Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

02 Oct 2011

Week 4 Game Discussion Thread

Since there's no official thread, here's a place to discuss the Week 4 games.

Posted by: Aaron Schatz on 02 Oct 2011

53 replies , Last at 03 Oct 2011, 11:00pm by Raiderjoe

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 1:53pm

I was wondering if FO was giving up on their open-game threads, but I'm glad they didn't.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Schatz :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 2:04pm

Sorry, my fault. I just plum forgot to set it up. It's on the homepage now!

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by joe football (not verified) :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 2:26pm

Be sure to join a star-studded cast of your favorite FO posters for another season of IRC football chat! Point your favorite IRC client to bendenweyr.dyndns.org, channel #fo

Or for a web-based solution, just use this mibbit link: http://chat.mibbit.com/?channel=%23fo&server=bendenweyr.dyndns.org

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by andrew :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 2:28pm

Well the Vikings found a way to prevent themselves from blowing a halftime lead...

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 2:47pm

Meanwhile, the Lions' secondary has disappeared again since we're playing against a good QB. It was bound to happen eventually...

---
"When you absolutely don't know what to do any more, then it's time to panic." - Johann van der Wiel

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:34pm

...on the other hand, apparently you don't need a secondary when Romo is feeling charitable and you have Megatron on your team.

(Btw, not that I'm objecting, but what on earth was Romo doing throwing short on the Cowboys' last play of the game?)

---
"When you absolutely don't know what to do any more, then it's time to panic." - Johann van der Wiel

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:30pm

As a long-time Lions fan, I have to admit, it's weird watching other teams making the kind of decisions I usually attribute to Detroit.

I'm not sure I can handle this new thing, "winning".

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 3:10pm

Teaxns rerally stinkin since Manning block in back. Shoudl ahve been up 17-0 at half. Now in fogfight. Hous 10, Pitt 7 end of 3rd.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:31pm

I like that, "fogfight"

I need to use it more.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Independent George :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 10:29am

Wasn't that the Bears-Eagles game in '88?

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by CoachDave :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 3:46pm

The "protect the QB over anything" mentality of the NFL is ruining their product.

To have the Lions not get that stop on 3rd and long because an engaged Suh pushes a ducking Romo in the face mask is complete crap.

You can protect the QBs head without going overboard like the NFL is doing now.

8
Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Stats are for losers (not verified) :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 3:55pm

Texans lost a game-icing TD when a guy was blocked into Roethlisberger's knee, with that call being against both the letter and spirit of the rule.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Nathan :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 10:03am

I was talking about this yesterday too. What's annoying is those plays are not the plays QBs get hurt on. They get hurt when people go into their knees. Not when people touch their heads or "drive them to the ground", whatever the hell that means.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 10:13am

Stafford hurt his shoulder last year when Peppers drove him through the ground.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:11pm

Bills blow a 14 point halftime lead and lose to the Bengals. I guess Marvin Lewis was right.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Lance :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:22pm

Don't worry. The Cowboys are about to blow a lead of their own, which would be a historic loss for them. So it could be worse.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by SFC B (not verified) :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:27pm

I think the Steelers are in trouble. The Texans were controlling that game for 3 out of 4 quarters. The 17-10 final score didn't show just how out of it Pittsburgh was.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:30pm

Things we learned today: Devin Hester is still Devin Hester. The Bears can run the ball against a bad run defense. Tony Romo is still Tony Romo. Joe Buck and Troy Aikman do not know that you don't get 5 downs at the end of a game.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:36pm

Explain this fourth thing, please.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Thok :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:41pm

I assume it involves the end of the Dallas game, where Felix Jones ran out of bounds short of a first down on fourth down in order to keep time from running out.

To be fair, there were 4 seconds remaining when he went out of bounds.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 4:52pm

It was 4th and 20, as clearly shown on the Fox graphic. There were something like 11 seconds left. Romo threw a short pass to Felix Jones, who slipped a tackle but for some inexplicable reason stepped out of bounds well short of the first down. Buck started saying that the Lions linebacker (don't remember who it was) could have ended the game by tackling Jones inbounds (Dallas was out of timeouts) and that Jones gave the Cowboys one more chance on fourth down (with 4 seconds left). Aikman said something to agree with Buck. Then, presumably after someone informed Buck that the previous play was fourth down, Buck said something like "Oh, that was 4th down."

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:33pm

Way to pay attention, Joe. It's not like they're paying you to stay awake...

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:15pm

Raiders now up to 70 yards in penalties. Only 40 of those are on Richard Seymour, though.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:30pm

Jason Campbell hits a wide open Patrick Chung in the end zone, too bad he's a Patriot.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:33pm

One of the weirdest INTs I've ever seen... What did he see?

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:36pm

I have no idea. No raiders anywhere near Chung, or even behind him. The announcer thought he was trying to throw it away and missed.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Andrew Potter :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:56pm

The announcer thought he was trying to throw it away and missed.

Which has to be the most epic quarterback fail so far this season. It reminds me of the old Paddy and Mick joke where they throw coins at the ground...

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:42pm

Raiders down 17-10. Going to coem out 2nd half and run ball down throat of Pates and hit D. Moore for coupel scores. Going to be fun.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:49pm

Tony Romo choked again, he should have done a much better job covering Calvin Johnson.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Andrew Potter :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:54pm

To be fair, his two touchdown passes to Detroit defenders benefitted from a ton of yards after the catch.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Danish Denver-Fan :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 5:56pm

That general point is often true, but it's a bit hard to take that stance when he throws three INTs in the second half - who goig for six no less. I mean that's pretty much the definition of choking.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Jonadan :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 6:03pm

On the other hand, when you put up 30 you shouldn't have to not choke to get a win. When you enter the 4th up by 13... okay, so Romo sucked it up, but still.

---
"When you absolutely don't know what to do any more, then it's time to panic." - Johann van der Wiel

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 6:19pm

And the 3rd interception was a very risky pass that was intercepted in Cowboys territory. The Lions turned that into a short TD drive to take the lead.

I didn't start watching the game until after the Bears game ended, but from the highlights and the score, it seemed like the Cowboys were cruising until Romo threw two pick sixes. With a 27-3 lead and first down at their own 27 with 10:30 to go in the third quarter, why were the Cowboys passing? I haven't seen a replay of the pick 6 by Bobby Carpenter, but it seems to me that with such a big lead and the Lions having down nothing on offense, throwing a risky pass is not very smart. Most of the comebacks from 20+ points down that I can remember involve at least one stupid turnover that turns into a defensive TD (or sets the offense up with a very short field) and/or at least one special teams TD.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by So Cal (not verified) :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 7:08pm

If memory serves, Dallas took the second half kickoff in for 7. I said before the next kickoff that now we should see all 3 of the Dallas RBs get some work in for the remainder of the game. Funny, that didn't even appear to be a serious thought for the Cowboys at that point. Even after Romo throws the first pick-6, still no serious move to use the running game and eat the clock.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 7:57pm

I just saw the first pick-6. Romo never should have thrown that pass. (I don't think the pass should have been called either, as stated above.) The second pick-6 also shouldn't have been thrown. A 27-3 blowout became a 27-17 game which the Cowboys ended up losing. Romo has now given away 2 games that the Cowboys should have had on ice. I think they will regret this greatly when those two blown games keep them out of the playoffs (or cost them a better seeding if they do make it).

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 8:10pm

With a 27-3 lead and first down at their own 27 with 10:30 to go in the third quarter, why were the Cowboys passing?
-----

Ask the Vikings.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Marko :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 9:20pm

I did. Here's what they told me: "We blew our 20 point lead against Detroit last week largely because we passed too much and ignored our running game featuring our All-Pro running back. We should have realized that we have an incompletion machine at QB, and stopping the clock with incompletions and giving Detroit more possessions isn't smart. Of course, Dallas has a turnover machine at QB (which is even worse than an incompletion machine when protecting a lead), so they also should have ran more. Also, we stink."

Edit: To clarify, I'm not channeling Woody Hayes and saying that a team never should pass when up by 24 points. I am saying that keeping the clock moving is a good idea, and if you are going to pass, make it a safe pass. The QB better make sure that the receiver is open; there is absolutely no need to force a throw in that situation. Both pick-6s were forced into tight coverage and were terrible decisions.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 8:31am

Look at the drive play-by-play. (http://espn.go.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=310925016&period=3) Minnesota got in trouble not by passing too much, but by being too conservative. From the time they were up 20-0 until they were down 23-20, they largely ran or threw short completions. They mainly didn't throw incomplete until 3rd and long, except for the drive that started with a holding penalty. And they still ran it twice on that "drive"!

Once they got down, they scored on a pass-only drive.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by justanothersteve :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 6:36pm

Haven't seen the other games except a bit on Red Zone. But I think McCarthy should be considered for this week's Colbert Award. After the Packers were stopped on 4th and 1 instead of trying for the easy FG, he still tries an onside kick early in the game. I know the game turned into a blowout. But it didn't look like that early.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 6:43pm

Fat man jogging! Wilfork with his second Int of the season. I think he's leading the Patriots in interceptions.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by nat :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 9:47pm

He's only second in interceptions.....but leads in interception return yardage.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Nathan :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 10:05am

Wilfork Island!

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 7:10pm

Pretty stiff competition for the Keep Chopping Wood award. Do we give it to Ronnie Brown for his goal-line lateral to nowhere, or to Jason Campbell for throwing the ball away to Patrick Chung?

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by RedZone :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 8:50pm

Give up a fumble and a touchdown? No problem when you have Joe McKnight.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Alexander :: Sun, 10/02/2011 - 10:53pm

Collinsworth's announcing is priceless.

And I don't know if that's a complement or insult.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by bcornell :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 12:01am

Saw a performance today from Richard Seymour that reminded me why he's not a "future Hall Of Famer". This guy is a monstrous talent, but he just cannot refrain from stupid penalties - 4 for 40 yards today, including an idiotic takedown of Brady when the play was dead and every single ump and judge on the field had him in their sights.

I'm convinced Belichick traded him because he won't play with discipline. Today made me smug & self-satisfied.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by JonFrum :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 1:03am

Seymour is Hall of Very Good to me. Never best at his position, but near the top for several years. I think it was all about money when Belichick traded him. Seymour had shown before that he would hold out when he wanted a new contract, and his output had dropped a little.

I have no idea what he was thinking throwing down Brady - brain fart.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Eggwasp (not verified) :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 3:27am

This tough, highly rated Raiders D-line STILL can't stop the run when it counts. Since about the middle of last season, teams have routinely broken long plays in the running game - is it lack of talent thats overrated by the commentariat, the linebackers, the scheme, over-emphasising pass rush over stuffing the RB, or merely poor tackling fundamentals? Is it a particular type of running play thats hitting the jackpot regularly against Oakland?

I'd love to know opinions on this.

Aside from this, I think its a creditable start from Oakland. They were unlucky perhaps to be facing Brady the week after the 4 INT game, especially with Johnson, Huff & Shaughnessy out. And the Raiders hung with the Pats well until the Chung pick, which was just a mistake, and the PI flag that was picked up close to the endzone - which given how PI gets regularly called these days, was a very strange decision (no way Routt gets the benefit of that doubt). Oakland gets 7 then, they are still in the game. Oakland had to play mistake-free but a couple of turnovers and some silly penalties (again) gives them the L. But both of these were just mistakes rather than forced by playing badly, so I think it remains an encouraging loss, rather than the forty point beatdown that I was fearing...

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 8:33am

I think long runs are usually attributable to the linebackers. A ton of 5 yarders is probably a terrible line.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 7:00am

Hrrible pass interference call flag deicison thing. First rfe correctly called PI, then change mind later. Did ref get buzzed by B. Kraft or T. Bardy to pick up flag? Sure seem liek it. Game totally changed after that. Raiders got scrwed big time. No problem. Raiders goign to rebound and finish 12-4.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by B :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 8:43pm

Monday Night Football! No Hank Williams Jr. Now if only we can get Faith Hill to say something horribly offensive.

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 10:58pm

THis The Thing movie look rpomising. Other ting that look prkomising is C. Pineter going to throw interpceitn late in game.TB take home for touchdown, win 24-10

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Re: Week 4 Game Discussion Thread
by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/03/2011 - 11:00pm

Tirico talking about qb class of 09. when heard it thought he say "QB glass of 09". Was thinking would be good solid glass to have. Woudl be regular size glas s like you have in kitchen and would have like staffoprd, fdreeman, and sanchez pictures of them on glass.

Kuig

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