Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

24 Dec 2013

Tanier's All-Rookie Team

This year's All-Rookie Team gets it done in the trenches, though I have to admit that I felt much better about the offensive line last Friday than I did on Sunday night.

Posted by: Mike Tanier on 24 Dec 2013

14 comments, Last at 21 Jan 2014, 8:50pm by Cheap Pandora Charms

Comments

1
by Andy (not verified) :: Tue, 12/24/2013 - 4:00pm

Wow, I just skipped down to my own team's player (Keenan Allen)...appreciate the positive remarks regarding him, but this guy knows nothing about the Chargers, insulting really.

2
by eddy (not verified) :: Tue, 12/24/2013 - 9:44pm

Why? Because he points out that Allen is the first Charger player to play at an elite level with the team, as opposed to playing elite with other teams (jackson and sproles) or never really being elite, just very useful (floyd) though Vincent Brown is supposed to ascend soon. alexander wasn't homegrown (but was blossoming). you are finding lots to be insulted by, but there isn't much here remotely insulting.

3
by Andy (not verified) :: Tue, 12/24/2013 - 11:09pm

Malcolm Floyd was very highly ranked by both FO's metrics & PFF's. Definitely more than "useful" (and he was talent we developed - he straight up said we failed to develop any talent). And how were Jackson & Sproles not elite with San Diego? They've both graded out very well at FO & PFF. (Especially Jackson - he's been worse (on average) with TB, than he was in SD. He didn't get a giant contract because he HADN'T developed yet).

Not to mention he failed to get the date wrong (Rivers wasn't the QB in 2005). The amount of attention national writers/talking-heads pay to the Chargers relative to the talent of players (/success of team) is the lowest in the league (I don't know if it's just East Coast bias, but it's consistent... that's for sure). They don't even bother to get an accurate picture of the team & it's players.

4
by eddy (not verified) :: Wed, 12/25/2013 - 12:25am

I get it you are projecting your anger at a perceived lack of attention. Mad Dog expects them to win the SB if they make the playoffs, claiming that no one in the AFC wants to face them fyi. Floyd is a great deep threat, but having great metrics is never the sole measure of elite. He is good but not great. Jackson and sproles may be legitimate counterpoints, but for one the word"essentially" does not mean "completely".

More importantly, I'm sure that Tanier appreciates your attempted correction, but since both darren sproles and vincent jackson were drafted in 2005, it might be safe to say that they haven't developed anyone since, well, 2005.

9
by collapsing pocket (not verified) :: Thu, 12/26/2013 - 12:22pm

Except that both of them took at least 2 years to "develop". But even if we assume that he's backdating the claim because of when the were drafted, the statement becomes silly.

"The Chargers had a Good QB and a Hall of Fame RB and Hall of Fame TE and then didn't bother to develop any other explosive offensive weapons (because they already had an elite receiver and explosive pass catching running back who I somehow forgot to mention in my earlier description of the team)".

10
by collapsing pocket (not verified) :: Thu, 12/26/2013 - 12:29pm

Also, this "mad dog" is crazy. If by some miracle the Charges do make the playoffs they're most likely destination is a game in Cincy, where they'll mostly likely get stomped by the bigger, faster, deeper Bengals and finally get Marvin Lewis that playoff victory he's been after.

5
by Duff Soviet Union :: Wed, 12/25/2013 - 6:40am

Oh look, a fan of a mediocre team thinks that "the media" is biased against his favourite team. That never happens!

Grow up, idiot.

6
by RickD :: Thu, 12/26/2013 - 9:25am

Well, if you want to be insulted, go ahead.

Neither Vincent Jackson nor Darren Sproles stayed with the Chargers. I think that's the point.

7
by collapsing pocket (not verified) :: Thu, 12/26/2013 - 12:01pm

No, that's not the point. The article says this:

The Chargers became a Philip Rivers-Antonio Gates-LaDanian Tomlinson team in 2005 and essentially quit developing exciting new offensive players for the rest of the decade.

A few problems with this:

1) Brees was still the starting QB in 2005. Rivers didn't take over until 2006.

2) Both Sproles and Jackson were drafted in 2005, and neither really broke out until at least 2007. Sproles missed the whole 2005 seeason with and injury, and Jackson played 8 games with 3 catches his rookie year.

So is Tanier making the claim that Jackson and Sproles are not explosive offensive players? Or is he claiming that since they were drafted in 2005 their later development into explosive players from 2007 onward is backdated to 2005?

He says nothing about them staying with the team or not, its irrelevant.

8
by collapsing pocket (not verified) :: Thu, 12/26/2013 - 12:16pm

because he points out that Allen is the first Charger player to play at an elite level with the team, as opposed to playing elite with other teams (jackson and sproles)

Are we talking about the same Vincent Jackson? The one who was top 5 in DVOA and DYAR in back to back years in San Diego, including being #1 in DVOA and #2 in DYAR as the leading receiver in one of the top DVOA passing offenses ever? He absolutely played at an elite level in San Diego, unless there is some definition of "elite" which excludes the player which had one of the best seasons at his position.

And Sproles? Would that be the same Sproles who was top 6 in receiving DVOA for 3 straight years in San Diego, including that 2009 year where he was #1 in DYAR and #2 in DVOA?

If those aren't "elite level" seasons then the phrase has no meaning.

11
by LionInAZ :: Fri, 12/27/2013 - 5:59pm

Whatever Jim Schwartz's faults, and there are plenty (and he should probably be let loose after this season), he will leave his successor a pretty good OL and DL. No one ever said that the recovery from Millen would not be painless.

12
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