a field goal.
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Shockingly, the Bears make the right decision and go for it on 4th down still at the one. They don't get in.
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But no - it's worse than that. Bears = points-free zone.
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ATL/PIT: The ball hits the ground on an incomplete pass and the refs call it an interception.
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The Colts' Defensive line is getting abused by Houston.
Between Garcon and Collie dropping passes and anybody Houston puts in there at RB running for +10 yards at will...the Colts look like a .500 team at best.
Just terrible.
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I'm praying Colts-Texans is on Replay this week...wondering if Belichik puts the gas down then we could get a switch here in the dirty dirty.
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And Matt Forte is picking up right where he left off with last year's goal line performance.
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Anybody know what's going on in the Denver-Jacksonville game? The FOX ticker says "DELAY" instead of the quarter and has for some time.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
They stopped the game so everyone in the stands could touch Tim Tebow.
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Ah, I should have known.
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NFL.com now says the game is delayed due to severe weather.
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Yeah, it's pretty foggy out there. Thankfully, the light provided by Tebow ensures that the game continues to be seen.
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It appears to be back on.
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4:00 to go in the Falcons/Steelers game and there's been a grand total of 4 plays in the red zone.
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Nice audio feed at the Houston game.
FCC isn't going to like that string of "F-bombs".
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Manning has now thrown 55 passes. About 50 of which were made under extreme duress.
As bad as the OL has been, the D has looked worse in the 2nd half, which is why they'll lose.
They should onside kick here. A Texan recovery just takes less time off the clock, which is still a good outcome.
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And Matt Schaub and Gary Kubiak looked to the sky, and they thanked Tim Tebow and the football gods...
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How could the Bears not kick the FG there? I know you need to have confidence to score from inside the 1, but in that situation you need to take the lead.
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Steelers driving near midfield and the Falcons get back to back sacks to end the drive, the last on a 3 man rush.
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Only to have Ryan throw a pick on the first play.
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Given a chance to go win the game, Ryan gets picked by Polamalu at the 30. Steelers in position now...
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Only to have Jeff Reed go wide left...
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Actually it was wide right. Plus it was headed for dead center and then wind, or a curve on it takes it to the right. Tomlin had his arms up and then the look on his face as it curved away was priceless. Nice breakthrough by Mendenhall for the game winner though/
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I stand corrected. :)
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Cutler just completed his first deep pass of the day for a 28-yard TD to Matt Forte.
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The Texans beat the Colts, so that means they're going to the playoffs, right? The pre-game shows said the Texans needed to beat the Colts to make the playoffs, and they did, so time to book the tickets.
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Reed misses another! What an ugly game.
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Atlanta better score fast in OT because I don't want to miss any of the Eagles game.
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Quick enough for you? Wasn't Atlanta, though.
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They cut NY vs. CAR off on my side. Good run by Mendenhall, sloppy game by both teams.
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David Garrard, the [Vikings QB] to my John Madden.
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Shaun Hill just threw a jump ball to Calvin Johnson, but it's ruled an incompletion. Weird play.
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Lions just got absolutely, completely robbed by rulebook idiocy, and I'm speaking as a Bears fan.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I agree, but we got absolutely completely robbed by Lovie Smith idiocy, so it evens out, right?
(More rationally, the refs had no business awarding the Lions a touchdown on that goalline play that was anything but indisputably a touchdown. Still, Lions got hosed by a dumb rule.)
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Yeah, but I'd argue the refs did Chicago a favor by awarding the non-TD, as it gave Bears the time to score, which they would not have had as much after an actual TD (almost certain from 3 inches out). So I'd say that broke even.
I don't even understand how the "process" rule applies though, CJ and the ball were both clearly down before he let it go, and I thought ball down = dead ball = play over. Whatever. NEXT TIME, CHICAGO, NEXT TIME.
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Same here.
There were a few questionable calls this game. The roughing the passer when the Lions defender brushed Cutler's helmet and the holding call on Kreutz were both extremely marginal in my mind.
The only thing that comforts me is that the Bears should have won this game easily, I mean before that last drive it was like 400 yards of offense to about 100. So I guess the Lions were due some bad luck. Yes, I am rationalizing.
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Falcons doing everything they can to lose this game. Steelers are returning the favor.
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Case in point: Mendenhall almost fell down on his own in the open field on the game winning TD run.
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As a Bear's fan, all I can say is I do not know how that was not a touchdown for the Lion's. That rule seems to be qualitatively at odds with breaking the plane on a running play. Megatron unfortunately should have tucked and rolled, but appeared to be confident he had made a touchdown and appeared to be breaking his fall. Ughh Detroit Fans, when it rains it pours.
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Lions were robbed.
This was inevitable with the ridiculous "finish the process" rule. I'm sure Megatron thought he had finished the process. He had control of the ball in the end zone (albeit with only one hand - it's a big hand!) He let go of the ball because he thought the play was over.
Terrible ruling, terrible rule.
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Troy Polamalu agrees with you.
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Dumbest rule in pro football. It had to resurface in a big spot at some point. I had no rooting interest in that game, but I was so angry about that ridiculous interpretation. Silver lining? Hopefully they change the rule to reflect, ya know, common sense. It was nice when a guy could catch a ball in the end zone with two feet in bounds for a TD, without having to worry about whether or not he took the ball back to the bench with him afterwards.
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Yeah, this was pretty much the worst-case scenario for that ruling ... it basically means that in that situation, a DB should be able to level the receiver because the ball is still "live". Of course, if an official has ruled that possession was established, then that suddenly becomes a late hit, and given the attention the NFL is placing on hits on defenseless receivers this year ...
Now that time has passed, I do at least have the perspective to realize that it didn't cost the Lions the game: not only did they have two more tries at the end zone, they also had a ton of plays before that on which they did something stupid. The timing of the play gave it a greater impact than if it had happened in the first quarter, but the effect is the same: just another bad thing that happened to a bad team.
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You forget the 'defense-less receiver' rule.
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... What's going on in Cards vs Rams? The Cards turn it over on their own 20. The Rams, kindly enough, decide to give the ball right back.
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I thino that, despite two weeks of gameplanning, no one was ready to play football. Either that, or no one WANTED to play football.
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Double post. Go football.
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Cards punt, Bradford arm=punts. Is anyone actually going to score here except by accident?
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Welcome to the NFC West.
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Going through the mind of Derek Anderson: ouch.
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I LOVE the Eagles throwbacks.
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I was wondering why their uniforms looked different.
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I strongly dislike them--they make the team look slow and ridiculous.
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On the Eagles-Packers game, why were the commentators talking about widescreen TVs?
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Because this year FOX is putting the SD feeds in widescreen.
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Interesting.
Combine that with them having Pereira on live broadcasts explaining rules (even the dumb ones) and score two big points for FOX.
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Nasty looking injury to Leonard Weaver there, bad blow for the Eagles if they lose him
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He just got knee-barred. Very nasty looking hyperextension.
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And Green Bay's O-Line woes from the beginning of last season seem to have resurfaced
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The Colts Pass Pro and Run D were horrendous, but they actually could have won without some key mistakes/poor execution on O.
If they can get simple competence from the OL and run D they'll be a contender.
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Stewart Bradley just got knocked the hell out. He looked stumbled down drunk. Weaver hurt, Ryan Grant can't put any weight on his right leg, Kolb got hit hard. They're piling up.
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And he's back in a couple of plays later.
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Yep, nice to see all the pre-season bluster about increased awareness of concussions go out the window once we are into a game that matters.
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DOn't be naive. He's ok now. And I'm sure he is and feels that way. Right now? Fine. Tomorrow? Sore, but that's normal.
And 2 years from now he doesn't remember.
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And the first linebacker on the Eagles goes down...
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I found the HB injury a lot uglier. He must have torn something. Hopefully is't just a week thing, worst it's a ligament and a year thing.
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Yeah, I cringed when I saw the replay. It was really good camera work; they definitely got the best angle for it. But yeah, that was not pretty.
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This game getting really brutal now. Kevin Kolb gets pounded into the dirt and is very slow getting up. Then Ryan Grant hobbles off with what looks like an ankle sprain, and Stewart Bradley gets knock unconscious on consecutive plays. Difficult to watch.
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1st play of the Eagles season:
Illegal formation, 6 men on the line of scrimmage...
Nice 'wrinkle' dude. Did that take you all off seasons long to think of that?
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Jennings makes an unbelievably great catch, and Bradley comes back a few plays after.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
Funny note.
I have Payton Manning. Loses 24-34... 35 fantasy points.
My opponent has Matt Schaub. Win 24-34... 8 fantasy points.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
QBs facing the Colts are rarely good plays. If the Colts win your QB more than likely was forced into an awful situation late trying to attack deep on a D designed to take that away. If the Colts lose it your QB probably spent the vast majority of the game handing off and dinking/dunking.
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So... that Mike Williams play was a TD but Calvin Johnson's wasn't?
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No. He was down at the one.
And he was running with the ball and in clear possession of it, so it's not really comparable at all.
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OK then.
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Bradford threw his first TD pass, score is tied...
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Alex Smith: Not an NFL calibre quarterback.
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Yet somehow, this fact still hasn't been established yet.
P.S. Bring in Troy Smith.
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What was the line in the Bears/Lions game? If it was Bears -4.5, that would explain the overturned TD.
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Bears -7
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Crap, there goes that conspiracy theory.
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The line given on the big sports radio show here in Detroit on Friday was Bears -4, iirc. Don't know where they got the number though.
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Kolb and Bradley out with concussions. Great.
Nice run by Vick.
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Wey hey! Vick in for a concussed Kolb in Philly. First play: scramble left end for 23 yards. Turnover 2 plays later. Urngh.
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Some guy with Vick on the back of jersey runs for 23 yards, only to see Eldra Buckley fumble on the next play. Perhaps Buckley needed a vapor rub?
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I want Max Hall to get into the ARI/STL game so that it's a battle of rookie QBs, one of which was the #1 pick the other being undrafted. And the latter to do better.
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So Bradly Wasn't concussed and Kolb was.
There you go. Answeres any answer your question askes.
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that're my bestest gramars
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is poster drunk?
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I'll let Raiderjoe answer that one.
Can you also react on the subject raised?
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I'm as big a Rodgers fan as anyone, but the talk of him being MVP seems premature to me. He still makes too many bad decisions and bad throws to break into that elite category (unless you share John Clayton's definition).
But man, when he's on... what a QB. Such an amazing arm.
So far today he's waffled from great to bad a few times. Eliminate the mistakes and this game would be a 30 point blowout. (OK, as it is it's now 20-3. So that's not that bold a claim, I guess.)
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You do realize he only threw 7 INTs all of last year, right? Can't reconcile that with too many bad decisions.
This was not his best game, however he really only made one bad throwing decision (the first INT, second seemed to slip out of his hands), and even that was on a 3rd and 15 from midfield so it was as good of a time to force a ball down the deep middle as any.
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As a big Rodgers fan, I can assure you that I'm well aware of his statistics.
The term decisions encompasses more than the throws he makes.
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Packers OL seems to have regained their composure as of halftime. And man, is Kuhn a bruiser.
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You know, Coach Wisenhunt, there's an old saying that says: Those who cannot trick, get tricked easily.
Wow...that statement's more confusing than the center snapping the ball to Derek Anderson while Fitzgerald is going in motion...
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Dear San Fransisco,
Release. Alex. Smith.
Sincerely,
49ers/Football Fans
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Vick driving the Eagles down the field. And now Jason Peters is hurt.
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Mike Vick and Matt Hasselbeck are playing rejuvenated today. It's almost as if the disappearance of Mora breathing down their necks... Ah screw it, I just wanted to bash Mora.
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Derek Anderson is making me very tired.
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The Eagles defense is full of fail today.
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I hope McNabb doesn't injure himself doing the watusi during this Iggles/Pack game. I may need some points from him tonight.
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I wish Joe Buck would shut his trap. Vick didn't have room to run for a first down just now - Clay Matthews was on spy duty, and I think Michael has had enough of getting hit by Clay. Just once would be (and was) enough. You'd think that even if Joe didn't notice, Troy would chime in.
Then a fair catch by the Packer punt returner is ignored by an Eagle tackler. That's a lot of shooting oneself in the foot (or other body parts) going on for the Iggles today.
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Does anyone think that Ken Whisenhunt and Larry Fitzgerald wish that they hadn't cut Matt Leinart? Derek Anderson isn't fit for the Arena League.
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So how close are we to a QB controversy in Philly?
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Close? There's been a QB controversy in Philly since the first quarter.
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of 1999.
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That's not fair- there was a 20-minute stretch during the 2000s where the Eagles fans liked McNabb.
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I was on the road for most of the first half, I missed that part of the game. My apologies.
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So Alex Smith sucks, Hasselbeck is good and Vick is good. My time machine works!!
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Careful. You don't want to bring back 2005 Kyle Orton.
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Sure we do. He was a lot of fun to watch- then again, I wasn't a Bears fan and I enjoy crappy QB play.
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However, as a Denver fan, I would prefer to keep the current Kyle Orton as opposed to bringing back the rookie version.
I would guess that DDF will agree with me on that.
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I agree, for once.
CuTlEr RuLeZ.
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I have decided against ever again discussing the Second Coming.
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Ryan Clady gave up 2.5 sacks today. Maybe it's the knee injury? oh but this is after 7-8 sacks given up last season. And he still can't runblock very well. But I guess the internet meme that says he's the best young LT in the game hasn't been affected one jot.....amazing what an overhyped rookie season can get you.
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Cutler > Orton
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ealges are too late,
game over. Buck think\s its not
he is quite naive
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You are too early.
Another interception.
Eagles coming back?
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Then again, perhaps not...
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Suck it, Easterbrook
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Joe Buck: "Nate Allen was drafted, ironically, with a pick the Eagles got from trading Donovan McNabb."
Ironically? This is an especially egregious use of the word.
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80% inlcuding the dumb people think they understand irony.
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I thought the exact same thing when he said that. Not sure what he could possibly think is ironic about that.
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Vick gives the fans a crash course in Decision-Making 101. Wow, he had better choices on that 3rd-and-goal play.
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duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
That's what I feel like after wathcing that.
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27-20, kickoff 5.43 in the 4Q...
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Derek Anderson. Just. Wins. Games.
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Two time-outs burned with 5 minutes left in the 4th quarter. The Andy Reid School of Clock Management never ceases to amaze me.
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Well, he save like a minute and a half doing that. If he hadn't, they would have just turned it over on down with 30 seconds left instead of 2 minutes.
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That was actually optimal use of those time outs (unusual for Reid). The best thing you can possibly do with a time out when you're trailing is to extend the game clock by 40 seconds. 40 seconds saved with 5 minutes left count just as much as 40 seconds saved with 2 or 3 minutes left. Offensive timeouts save much less than that because you have far more control of the clock on offense.
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Exactly
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Why would it have taken the Eagles 40 seconds to get a play off there had Reid not called a timeout? The clock was stopped for the measurement, giving them plenty of time to choose two plays, one for 4th and short, one for 1st down.
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Seeing as they were on defense, the Eagles really didn't have any control of how much time would elapse before the next snap, unless they called a timeout.
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Yeah, Reid actually did save some time with his clock management (not that Buck and Aikman figured this out or understood it). The only problem I can see with what Reid did is that burning all of his timeouts meant that he couldn't challenge a play if there was a questionable call in the few minutes before the two minute warning. (Since I didn't watch the entire game, I don't know if the Eagles had used up their challenges. I assume they had not done so.)
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Clay Matthews just never stops. What a beast.
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If I'm gonna run Vick, it's gonna be to the outside.
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Oh look, Reid used his timeouts improperly and can't stop the clock, so the game will end on kneeldowns.
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There is no mathematically possible way that those timeouts could have better been used to extend the game. Had he not used them when he did, the Packers would have simply run those 2 minutes off the clock earlier rather than later. 40 seconds is 40 seconds.
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Got it. I was mistaken about the use of one of them
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Surely you have to use the running back if you are going to run straight up the middle in that situation? I mean at least he has a chance of ploughing through the traffic for a couple of yards unlike, say, a quarterback.
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Fitzgerald has 3 catches on 15 targets?!
He may be showing up in Quick Reads, in a bad way.
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That's the kind of stat that raises all kinds of questions about "chemistry and/or timing between QB and WR," given the time missed by the injured Fitz and the fact that Anderson wasn't on the team last year and wasn't on the *first* team until the third week of preseason. That's 12 out of 19 incompletions thrown to Fitz.
But seriously, is it just me or do the Cardinals have basically no OL? We knew that they can't run-block (especially with their best back injured), but we've seen Warner lose games out there when they decide that pass-blocking is also optional, so I don't even want to see the blood and gore when they apply that to Anderson.
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
welcome to the derek anderson era!
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That Rams 2 Minute Drill might be the Worst that I have ever seen. The most ridiculous had to be the Draw up the middle on 3rd Down with 10 seconds left in the game when trailing 17-13 from the 40 yard line.
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That, or the fact that Bradford was throwing two-yard passes while down four points with 30 seconds left in the game at midfield. Um, the end zone? It's way down that way.
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That was a fourth down play, which does make a difference. They either take their one shot at the end zone on that play, or try to get a few more yards with a high percentage of getting the first down, and then try their shot. Not a terrible choice, in my mind.
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Agreed; it's the dinking and dunking leading up to that point that was the problem (to say nothing of NOT taking the TO after the :37 catch). 1:21 and three time-outs should be more than enough time for any team to either get down the field successfully or at least fail to do so because the defense actually stopped them/forced incompletions/etc., not because of an unwillingness to run plays designed to gain the needed yardage.
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Vick was playing against a defense that was in borderline prevent most of the fourth quarter. If Reid lets himself get fooled into thinking that Vick can complete enough passes to be a starter he is not as smart as I thought.
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The thing I love about Cowboys games is they inevitably send my buddy Brian the Cowboys fan into a meltdown 2-3 times a game where he unloads on Wade, Garrett and Jerry.
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More meltdowns this game by Cowboys fans or Eagles fans, do you think?
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Nice cheap shot from Jay Ratliff on McNabb on his first attempt.
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I'd say that this first drive shows what a huge improvement McNabb makes for Washington.
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Dez Bryant and DeAngelo Hall are in an argument. Who's shocked?
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Marion Barber isn't a quarterback, it turns out. Nice wildcat try though.
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And the 'Boys miss a FG. Why does it seem like Dallas is always having kicker problems?
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I'm going to go ahead and assume it's because they chose to go with a kicker that couldn't even fill in for two games last year, even though he was already on the gameday roster as the kick-off specialist. But that's jsut me...
- Alvaro
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Ray Lewis, nobody wants to hang out with you. Cause we're afraid of getting stabbed.
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Ahh, the Cowboys.
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I enjoyed that ending to the first half. I actually think Choice was considering throwing the ball, thinking that Romo lateraled it backwards to him.
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Brilliant way to end the half, Wade....
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I can't wait to hear Joe Theismann criticize the play on NFL Network. I hope one of his colleagues then brings up the name "Jack Squirek."
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Touchdown Herm Edw - er, DeAngelo Hall!
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Timeouts? We don't need no stinkin' timeouts!
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This game feels like both teams just seeing how poorly they can play.
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What the hell is going on in this game? Gametracker is making it seem like they canceled the football game and brought on the Blue Man Group or something.
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So somehow, that whole series post Scandrick's jumping off-sides somehow works out in Dallas' favor?
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Insert the cliche about never taking points off the board here.
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Punting on 4th and 1 down 10 on your opponent's 41 is pretty weak.
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Well... in hindsight, with that crappy Washington punt, it wasn't so bad.
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I will never watch another NFL game. I'm not even a Lion's fan, but a team goes through all that only to be cheated out of a win by a completely nonsensical rule. Changing the rule now doesn't help Lions fans, goodbye NFL.
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Really? I didn't watch the game and have no vested interest in the game, but I've seen PLENTY of sporing events with teams I DO care about get jobbed out of victory due to crappy calls. It happens all the time. If you're willing to give up a sport for this, I'm guessing you weren't much of a fan to begin with.
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He's either a troll, or someone who just watched his first NFl game this week. That's all I can conclude from that statement.
- Alvaro
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Bad calls are bad calls. They happen. Bad calls that stand up to multiple reviews despite being obviously wrong are embarrassing. I was ashamed for the NFL watching an obviously wrong call get "justified" a number of different ways. Why have replay if you're going to make that call?
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Fair enough. Again, I haven't seen the play so I don't know. But don't give up the whole game!
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Well, except for the fact that it WASN'T a bad call. It was the correct call 100%. You may disagree with the rule (which I personally don't) but, just like with the tuck-rule, the rule not being what you think it should be doesn't change the fact that the rule must be called correctly and consistently. Under the current rule-book, calling that a touchdown WOULD have been a very bad call.
- Alvaro
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
except that there are two ways to interpret the rule.
A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground.
B) the receiver must contain possession till he is down on the ground (for a couple seconds).
I interpret it as the first scenario. Once his two feet are in he needs to complete the motion to the ground, if it is part of the catching motion. Once his left knee hits the ground it should be ruled a touchdown as the finishing move, in my interpretation. The calvin catch should have been a touchdown if thats the interpretation. Im personally not understanding why he would need to maintain control after his knee is down. he would have been ruled down on any other yardline on the field. The lions lost a game that they won due to a misinterpretation of the rule. but hey thats just me.
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"A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground."
Except the NFL has never interpreted it that way. Never.
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"except that there are two ways to interpret the rule.
A) the receiver must contain possession till first contact with the ground.
B) the receiver must contain possession till he is down on the ground (for a couple seconds)."
Or C) The way the NFl has always interpreted it: The reciever must mantain control until the montion of falling ot the ground is over, ie, his momentum from the fall ends.
"The calvin catch should have been a touchdown if thats the interpretation. Im personally not understanding why he would need to maintain control after his knee is down. he would have been ruled down on any other yardline on the field."
No he really, really, REALLY would not have been. As seen (by now I'm sure you can all say it with me kids!) on every other game it has happened in the middle of the field.
"The lions lost a game that they won due to a misinterpretation of the rule. but hey thats just me."
Seeing how every single comentator who has chimed in, from Pereira who we can probably call the foremost authority on teh subject, to Kirwan who thinks the rule should be changed and generally couldn't find his own behind with a map, to the Head Coach of the Detroit Lions, agree that the rule was called correctly, I'm pretty confident in saying that yes, it IS just you.
- Alvaro
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I hate the play-call of a toss to the short side of the field. If you're relying on speed to get to the outside and cut forward to get 2 years, why not use the far side where you have an extra few yards to outrun the other team?
Re: Week 1 Open Discussion Thread
I've never understood this either, Lance. The reason it's done seems to be, "Well, it just is." I could see doing it occasionally, as a change-of-pace, but it really seems that the majority of toss plays go to the short side.