Talk amongst yourselves
7/29: KC IDP, STL RB
7/27: ARI TE, various IDP updates.
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09 Sep 2012
Here's the thread for open discussion of all the Week 1 NFL games. Happy season, everyone. We made it.
Posted by: Rivers McCown on 09 Sep 2012
160 replies , Last at
20 Sep 2012, 3:55am by
Huzzah. Two of the teams I love to see lose in the opener...not sure what I want to see happen. Witten is out so I think it could be tough for Dallas.
well Witten is playing... how healthy he is and whether he signed that medical waiver we don't know
edit: oops double post
hi , i am newbie i also agree that Witten is out and it would be very tough for dollas. love to play fooyball but i dont know enough about it can anyone of you guys help me out ?
Be sure join a star-studded cast of your favorite FO posters for another season of IRC football chat! Point your favorite IRC client to bendenweyr.dyndns.org, channel #fo
Or for a web-based solution, just use this mibbit link: http://chat.mibbit.com/?channel=%23fo&server=bendenweyr.dyndns.org
Coughlin cannot hide the disgust with the hip-hop anthem from his face
rubbing, son, is racin'.
heh Tiki rebooted.
Good grief. Failed fourth down. As if FO wasn't prescient enough. That was one of Dallas' biggest bugbears that they needed to correct for this season--short yardage conversion. Ay caramba.
Nice catch by Bryant, but what the heck was he doing running down the field after the play was over?
I just figured with the replacement officials he might as well take a shot.
I think he was trying to convince everyone that his knee didn't touch. But even if that were correct, which I doubt, the play was clearly blown dead.
The no-call PI spearheads what promises to be an interesting week or few with the replacement refs. Nice job of Collinsworth to point it out. You might have thought the broadcasters would be in collusion with the league in trying to be mum about it.
Please, the regular officials were practically random with their calls. At least these officials aren't calling a one-sided game and haveing done anything criminally ridiculous yet.
The regular officials, for all their flaws, could typically see a jersey being grabbed and tugged on a wide receiver.
Maybe for marquee players, but anyone else, they're as likely to ignore them being out and out tackled before the ball bounces off them.
Agreed. I don't think there's been much difference between these refs and the regular guys. I've seen the regular guys miss as much as these refs have.
I thought the refs were great, if anything they called the game a little more closely (which is good)
They seemed pretty okay to me too. There was a block in the back that got called a clip and a missed DPI that I thought was clear, but other than that I didn't see anything was clearly wrong. There were some things that looked close that I think they screwed up, but that's pretty much the usual.
Replacement reps may undo the pro-offense rules changes from the past few years with their own incompetence
Second short-yardage situation, Garrett calls a long pass, basically saying wtf, a free play to try whatever, because we're certainly not picking up the down with a run. The call reminded me of that game when Jeff Fischer just onside kicked every time against the Colts because he knew he couldn't stop them!
This Giants/Cowboys game is about as exciting as last years opener...
This game is quite a clinic on the irrelevance of o-line play in the modern NFL. Tuck and Pierre-Paul are feasting on this line, and Romo is off the hook. Color me impressed.
This seems like as good a place as any to post this: I nominate the ad campaign for NFL.com and NFL Network featuring the weird guy in the blue suit for worst ad campaign of the year. It will be tough to top (or should I say bottom?) those awful commercials.
I actually like these ads. Though I admit I'm kinda like the weird guy.
It figures that a Packers fan likes these ads and also admits to being "like the weird guy." (I kid, I kid. As a Bears fan, I love the fact that fans of fierce rivals like the Bears and Packers can have intelligent discussions here about their teams and other topics without the pointless name calling and trolling that is littered throughout the comments of other websites.)
It's ok. I know I'm weird even for a Packers fan.
Terrible. Forced weird for "shock" value. They're like the Brian Wilson of adds.
That's the way ads are headed in today's world. It's not even about making sense as long as it's memorable. It was so weird it got the originator of this thread to talk about it. That's all they care about.
Does anyone know if the oft repeated comment that Al Michaels just made, that RBs tend to finally break good gains in the second half and are often stuffed in the first half has any validity? Are there numbers on that?
Either there are three people in the stands, or NBC could do a better job of incorporating crowd noise in the audio.
You can hear them any time Cruz catches the ball. I just think the crowd hasn't been into the game.
Maybe because Cruz hasn't had a catch since the 1st quarter
FOA spilled a fair amount of ink talking about how rookie CBs are not that good. What's up with the NYG offense in this game, eh? The DAL pass rush hasn't been that impressive...
The DBs are standing there watching the Giants WR straight drop the balls they juggled and caught half of last year. Right now, Cruze could be shutdown by a cardboard cutout of fairy Deon taped to an RC car.
The cardboard cutout is a much better tackler.
Really the best game of Romo's career?
Can we keep the hyperbole to a slightly less egregious level please?
No, we can't. I expect nothing less on television these days.
Anybody got a drop count on the Giants?
3 drops 3 should have hads?
I see that Cruz has been taking catching lessons from Martellus.
Anyone else think that was just all around poor play by both New York and Dallas? I expect a lot of breathless commentary (and I say this as quite a fan of The Ticket) in Dallas about beating the champs who are also a division rival, but I didn't see much play either team should be proud of. I did miss the whole third quarter so maybe there was something there.
I, for one, thought Romo had an impressive game. His pass-rush awareness was great. He made some signature boneheaded plays but also made some great plays, and the running back had a few great plays too. Otherwise, nothing too special.
I agree, Romo was great. I thought the Cowboys receivers and defense both played very well also, although that may just be because I'm used to atrocious defense from them, so "not too special" is a big improvement.
Ladies and Gentlemen, your New York Giants receivers.
Letting Wins, Interceptions, and Footballs Generally Slip Through Our Butter-Coated Fingers Since 2008.
Shannon Sharpe on Tebow / Sanchez -- "two bad cooks shouldn't open a restaurant."
Well, Tebow has been known to use too much mustard when it comes to throwing the football...
Too bad most of last year's hot dog WRs are gone.
Brandon Weedon got caught under the huge flag that was brought onto the pitch in Cleveland while he was warming up.
A foreshadowing of the game.
Okay, is it going to be common among QBs to slide with their head (instead of their feet) this year?
Ballsy call by TEN throwing from the shotgun on 4th and inches pays off.
How about the no-call in the endzone? It looked closer to me than Phil Simms seemed to think. I thought he got there a whisker before the ball.
I thought it looked close live but pretty clearly PI on replay.
Okay, it looked a lot worse in the replay.
Nice footwork by Brady on PA throwing back to his left to Gronk. Brady looks sharp early but has had some
First impression is that the Pats' safeties seems improved, showing up in the picture to cut down YAC, etc. but the corners... not so much.
RGIII has started 7/7 for 125 and a TD.
I'm a Pat's fan, but that was pass interference on the interception, right? Not that I'm complaining.
I thought it was a good no call actually. There was some contact but Arrington had position and was going for the ball. I hate those under thrown ball PI calls.
Under the replacement officials it seems that illegal contact is now allowed.
Doesn't look like much holding is called on either side of the ball, it would be interesting to see a comparison of the number of calls by type made this week compared to last year.
Now RGIII fakes a handoff, runs a bootleg to his left, pulls up, stiff arms a defender and then throws a comeback deep down the right sideline. This is getting scary. 8/8 for about 150 now.
Sounds like the Saints defense to me.
Reid and Castillo are definitely going to have to make some adjustments at halftime because Nnamdi Asomugha and Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie are getting KILLED off the slant.
Granted, I can't watch the game right now, but isn't Weedon under 50%, with 3.5 YPA? That's hardly getting killed.
Yeah, but a few of those completions came from quick slants plays where he was able to hit his wideouts.
Hightower is blowing guys up. That's the second time I've seen him blow up a blocker.
What in the world is up with NO? No defense at all?
And how about those Bills? There are gonna be some seats available on that bandwagon next week.
What was the reasoning behind the Bills bandwagon? Mario Williams helps the defense, but that by itself isn't enough, and there were reasons to believe that the second half was more representative of the offense than the first half (mainly that Ryan Fitzpatrick was playing at his normal level in the second half and was over his head the first half.)
Fitzpatrick apparently had cracked ribs through the second half, which was supposed to have been messing with his delivery. The Bills seem like they have fair talent-strong lines, great running backs, a good Number 1 receiver, reasonable linebackers and corners...
That's it, in a nutshell. Also, they have a soft enough schedule to sneak into a wild-card spot (NFC West and AFC South). Assuming they don't face-plant early in the season, it'll probably take three consecutive close losses to Jacksonville, St. Louis, and Seattle in December to fully knock them out of playoff contention.
(I also like the Eagles)
I dunno about that with regards to Ryan Fitzpatrick. The Jets looked like they were playing prevent pretty much the entire second half. Granted the way the Jets played on defense in the first half, Fitzpatrick is unlikely to play a better pass defense all year long. Wow.
The Patriots defense, so far, looks amazingly better. Outstanding run defense, and the pass defense might not be defensing passes, but they aren't getting ruined after the catch like they were last year.
Refs missed DPI on the Patriots for one pass, but it was much clearer on replay than it was live, so not a terrible miss. Excellent non-call on the interception; both guys going for the ball, and looked like both pushed off the other a little. Actually coming up with that pass was pretty amazing, too--bobbled while falling forward and you manage to keep hold of the ball?
The pass rush does not look radically improved. Looks like much better lane discipline and hustle from the linebackers, and better safety play. Corners have more flexibility in coverage because the safeties are actually in the picture.
Indeed. Pass rush looks "good enough", though it seems they aren't really focusing on putting pressure--looks to me that the front seven are focused on completely shutting down the running game, and containing Locker so he can't start breaking runs. It's working since he isn't good enough as a passer (though I'm impressed at some of his passes) to make them pay for giving him time to work.
I'm even more impressed that the pass defense has held up well enough without the threat of significant pressure.
"wasn't" good enough as a passer. Yeesh.
In the Pats-Titans tilt, did anyone see what happened to Sebastian Vollmer? Simms just passingly mentioned that Marcus Cannon was back in the line-up, but there's been no indication at all...
To answer my own question, interestingly, the Patriots have been rotating the two players at Right Tackle...
Before the snap, DT #71 of the Bears gets up from his stance and has to balance himself on #69, knocking him face-first into the dirt. #69 has to pick himself off the ground before he can resume the pass rush, but the play ends in a Luck interception anyway. Beautiful pick by Tim Jennings.
ETA: On the replay, Dierdorf says he should have been called offsides (questionable, in my opinion), but somehow ignoring the comedy of knocking your own teammate down before the snap.
Dierdorf misses a lot. On that PI call against Hester he claimed the player Hester ran into and shoved was making a play for the ball, when in fact the ball flew right behind him and Hester only shoved the guy in disgust with the busted play. If anything, the Colts defender interfered, but the ball was uncatchable and it should have been a no call.
I don't know that it was uncatcheable - Hester couldn't continue on his route because Zbikowski stop dead in his tracks and obstructed him. Zbikowski didn't make a play on the ball - he just stopped and prevented the receiver from running his route.
I'll agree with that, since I'm watching a pretty pixelated feed. Just very annoying for Dierdorf to completely mis-describe the play, to say nothing of the refs.
Stafford has way too much confidence in his arm.
I don't really understand the logic behind the fumble through the back of the endzone touchback rule. Seems pretty severe.
I don't think so. A defense forces a fumble near the goal line. Why should the offense be rewarded for losing the ball?
Why should a change of possession be awarded when it hasn't occurred? Why is the end zone treated differently than anywhere else on the field?
Normally if a ball goes out of bounds after a fumble, the team who had possession last keeps it. But if it's a fumble through the end zone, that changes possession to the defense.
If the offense is tackled with the ball in the field, they keep it (or turn it over on downs). If they're tackled in their own end zone, it's a safety.
Tannehill has thrown 18 times already; 3 of those have been picks.
Brady has now thrown about 4 passes in a row super low, skidding off the turf... what in the world could cause that? Quarterbacks always throw high when they're jittery.
He's throwing off his back foot cause the Titans are getting some pass rush. Not getting a lot on the ball.
It turns out he's distantly related to Donovan McNabb.
Washington looks surprisingly good. And Griffin seems to be on target and totally with the game plan. Is NO's problem just a lack of a head coach? Or not enough game film on a rookie QB? Or is Washington actually just that good?
Quietly, I'd say the Patriots' most successful phase in this game has been special teams. I wouldn't be surprised if they have the Number 1 ST DVOA after this week.
Welker is an afterthought in this offense which is crazy.
Jim Nantz just reminisced about the Patriots' 2001 Super Bowl victory over the Saints. Boy that was something, whupping Haslett and Aaron Brooks on their home field, eh?
"Saints" is just a short form for "St. Louis" you know.
Just wondering what Brees has to do to be whistled for intentional grounding. Apparently "shoveling the ball forward to an empty area of the field while being tackled" isn't quite enough.
He's gotten away with this twice today.
Brandon Weeden just tried really hard to throw his 4th INT, but DRC let it bounce off his chest.
However, the game is only 10-9 to Philly because Vick has also thrown 3 INTs, soon to be trying for his 4th.
Vick throws a Pick Six.
Weeden and Vick are each determined to prove they can be the worst QB in week one. Since they're playing each other, they can even compete directly!
I'd say Vick won this, he is more experienced and threw a pick six.
The score in this competition finished 4 INTs each. Weeden pulled a Grossman and threw a couple to Kurt Coleman, too.
Just shocking CB play there by the Minnesota corner.
If you're Detroit why not run down and throw a fade to Megatron instead of a spike there?
Man Cutler has a gun. That thing got downfield FAST.
Redskins are crushing, now, and the mics pick up chants of "R-G-3" in the Superdome.
Saints' defense has looked every bit of their FO projected 32nd rank.
RGIII will get the headlines. However, the biggest story of the game was how Washington's front seven dominated the Saints' offensive line. It was ugly.
First the niners' gunner is penalised for a block in the back, which is just stupid.
Then they get a free yard resulting in a first down.
Then Aldon Smith's helmet gets kicked sacking Aaron Rodgers, starts to come off and so Aldon Smith takes it off and the refs give him an unsportsmanlike contact.
Fucking amateur refs.
I think it evens out with that call on Matthews
“Treat a man as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a man as he could be, and he will become what he should be.”
I didn't really understand why Aikman thought that was a bad call. The ball was out and then Matthews decides to jump on the quarterback's back with both arms around his neck, I don't care who the refs are, that's getting called all year.
And they missed a more advantageous DPI on the same play.
And one borderline 15 yard play doesn't equate to another which came after a big sack.
Bears looked pretty good, if anybody cares.....
The defense looks very good. Tim Jennings somehow has had a mid-career burst of suddenly becoming good, with Wright and Conte healthy, that means there are no soft spots in the Bears starters.
I really wish next week's game was on Sunday, as I'd like to see how the teams matchup with a full week to rest and prepare. As it is, I think the Packers will have a big advantage since they're all in the same system for 3 years in a row now.
The Packers' advantage may be somewhat negated by the fact that I think they will be pretty banged up after this game against the 49ers. This is a very physical and intense game reminiscent of Steelers-Ravens games and old school Bears-Packers games. I wouldn't be surprised to see a fight break out in the second half. It might even involve Jim Harbaugh and the officials. (I'm only slightly kidding about that last part.)
I care, greatly. I agree they looked good after a horrific first 5 minutes. I love all the weapons they have on offense now. New additions Marshall, Jeffery and Bush all made huge contributions. Forte and Cutler also had big games (after that awful start by Cutler), and Bennett made some big plays, too.
On defense, Jennings had an outstanding game: 2 picks, a deflected pass that resulted in another pick (by Conte in the end zone), and several other passes defensed. The pass rush was pretty good, too, even though they only had 3 sacks. They rested Urlacher once they had a big lead. I just hope Tillman's ankle injury isn't a long-term thing.
Special teams were solid, including a forced fumble and recovery on a kickoff return.
I think it's more of a case of the Colts really being that bad. Both the O-Line and the D-Line for the Colts are truly terrible. I wouldn't read a whole lot out of that whupping.
Better to whoop bad teams than to not.
Yeah. I don't have any illusions about this Bears team being unbeatable or even being a lock to make the playoffs, but I would say that overall they did everything I could have asked them to do yesterday. As bad as the game started out for the offense, they looked great the rest of the way. The defense looked pretty good too, only giving up 14 points (admittedly to a bad team), and once the Bears' offense got going I never really felt like there was any doubt that they were going to win the game.
I'd say for the Bears, putting up 41 points against anybody is pretty good. They're definitely going to need to be a high-scoring team this year if they're to be competitive and yesterday was a good start. So while I'm not reading too much into yesterday's game, they certainly performed up to my expectations. If they had eked out a 3 point win or (God forbid) lost to the Colts, then I'd take more away from the game and be pretty concerned.
Niners D shows a new two man line formation, Smiths with hands down, then rush six including Rogers, which is also unlike last year.
Not much to say about the game, but it's nice to see a 49ers/Packers game in primetime. The mid/late '90s matchups were a staple of my NFL watching childhood.
And that wasn't DPI in the end zone, they even called it on Goldson who wasn't involved anyway. The 49ers are getting hosed by the refs.
These refs are just bad. They've also missed several calls that should have gone against the Niners.
Staley just jumped early, no flag. Horror show by the officials. Monkeys in hats could do as well, monkeys in hats and uniforms would be a clear improvement.
That false start on Bulaga should have been a neutral zone infraction on Aldon Smith.
Did anyone else notice that CBS had a graphic during the Colts-Bears game that referred to Colts TE Coby Fleener as "Toby Fleener"? That was embarrassing.
Wait, his name isn't Toby? (Yes, I saw that, and yes, embarrassing.)
I read an article about him recently that said his name "Coby" is actually short for "Jacoby." According to the article, he was named for former Redskins offensive lineman Joe Jacoby.
Did you notice that Bob Ryan was the Cowboy's defensive coordinator?
Seems the networks are using replacement officials, too.
We now know David Akers exact range for field goals.
FOX showed the wrong block when trying to see whether or not there was a block in the back on the punt return TD, they should have showed the block on Anthony Dixon. (I'm still not sure whether or not it was a penalty.)
Now they show the right block and it was a blatant block in the back. The replacement refs are ruining the best game of the week.
Gee, why call that now? The Niners DBs have been grabbing the Packers WRs all game.
I really disagree.
And you'd be wrong. The Packers were less physical when they had Al Harris.
Being physical doesn't necessarily mean committing penalties. I assume that you are talking about the OPI where Culliver touched the GB receiver with his hand before he was shoved by two hands in the chest or the Rogers non call where Jennings was annoyed that he wasn't penalised, in the latter case there wan't a great deal of contact, if Jennings had come back towards the ball then it would have been a DPI. That happened a couple of times.
The Packers receivers are some of the best at the little shoves and pushes that spring a guy open. The 49ers like to jam the opponents and play two safeties over the top because their defense can shut down the run with seven men. There is going to be contact.
Perhaps I am hideously biased but I thought the refs massively favoured Green Bay, most of the big, awful calls went against the 49ers. ie. Dixon was blocked in the back on that punt return.
Officiating aside, I thought the 49ers played a blinder apart from that three man rush nonsense in the 4th quarter. The punt return TD should have been called back and the niners deserved to win by two TDs.
No. I'm talking about plays like when Jones got grabbed on the "free play" early in the game and several other plays where they were held. The Niners DBs were holding all game.
I just cannot see what you are talking about. The defense is allowed to jam at the line and to get in the way without holding or committing DPI.
Which is apparently 10 or more yards downfield if you play for the SF secondary.
Dolphins offense: not very good. The Texans did not play particularly well (horrific on special teams) but the 'Phins look headed for the #1 pick to me. Good front seven, decent running game, but nothing else, and that is not how you build a team in today's NFL.
I wanna know the DVOA on that drive, that was brutal.
Admittedly, I haven't seen much of the games today, but what I have seen are multiple easy-to-correct bad calls by the refs. Again, I saw only about the first quarter of the NE/Tenn game, and the same for Indy/Chi, and then tonight's game, but in just that short time, the sub refs have been really weak. NE had a PI not called in the end zone on Tenn's first drive (not that the call would have changed much in that blowout!), and in the Chicago and Denver games it seems easy things are being missed: offsides, false starts, too many on the field, TD call (reversed, rightly, in one game I saw a snippet of).
I know the real refs make mistakes as well, but some of these are simply too easy to miss, like the false starts and too many on the field.
(PS: Side note: I like the fact that my Colts played smart today in one aspect, just like BB"s Patriots did as well: be really, really physical as pass defenders. The sub refs just don't seem to want to call too many penalties, and so find out how much you can get away with. Unfortunately for me, the Colts couldn't change much of the overall tone of the game by doing that, I see from the score. I expect this was happening with offensive linemen and holding as well -- the teams with smart coaches were told to test the refs by seeing what they could get away with -- but I couldn't see that on tv. But, why wouldn't you test the replacement refs?)
Thomas Davis and Steve Smith showed up for us, and Cam did as well as he could with Silatolu getting relentlessly blown up. Yipes?
Sentence of the week: "NO! Before the snap!"
When the DEN/PIT game is over, I want to see a comparison of Pittsburgh's DVOA on 1st-2nd downs and on 3rd down. They've been absurd since the touchdown drive on the first half.
Whether it's backed up by facts or not, it seemed like third down was where the steelers were making their money from their first drive. It seemed like they were stuffed on consecutive runs to start many of their first half drives and picked up long third down conversions on passes to the intermediate left.
DISCLAIMER - Not a Cleveland fan.
But am I the only one thinking Colt McCoy cannot be THAT bad? 4 picks 5 QBR from a 28yo rookie. How much better can he get before he retires?
Coach Tomlin needs to go
Velvet Sky fan
I know it was just the Browns, but the Eagles' defense WAS very good. The linebackers are improved, as DeMeco Ryans and Mychal Kendricks made several plays, especially Ryans. He made a nice tackle of a short pass on third down, stopping the receiver short immediately after the catch and forcing a punt. The corners played good, even though I must point out that there were several open receivers, some in the end zone, that Weeden just missed wildly. Nnamdi, DRC, and Brandon Boykin were pretty good in coverage for the most part. Here's a "hidden play" treat: On an end-around in the 2nd quarter, Nnamdi hustles from across the field to make the tackle and prevent a touchdown. A few plays later, the Eagles come away with an interception, taking potential points off the board in a 1-point game.
It looked like Andy Reid was trying to "punish" the offense by calling time outs at the end of the 1st half to get one more posession, and fortunately, it worked out. It may just been me, but Jeremy Maclin certainly appears "larger" this year.
I'm not sure what I can say about the offense that won't be talked about all week. Perhaps Andy was discouraged from running because every time McCoy broke a nice run, holding was called. In the future, when you have one of the best backs in the league, never forget he is on your team!
"In the future, when you have one of the best backs in the league, never forget he is on your team!"
Westbrook was drafted in 2002, so this refrain has been heard for nearly 10 years now.
In the Ravens/Bengals game, the refs just had two of those small mistakes that are easy to gloss over, but which I've been seeing a lot of this weekend. First, the Bengal receiver makes a catch, tucks the ball, is hit after his feet hit the ground, starts to go to the ground, and the ball comes loose. That should either be a reception and a fumble or a reception and the ground causing the fumble. Instead, the refs say it was an incompletion.
On the next play, the Bengal receiver is beyond the 1st down marker, comes back to make the catch, which he clearly does beyond said marker, and then is hit by a Raven who drives him back two yards. The refs mark the spot based on where he was after being hit, giving him no credit for forward progress.
Tirico briefly mentions the spot as iffy, but the Bengals don't challenge and get the 1st down on 3rd and 1. (A good non-challenge since a successful challenge would only have given them 1 yard.)
In the UK, BBC television - in addition to not showing the game on a standard channel - have apparently decided not to bother with a presenter or studio analysis. Given the standard of their usual studio team, this may well be a good decision. Still, it looks and feels like it's this way out of disinterest rather than creativity.
Raiders lose their long snapper and suddenly their special teams fall apart.
And no, it's not the snapper's fault that the punt was blocked. The Raiders let a defender run through the line unblocked!
Strategy question: that punt for the last play of the game had to be a mistake, right? Things that could have gone wrong: bad snap, returned for TD; blocked punt, returned for TD; punt return, for TD. Clearly the right play was to snap the ball to a speedy player who could run backwards for 3 seconds then kneel on the ball. I know I've seen coaches do that before.
Or keep running all the way out of the back of the end zone.
Better yet, why not burn those 3 seconds by running a play on 3rd down rather than kneeling? Odd that they ran plays on 1st and 2nd down but not 3rd down.
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