Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

02 Jan 2011

Week 17 Open Discussion Thread

It's the final week of the year! Talk about the Week 17 action here.

Posted by: Bill Barnwell on 02 Jan 2011

165 replies , Last at 04 Jan 2011, 1:42am by The Ninjalectual

1
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by sicks tea nein (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:52am

Let's go, Rams!

2
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Paul R :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:05am

If they can beat the Saints next week, they can run the table.

3
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by greybeard :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:37am

If they get five wins in a row they are the super bowl champions.

4
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RickD :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:04am

If Sam Bradford were 600 feet tall, he could do pull-ups on the Gateway Arch!

5
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by BigCheese :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:08am

No. For them to run the table they have to beat the Saints (their easiest match-up in the play-offs) next week. Then they'll get killed in Atlanta.

- Alvaro

7
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dbt :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:13am

"Run the table": You keep using that [phrase]. I do not think it means what you think it means what you think it means.

55
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:13pm

If they win tonight and then beat the Saints, they might not play Atlanta. They'll only play Atlanta if the Eagles win their game against the #6 seed. I wouldn't be surprised if the Eagles lose if they end up playing the Packers. In that case, the Packers would play Atlanta, and the Rams would get to freeze in Chicago.

6
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by gratif1 (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:58am

32 possible NFC Scenarios:
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/1025/2010playoffs.png

64 possible AFC scenarios:
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/7240/2010afc.png

note: the noon games are the leftmost for simplified scratching purposes.

10
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:10am

This is very helpfull, thanks a bunch!

60
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:26pm

Yes, this is awesome!

64
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:40pm

I chopped the charts down based on the early game results. They are much simpler now, with 4 scenarios left for the AFC and 4 for the NFC.
http://fuckitimgoingdeep.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/lategameplayoffscenari...

8
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:06am

I'm most interested in the Chicago-Green Bay game. Will Chicago really play hard just to knock the Packers out of the playoffs?

9
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 10:15am

Yes. Yes a thousand times. But only because Brett Favre told Julius Peppers to do it.

11
puicks
by Raiderjoe :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:52am

Raiders 38, zchiefs 17
Jets 20, Biles 16
Steelers 24, browns 12
Eagles 24, cowbys 13
Patriots 24, dophisn 17
Lions 24, Vikigns 20
Falcons 31, Panthers 10
Packers 34, beras 13
Ravens 22, bengals 17
Giants 28, Resdkins 20
Saints 23, Bucs 19
Broncos 23, chahregsr 17 (Raiders fiish in 2nd place)
49ers 27, cardainals 13
texams 31, jguras 27
cotls 27, titans 24
Seahawkd 20, ramms 17

61
Re: puicks
by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:28pm

I want to get a zchiefs jersey

138
Re: puicks
by frvwfr2 :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:03pm

Well I want a chahregsr or jguras jersey!

155
Re: puicks
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:47am

13-3 record

not bad , will take that

here s to 2011 seaosn . Raiders goign to take AFC Wrs. alreayd proved better team than KC Cjiefs. Now goal is to win divison. 6-0 in divison games very psoissible again for 2011, just neend to win other games. Will. Have gerat chance to go 7-1 on road. Only at GB packlers is tough. Home slate tougher- pates,jets,b eras, loins. Loins impriving team. Wasnt bad pick when them doing good things 2010. lost several close games.

rmanling now. Forgot what also had planned originally. Will have to go to bed now No NFl tomorrow ngiht. Got collage gamme instead. Stanford vs Viginia Touch. Remeber hwne they used to be called Gobblers too? bets name ever maybe. Also Hokies at time but not only Hokies name used.

162
Re: puicks
by kamchatka (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 8:35am

Better watch it, Raiderjoe. A Virginia Touch got me arrested once.

164
Re: puicks
by Raiderjoe :: Tue, 01/04/2011 - 12:52am

l;ol meant Tech but wa thinking touch

had a little too nuch to drink in celebration of Raiders win anbd Chiefs falling to 4 seed where will get beat bad by Ravens

12
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by MattZ (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 1:38pm

If any Bears starters get hurt in this meaningless game, I will... um.... be upset?

13
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 1:56pm

According to gratif1's image the Bears can get the 1st seed if they win and Atlanta and the Saints lose.

I doubt Lovie plays important starters more than a half.

14
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:15pm

Panther football. Clicked over to watch the Falcons/Panthers game. The Falcons just scored and the Panthers fumble the kickoff return. Panthers did recover, though.

15
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by montanapanthersfan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:25pm

At least this season ends today!

16
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by montanapanthersfan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:27pm

And James Anderson causes a fumble as Turner's in the red zone, at the 5, with CJ Wilson recovering! The Cardiac Cats live again! ...probably for five seconds.

17
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by montanapanthersfan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:33pm

And we promptly give up a 55 yard punt return for a td. 14-0, Atlanta, and we haven't seen the 2nd quarter yet. Let's Go Draft!

19
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by montanapanthersfan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:36pm

And Jimmy Clausen is 2-5 for -1 yard. We have one yard of offense.

18
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:33pm

It's Kyle Boller time for the Raiders.

And Zach Miller's leg just bent in ways it shouldn't, yet he walked off.

20
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:45pm

Colt McCoy has had pass after pass go through his receiver's hands. One got picked off, one went to another brown, one would have been a touchdown...

21
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:49pm

Adrian Peterson had a 10 yard run on the firs series. His other five carries have netted -3 yards.

22
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 2:50pm

So, Brady is still playing for the Patriots, but Tyler Thigpen is now the QB for the Dolphins.

23
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:01pm

Pittsburgh has third and goal from the one. The announcer predicts that they'll go for it, as they are bringing in their big guys. His bold prediction that they will not kick a field goal on third down turns out to be true.

24
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:08pm

After an interception, they follow it up with this gem. "I wouldn't be surprised if they don't challenge it. They have nothing to lose by not challenging it."

First of all, let me go to the whiteboard to diagram that sentence. Wow, it actually turns out to be consistent. But it was the opposite of what you meant.

25
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:18pm

Maybe it's a former CFL announcer?

26
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Southern Philly :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:18pm

It feels like the Raiders already have 30 sacks today. I would not blame Cassel for taking a Jim Everett-like phantom sack.

27
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:25pm

Henne back in with 13 seconds left in the half. I guess Thigpen doesn't know the 15 second offense.

28
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:29pm

Glad to see the mistake on the lake getting buried. Nice showing so far by the Omars.

Expected them to play down to the Browns

------------------------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

29
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 3:58pm

Nice touchdown on a trick play, Steelers... (hand off to Randle-El who throws for TD), but did you need to bust it out in a game that was far out of reach? Might that not better serve you when it matters?

30
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:15pm

What the hell is wrong with CBS? PIT at CLE just got preempted by OAK at KC. You do not switch a game off in the middle.

32
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:18pm

35 point game vs 7 point game. Seems logical. Probably lots of people were screaming at TVs saying what was wrong with CBS for staying with this blowout while another game was close.

33
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:23pm

No, you don't advertise one game and then air another instead. I stayed home to watch the Steelers at Browns because it was on CBS at home. If I had known they would make such a moronic decision, I would have gone to a sports bar to watch.

People plan ahead how they are going to watch these games. You cannot advertise one game then show another. People weren't screaming at their TVs to change to the other game. People watching that game were watching it because they wanted to. If they wanted to see Raiders - Chiefs, they would have put on the Raiders Chiefs game.

Next up, a cut to Heidi instead of the final two minutes.

36
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:27pm

This is nothing new, they've been doing it for decades. I'll wager they have a disclaimer in anything official they advertised.

But it boils down to this. They estimate ratings numbers they get by staying with a blowout that only diehards and fantasy football people care about vs. ratings numbers by making the switch. Their job is to make the right choice for their TV station. They are taking into account the irate fans who were glued to the other game when they do this.

47
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:59pm

That's nonsense. You don't gain viewership by proving that you cannot be trusted to air what you have said you would air. So now in the future, prospective viewers of the game have to consider whether CBS will actually be showing that game. Many will find their football elsewhere. If the decision is based on expected single game ratings numbers like you suggest, it's remarkably short-sighted, and someone needs to have his career reconsidered.

52
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:03pm

Rereading that it may come across that I was calling your statement nonsense. I do not wish to convey that; ad-hominem bad. It may very well be true. I'm saying that if you are right, the decision would be nonsensical.

63
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by MJK :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:40pm

Except you might gain viewership if you estimate that the number of casual fans (or hardcore, non-team specific fans) who would appreciate a station switching to the best game currently showing outnumbers the number of fans that will get annoyed at the game switching from advertised. NOt saying that's true, but it's possilbe it's true, and CBS obviously thinks so.

Also, CBS might be feeling the pressure to switch to the best available game because of RZC.

68
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Arkaein :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:58pm

Where else are fans going to go? It's not like there are alternative stations that carry the same games.

You just need to face the fact that you are in a minority: a fan of a team outside of that team's viewing region. I for one said "Hallelujah" when CBS switched away from that game, all I cared about was seeing a competitive game.

EDIT: and in case you think I like that fact, know that I just swore loudly and and repeatedly at my TV as FOX went to commercial just before a 3rd down play in the GB-CHI game, missing that play, the punt, and carrying the commercials all the way through the end of the 1st quarter (after the punt).

70
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:04pm

That must have been an issue with your local FOX station, as my FOX station showed all of that action. You missed a sack of Cutler and a punt into the end zone.

34
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:24pm

Why not? Pitt/Cle is over. Oak at KC is still being decided, with the #3 seed at stake for KC.

37
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:28pm

It's not over. It's still 13:50 to go in the 4th quarter, and when they switched the 4th hadn't even started.

41
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Q (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:45pm

It is really your fault for not knowing or expecting that the game would be prempted if it was a blowout. It is a common occurrence in 1 sided games and many had to know going in to the game that a Pitt blowout was hardly an unexpected result.

48
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Intropy (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:00pm

Heh, quite right.

42
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Scott P. (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:46pm

It's over in that the result is determined at this point.

They won't switch over in the Pitt and Cleveland areas, but in other areas they assume the number of diehard Pittsburgh fans is a small proportion of the population (and most Cleveland fans are likely thankful for small favors).

50
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by 'nonymous (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:02pm

In State College, PA, they're sticking with PIT-CLE to the bitter end. I do remember frustrating mid-game switches watching the Steelers in Ohio, though.

158
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jerry :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 2:37am

You didn't miss anything. Jonathan Dwyer's debut wasn't memorable.

56
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:17pm

Thats why you just buy Sunday Ticket and watch it.

Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

83
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:54pm

We really love Sunday Ticket--we now set up 2 TVs--1 on a main game and 1 on the RZC.
So we just saw Tenn score to tie up Indy and Aaron Rodgers get picked off at the same time!
Nirvana.

31
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:17pm

4th and 1, Bucs go for it from around the 20. Fake hand off, Saints have 2 guys coming clean at Freeman. Mike Williams is not open, forhe is blanketed perfectly by a corner who is not fooled. Freeman with no where to go throws it up for grabs into the end zone... and Williams somehow grabs it for a touchdown.

35
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by morganja :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:27pm

Is anyone else watching this complete BS officiating in the Atlanta Carolina game? Absolutely amazing.

38
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RedZone :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:32pm

No, what happened?

39
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:34pm

Carolina got flagged for a late hit on Brady, probably.

40
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by morganja :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:43pm

Hilarious, but true.

159
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jerry :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 2:39am

LOL.

43
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RedZone :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:48pm

raiderjoe's prediction for OAK@KC is looking pretty good right now.

71
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Whatev :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:17pm

He was dead on for the Atlanta-Carolina game.

124
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by SFC B (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:52pm

I'm pretty sure I saw RJ at a casino with Tom Cruise.

44
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:51pm

There is an annoying tiny patch of sunlight right where the ball is in KC.

45
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Scott P. (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:58pm

Noticed that myself; I thought CBS was experimenting with a glowing ball a la the glowing puck in the NHL.

46
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Thok :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 4:58pm

Come on New England, score another touchdown. You know you want to pass the 2004 Colts. (A TD and a 2 pt conversion ties them with the 1999 Rams.)

49
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:01pm

Ravens can't close out game, now Bengals have a chance to win... and sink my fantasy team... but Palmer throws it over the head of a wide open receiver from the 2.

51
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Alexander :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:03pm

Fantasy should be over by week 17...

57
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:18pm

that throw by Palmer was perfect. LOL.
bengals mouthed off WAYYYY too much in the offseason.

--------------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

53
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:05pm

So, with Oakland beating KC, they're 6-0 against the AFC West, and 2-8 vs the rest of the NFL.

54
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RedZone :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:08pm

But you can't call 'em losers anymore.

101
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by MurphyZero :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:34pm

And those two wins came against the NFC.

104
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by hughesm12 :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:41pm

not just the nfc, but the nfc west.

58
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:19pm

Why are Pam Oliver and Joe Buck talking about the fact that Green Bay will not be showing the Giants score so the Packers will remain focused? That game is now completely irrelevant to the Packers because Tampa Bay won. If the Packers win, they are in. If they lose, they are out.

59
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:22pm

edit* nevermind, just re-read what you said. read it wrong the 1st time.

-------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

94
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:19pm

I said the same thing to my buddy.

Gives a whole new meaning to pointless interviews.

147
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:12am

Why does Joe Buck say anything? He and Aikman make up the worst booth in NFL broadcast history.

62
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dmb :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:40pm

I've mentioned a few times this year that DeAngelo Hall's tackling has been much better this year, but even I never expected to see what I just saw. In one move, Hall took out both the lead blocker (Bear Pascoe) AND Ahmad Bradshaw in the backfield!

Also, Rich Seubert dislocated his kneecap. Yuck.

153
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:29am

I missed the Hall play. Considering his lack of coverage skills, perhaps Hall would be better as a free safety. He and Landry could be a dominant duo!

163
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dmb :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 11:08am

Hall is pretty good in coverage, but he still gambles too much. This year his gambles paid off (/ resulted in fewer burns) than it generally has previously, but his main issue is still one of judgment, not physical ability or (to my knowledge) technique.

I would be terrified of having him play deep safety. As a corner, there's usually supposed to be someone behind you when you gamble and screw up; as a deep safety, you're the guy who's supposed to be in good position when your teammate gambles and screws up. Something tells me that lining up in the middle of the field wouldn't curtail Hall's addiction (anyone know of any Gamblers' Anonymous groups in the DC area?), so Hall at FS could spell disaster for a pass defense.

Also, while Hall's tackling has improved dramatically -- to the point where I'm starting to think that his rep is becoming pretty unfair -- he's still nowhere near the level of Ronde Barber, Antoine Winfield, Terrell Thomas, etc.

As for that particular play, it was a good play by Hall, but also a bad one by Bradshaw. Hall got very, very low and was able to get under the lead blocker, basically taking his legs out and stopping him on the spot. Bradshaw was following too closely and ran straight into the the newly-formed Hall / Pascoe pile, and went down quickly.

65
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by R (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:51pm

They need to start shocking Eli Manning every time he throws high across the middle on a crossing route.

69
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:59pm

Yes. Do it. I just want to see him getting shocked.

66
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by R (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:52pm

They need to start shocking Eli Manning every time he throws high across the middle on a crossing route.

67
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 5:53pm

According to the NFL, Colorado Springs is part of Denver. We are forced to watch the boring and meaningless Broncos game despite meaningful playoff games being played elsewhere. I am really sick of these TV rules.

72
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:21pm

Too bad they don't have something in place that lets you choose which game(s) you watch.

Oh wait, they do.

---------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

73
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:27pm

Not everyone has DIRECTV availability, let alone the money to afford it.

75
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by lloyd :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:31pm

Don't feed the troll...

81
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:40pm

Right, because your comment really contributed to the discussion... pot kettle ?

--------------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

103
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Bill Barnwell :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:38pm

Take it down a notch.

76
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RedZone :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:31pm

I have it, and Raiders games are still blacked out all of the time based on
where I live. Do other people who have it get games that are blacked out
on the local feed?

79
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:34pm

Blackout games are still shown on the GameMix+ screen.

Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

86
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:58pm

Yes, what he said and you also see the important plays on the RZC.

80
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:37pm

They now sell ST to non-subscribers online.

The $ issue is nonsense. I'd like to be at all the Steeler games in person, but I can't afford the travel, the ticket cost, etc. So I live with what I can afford-- ST

--------------------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

85
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:57pm

That's great that you can afford it, but not everyone can. It's not "nonsense".

96
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:28pm

Right, everything we want in life should be free.

--------------------------------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

100
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:34pm

Who said that? The point is that it's not free, and therefore not everyone can afford it. You're blindly advising people to buy Sunday Ticket without knowing their means. Right after you yourself admit you can't afford to go to games.

I have season tickets. You should buy them, too. Then you'd get to see every game in person.

108
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:47pm

You need to go back, and re-read the OP I responded to.

1. "this free product I am given sucks. I hate the rules that control it."

-------------------------------------

Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

95
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dmb :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:23pm

You just dismissed the possibility that someone might not have the money required to satiate his/her football viewing preferences, then stated you don't have the money to view games the way you'd like in the very next sentence.

107
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:44pm

*but* I'm not the one CRYING about what I can't/don't have.... I'm quite content with getting the best alternative I can afford.

OP said he didn't like what is offered. all I said is there are alternatives offered.

the NFL offers live viewing
the NFL offers pay TV viewing
the NFL offers free TV viewing

Beggars can't be choosers.

--------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

134
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dmb :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 10:04pm

Yep, I'm sure Ninjalectual now needs a new keyboard because his current one is now drenched in the tears that poured from his ducts as he sobbingly typed the original post.

Or, maybe he pointed out a fairly straightforward and possibly low-cost improvement in a product that he does pay for, by providing the network with the basis it needs for being able to sell ad time. I actually happen to disagree somewhat with his view, but his complaint certainly wasn't outlandish.

150
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:22am

*cries*

I should have added in the OP that Colorado Springs gets the worst of all worlds: we are forced to watch the Broncos by rule every single week, but when the Broncos played in the "NFL Network only" Thanksgiving game a couple years ago, it was broadcast in Denver but NOT in Colorado Springs. How is that fair?

157
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by bengalmike (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 2:27am

It could be worse. In Toledo, we are treated to all the Lions and Browns games...

160
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jovins :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 4:09am

I'm pretty sure if you really looked, you could probably find all the games streamed online. And RedZone Channel. Not that I would know.

165
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Tue, 01/04/2011 - 1:42am

Yes but streaming games online is inconsistent, as channels tend to get shut down, and you have to scramble to find another channel...

74
Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:31pm

Last play of the half, colts/titans. 61 yard FG attempt, short and wide. Bethea catches it, runs it back, breaks into the clear. He had no one to beat. But he ran out of gas around the 10 and was caught by a tight end. A penalty wipes it out anyway, but still... you'd think adrenaline would get him there...

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Q (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:32pm

30 Minutes Left in GB's Season. Their receivers can't catch, they can't run the ball, McCarthy is a terrible coach, and GB loses every single close game.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Arkaein :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:32pm

GB killing themselves with mistakes. 3 drops that all would have lead to 1st downs, a holding penalty wiping out a huge gain, a false start, and a fumble.

I swear, it almost seems like NFC teams don't want to go to the playoffs this year, other than TB. Nearly every team with something big on the line has blown a game in the past few weeks.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by BucKai :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:49pm

"...other than TB. Nearly every team with something big on the line has blown a game in the past few weeks."

The Buc's blew it against Detroit. I concede that the ref's blew a call and gave Detroit the opportunity but the Buc's let Detroit hang around.

Tampa can overcome the Redskins getting five downs, but apparently not having TD's taken away.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Whatev :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:30pm

And really, it's only fair that a blown call should help Detroit for once.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:16am

The Redskins DID NOT get five downs. Tampa overcame the Redskins missing an extra point at the end of a 1-point game.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:55pm

Beautiful pick by Tilmann. GB offense is choking this game away.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 6:58pm

Agreed. I'm not sure how Pereira can say with certainty the ball hit the ground. It looked like Tillman had his hands underneath the whole time.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:00pm

That was obvious that the ball hit the ground. Not only should it have been overturned, but it also unjustly cost the Packers a timeout. That is crap.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:01pm

Does that make you feel better?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:04pm

Yeah, a little bit.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:18pm

Obvious? I disagree. There is a good chance his hand was underneath it the whole time.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Tyler (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:38pm

As did the ref, as he said the ruling on the field stands, not the ruling on the field is confirmed. Means the cameras couldn't give a solid ruling one way or the other, and as a Packer fan, I have to agree. It probably hit the ground, but we never saw it hit the ground.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:16pm

This Indy-Tenn game is fun--I didn't expect it.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:17pm

The refs in the Chicago-Greenbay game are doing a terrible job with defensive backfield penalties. I've counted two blatant PIs going uncalled (one on each team), and one illegal contact (seriously blatant, there was contact throughout the route).

What happens to the playoffs if Chicago-GB is a tie?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:32pm

Packers are out. Tampa Bay already won, and has 10 wins.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:33pm

A tie is as bad as a loss for Green Bay. They have to win to get in. If they lose or tie, then the Giants are in with a win. If the Giants lose/tie, then Tampay Bay is in.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:43pm

Thanks to both of you.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:38pm

I think most of the people saying the Packers are out are pulling for them and hoping to reverse-jinx them to victory.

And sure enough, they are now up 10-3.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:42pm

I hate when the Red Zone Channel goes into "split box" mode. Fortunately it is usually brief.

they go from showing 1 game in 100% of my screen to 1 game in 20%, another game in another 20%, and wasting 60% of my screen.

Even if they have to show two games, surely you could make one of them bigger to better use some of that screen real estate...

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:53pm

5 minutes left in the Bears game. With the offensive line playing like the Bears offensive line, I think I'd like to see Cutler sat down here. Free Caleb Hanie!

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:54pm

So if the Bears offense comes to life and scored a TD, do they go for 2 and the lead? I would rather have them go for 2 (and risk losing if they fail) than have to go to overtime.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Pilkington (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:54pm

Good thing the Bears have a bye - Cutler's gonna need it after the beating he's taking.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by JonFrum :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:56pm

I'd like to hear from the guy who said 2-3 weeks ago that Tom Brady's interception output would "revert to the mean."

Here's a clue: in small sample sizes, the mean can vary from sample period to sample period. Knowing the jargon doesn't mean you understand the subject.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by otbricki22 (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:07pm

He means it should revert to the population mean, not the sample mean.

Get my meaning?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:25pm

You mean that Brady's interception percentage going forward should be expected to be closer to the 2.2% of his career average than the .8% he has had for the season (Numbers provided by pro-football-reference.com week 17 not included in percentages, I think)

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by JonFrum :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 10:09pm

The season is over. The results are in. The comment was, to paraphrase "He hasn't thrown an interception for weeks, so he has to start throwing them - 'revert to the mean says so.'

If he meant "some time in his career," the statement would be trivial, and would make no sense to say. Reversion to the mean is not a physical law, like the second law of thermodynamics. The statement makes unstated assumptions. If the assumptions don't hold, the statement is nonsense. 'Reversion to the mean' does not act like the Hand of God and cause the universe to come into balance.

In 2007, Brady had 50 TDs. That was above 'the mean.' 'Reversion to the mean' didn't stop him from throwing touchdowns in his last few games.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:24am

'Reversion to the mean'

"REGRESSION TOWARD THE MEAN." By saying it wrong, it implies that you don't understand the concept.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by RickD :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:25am

I understand your meaning, but why would you want to model Brady's passing as a simple binomial test? That's clearly an inadequate model. You need a mixed model of some type, which allows for a possibility of a player moving from playing close to an average level to playing at an exceptional level.

Brady has clearly been playing at a higher level.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:58pm

The Bears haven't scored a TD since last year!

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 7:59pm

LOL!

------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:03pm

Cutler, really dumb throw there. Waste of timeout.

--------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:31pm

I'm not sure it was a terribly dumb throw, since he needed to avoid the sack first and foremost, and it was no risk of interception, but Forte could have made a much-more heads-up play and knocked it down instead of catching it.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by FireOmarTomlin :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:06pm

Colts try to fumble their way into a meeting with the Ravens.

Titans return the ball.

--------------------------
Men are more ready to repay an injury than a benefit because gratitude is a burden and revenge a pleasure.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:06pm

Let your QB get sacked 6 times, to let him come up short with the game on the line.

20/20, I know.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Arkaein :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:07pm

Not pretty, but GB got it done. And unlike most of the pregame sports yaks thought they did it without any gifts from Lovie or the Bears.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:41pm

I still can't believe NOBODY on TV thought the Bears would play all their starters the whole game, so long as it was close, because THEY HATE THE PACKERS! I mean, I know that you have the #2 seed wrapped up, and that you're gaining absolutely nothing by winning this game, aside from keeping your most hated rival out of the playoffs! I mean, does nobody think that means anything to them? Seriously? Lovie Smith himself said at his introductory press conference that he was there to win the Super Bowl and beat the Packers.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:43pm

He rested his starters against the Packers in 2006, so honestly I'm surprised.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Drunkmonkey :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:02pm

I can't say for 100% certainty, but I don't think the situation is quite the same. Like I didn't think it was so simple for the Packers to make the playoffs. I know that making the playoffs, especially with a first round bye, is really good in the eyes of the owners, but it doesn't hurt to take down your most hated rival in their place to keep them from the playoffs. Just saying, it probably meant a lot to the owners and Lovie to beat the Packers today.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by dbt :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:13pm

It sure looked like the OL and Johnny Knox took the game off, that's for sure.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by akn (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:26pm

Martz took the game off: 20/39 run/pass ratio when Forte was over 6 ypc.
Looked like Cutler was trying too hard to get Knox to 1000 yards.
Cutler has to learn to throw the ball away instead of taking coverage sacks.
Nothing fancy on the play calls--Bears may have been trying to keep any newly installed plays from scouts.
O-line was indeed bad, and Manu missed a few key blitz pickups.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 10:49pm

He rested the starters against Minnesota in 2005, but he didn't against the Packers in 2006. Although in 2006 Rex played like he was resting. After the game, he talked about he wasn't really focused on the game because it was New Year's Eve. I guess he had some big plans for later that evening.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by tuluse :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:01pm

The starters only played a half in 2006. Maybe not even a whole half for some of them.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 11:34pm

I'll take your word for it, because I don't remember all of the details. But I don't consider that resting the starters. To me, "resting" means that key players are inactive.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by SFC B (not verified) :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:07pm

I just find it hard to believe that the teams, and particularly the players, get as incredibly worked up about rivalry games as the fans do.

Most of the players aren't from the cities in which they play so it's not like they grew up hating Hated Team(s) In Our Division. Some of them probably have friends or college teammates on the Hated Team(s) In Our Division. They also probably realize that there is a not insignificant chance that, at a point in the not-too-distant future, they might be playing for Hated Team(s) In Our Division.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:13pm

So, unless Atlanta sneaks in front of them after their performance against Carolina, the top two NFC teams by DVOA will be playing each other next week (GB at Philly) Should be a heck of a game.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Eddo :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 8:32pm

The Falcons might; the Packers' offense sure looked pretty awful all game, which might cancel out the defensive effort enough for Atlanta to pull ahead.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:33pm

If Whitehurst had lead Ruvell that would have been a TD. 61 yards, but he had to wait several seconds for the ball to get there.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by morganja :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 9:47pm

Did anyone see a PI before the touchdown?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Anonymouscowherd (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:36am

Nope, but I'm pretty sure someone roughed Brady.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 01/02/2011 - 10:00pm

I'm not big on my Green Bay history, but David Whitehurst was terrible, right?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jay Z (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:03am

Whitehurst had a few things going for him. He only played because Dickey was hurt. He came at a low cost. They had a winning record one year with him as QB. He was kind of scrappy. He played just a couple of years after disasters like Jerry Tagge, Jim Del Gaizo, and the Hadl trade fiasco.

That being said, his abilities were limited.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:44am

What a stupid game (if you were rooting for the Rams). The refs kept making worse and worse calls against the Rams, and the Rams just sort of accepted it quietly, not challenging or complaining or anything. They still had chances to win and blew them, but the atrocious refereeing didn't help.

Now the Seahawks are even for the bad calls that went against them in the Super Bowl a few years back.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:47am

How exactly do you get a delay of game while trying to rush a play before it can be reviewed?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jon Silverberg (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:14am

+1

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:27am

I had the same thought. Maybe Bradford was really looking forward to playing on his new ping-pong table.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by John (not verified) :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 12:55am

7-9! 7-9! History made, and we were there.

Sorta. I was reading a book in Indy and not watching/listening, but still.

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by miqewalsh :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 1:31am

Looking at the shot of Paul Allen glumly watching his team "win", he reminded me of Max Bialystock at the premiere:

We had the wrong coach! We had the wrong quarterback! We had the wrong playbook! Where did we go right?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Jerry :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 2:25am

They let Denver hire McDaniels?

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Re: Week 17 Open Discussion Thread
by Athelas :: Mon, 01/03/2011 - 7:53am

+1

(Still can't believe there's a losing record division winner)

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