Talk amongst yourselves
7/26: CLE WR, DET WR, WAS IDP
7/25: GB TE, HOU WR, KC RB/WR
* * * * *
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This thread is for in-game discussion of Saturday's two playoff games: Washington-Seattle and New England-Denver. (Nuf respek, yo.)
You can find discussion of the Sunday second round games here.
Mack Strong goes off like an SUV out of control... one piloted by Lamar Smith, no less. Career long run.
chuangtzu (#296 )--
So you're an Eagle player?
They're still technically the NFC champs until a new one is crowned.
Mack bleeping Strong...how fitting
â€œYouâ€? are skins fans. â€œWeâ€? are conference champions.
Bit premature, don't you think? Unless the conference you refer to contains neither the Panthers nor the Bears.
Washington is going to come back just watch.
Sid writes "game over" in his notebook.
And Holmgren and/or Hasselback give Strong some glory. Getting that run makes me really happy for him, having lived in Portland and been forced to watch the Seahawks for so long. Just a really great fullback for a long time, I liked Darryl Johnston's "Hey!" during the play.
Do you know what time it is?
It's Morris time!
Please, chuangtzu, we're Seahawk fans. We won't believe that Seattle really won the game until about a half an hour after the final whistle.
That was a great block by Seattle #86 on that long run, as well as by whichever receiver was blocking Skins #24.
Re: 290. If he didn't pull up, he likely would've been called for a 15-yard penalty for unnecessary roughness on a defenseless receiver. Possibly fined during the week as well, if he got enough helmet into the hit. As much as I love lighting people up, in that case playing it safe was the right thing to do.
Good bit of analysis on the missed FG by the UK studio guys. Seattle overloaded one side of line, and Trufant was completely unblocked as he came around to block the kick.
It's concieveable that that was enough to make Hall 'snatch' at the kick. It might not have made a difference, but it was a smart bit of work to pick it up.
"So amazing without Alexander!!!!111oneoneone"
Does that mean people will stop slurping on Alexander, and understand that he's only a small piece of a relatively complex offense, fueled by a competent line?
Hutch deserved that MVP...
For symmetry's sake, Washington needs to get a late TD here (on a turnover perhaps), have the game go to overtime where Seattle wins it on a FG.
Has a receiver ever dropped a ball in a way such that it was intercepted by the defense?
Matter of time at this point, mi amigo. The Panthers have one less offensive threat than the Redskins, and the Bears have two less. Then again, maybe I'm just getting cocky at my team's first playoff win in 21 years.
And Vegas is waiting breathlessly for this Seattle FG attempt...
#312 - so... should they let Alexander go after this season instead of paying the huge amount he's due? Is this a broncos interchangeable RB offense?
Re: 310 Oh please, this is football, not tiddlywinks. That hit would have been plenty devastating without Trufant using his helmet and defenseless recievers are the best kind.
Skins can still win, provided Seattle puts Roy Willaims in at safety.
Not to poop on your parade or anything chuangtzu, but I can think of several franchises I wouldn't trust to hold a 10-point lead in a playoff game with almost three minutes left. Guess if Seattle is one of them.
The Seattle cheerbabes are bundled up...does that mean the football gods will frown upon the hapless 'Hawks now, or preserve their wrath for the NFC championship?
317: Maurice Morris' 49 yards on 18 carries say no.
Has Siragusa ever contributed anything worthwhile to a telecast? I've heard him say funny things in radio interviews, so I'm not prepared to say he has no business in broadcasting, but during a live game he adds absolutely nothing.
If the score stays as is, bookies are going to get killed on this game because the spread opened at 9, and closed at 10 on most sites.
I understand the reluctance to trust the Seattle D. But all that was B.L., Before Lofa. Things are different now.
Not saying I like the rule, but taking the shot there gives them first and goal, down seven. And anything more than that would've been called. By pulling up he didn't give them a free shot to tie it up.
MDS (#323 )--
He just mentioned Seattle using line stunts to get pressure.
Plus, he has the cleavage.
"If you give Brunell time, he'll pick you apart." Tony, are you and I watching the same game?
chuangtzu - I was all prepared to get my Bears dander up and come back at you with both barrels when I realized: I'm hearing trash talk from a Seattle fan. I decided to ponder the historical significance instead.
Depends on a variety of factors, but I would pose to you that this offense would not fall apart without him.
Keep the line, keep them healthy and disciplined (per the Tainer article from the other day), and keep Strong and Hannam (maybe), and I'd say the loss wouldn't be as great as the idiots/bobbleheads want you to believe.
If they could pick up a need in defense or two or three, on the mega bucks Alexander would command, I'd say they should take that option.
TomC. It's a rare experience for me too. I intend to savor it while it lasts.
did anyone else hear Samules say "Dat's bull, mang!" over the ref's microphone?
Are we sure Brunell hadn't crossed the line of scrimmage on that long completion on fourth-and-16?
333: He didn't cross the 20 yard line, if that was the actual LOS.
Now see? If Trufant buries Moss 10 minutes ago that catch doesn't happen.
As far the penalty, the ball hit Moss's hands, so I think he's far game.
Chan Gailey would call a spike here.
Ruben - Does Samuels have a Puerto Rican accent?
I was wondering the same thing.
If the Redskins lose this one, some idiot is going to say the Redskins failed to establish the run, and that is why they lost.
Don't they have plays that go more than 10 yards?
Game Ooooover. Time to eat me some Nachos.
Karma for Seattle. The win a playoff game on a dropped pass in the endzone.
I have no idea, but I swear I heard the "mang" instead of "man."
I laughed out loud...
Wow, great play to not interfere there. I thought at first glance it was one of those "we just won't call it because it's late in the game" garbage non-calls, but he actually didn't interfere. Great play.
Peanut butter jelly time!
Peanut butter jelly time!
Peanut butter baseball bat!
Peanut butter baseball bat!
Peanut butter jelly time!
Peanut butter jelly time!
I just re-watched the play, and Brunell released the pass at the 17 or 18, behind the line of scrimmage.
If Seattle wins without Alexander, what would they have done with him? Also, what is a standard recovery period for a concussion? Odds on him coming back versus Chicago next week?
I expected to be a lot happier than this when the Seahawks won.
I agree...First look I had to wonder why the ref, who was there did not call defensive pass interference. Then on the replay, you could see that the defender clearly played it well and in fact knocked the ball away from Moss. I can't blame Moss for not catching it; however, he should have tried to establish position a little better and then he might have caught it or at least got an interference call.
I can't believe Dick Enberg and Dan Dierdorf are doing the game tomorrow. Of the four games that was the one I was most looking forward to. Not anymore.
Give the skins their credit we were 5-6 at one point this season and to make the divisional playoffs and play a good game is a big accomplishment. we we're told at the beginning we'd be dead last in our division. We have some holes to patch up and we'll be back next year.
One last thing, since football season is officially over for me and now I can watch something besides nfl network I would like to know is that "24" show any good?
C'mon MDS, don't you have any radio station in your area covering the game?
To Nacho, I do indeed give the skins their due. Being the last team from your division in contention is worth something. I also give Brunell his props... he won my alma mater a national championship, after all.
This just in: Seahawks hate God, convert to Shintoism to appeal to Japanese fanbase. Also hire Ichiro in offseason to field punts.
I think this was a game of who wanted to lose more. Could the Seahawks special teams lose the game, or could Washington's offense lose the game?
I don't remember seeing so many 3rd and 15+ and 4th and 15+ conversions in a game. Yikes.
Oh yeah - depending on the player and the level of concussion, it's usually a one-game thing. Looking at Alexander on the sidelines I think he'll be in next time.
Morris also looked pretty wobbly there at the end. Wonder what happened to him?
Morris did about as well as Williams did last week. I don't think he's as good as Alexander at making cuts, but he doesn't dance around as much. He's a good but not great back.
God, I hate pre- half- end-game shows.
Can't we get Aaron, MDS and Tanier around a table saying things that didn't come off a Foley board: "Establish the run, get turnovers, give it their all, mental mistakes!"
When I become a FOX Sports exec, you guys are in the booth and "back in the studio in New York."
The McDonald's Pounder Index: A cutting edge mathematical formula if I've ever seen one.
Congratulations seahawk fans.... good luck to your team the rest of the way.
Isn't this Mack Strong's 29th year as Seahawk? Nice to see him get carries. He looked like John L Williams reincarnate on that one run.
I don't know why, but I absolutely love the fact that the Indianapolis Colts have already won tomorrows game.
It's nice being the heavy, heavy underdog. Makes it that much more enjoyable if we win.............
RE:51 I Hope you are here when this game is over so I can gloat
:: Nacho â€” 1/14/2006 @ 4:57 pm
Heh. Heh heh.
And the Pittsburgh underdogs take the field... oh wait, that's tomorrow. ;-) Forgive me, I'm just giddy at my team winning a playoff game for the first time since I've been legal to, uhh, drive, let alone drink.
I'm confused. Why are the number two CBS crew doing the best game of the weekend?
All I can do it thank God that the "number one" Fox team of the three stooges didn't do the
Skins/Hawks game. My stereo in the room with the TV doesn't get AM radio... Is broken Thighsman really the best they could come up with for Monday night next year? Really?
Cause CBS wanted to put the Patriots in a primetime game and the top crew in a Sat night primetime game guarntees a lot of viewers.
Why couldn't the refs call penalties against Seattle? Is this a new home team rule this year? No reason for their O-line to stop holding if they never get called for it. Also, nice spotting.
Seriously, what is the deal with refs and playoff games? I understand they don't want to turn it into a flag-fest but you have to call at least one of the more obvious holds to try to keep the line semi-honest. I hope this is the last time we see this in the playoffs. It mars what should be great games. I didn't support either team but had to start supporting the redskins after the one sided officiating.
Well, okay - but if they want to retain viewers for next season it might not be a bad idea to put your best foot forward.
I'm still astounded that the Seahawks managed to win despite giving it their all. This has to be a major setback in their ineptitude. I think it's because all week long, they've been praising Tom Brady and genuflecting.
On a side note, the #12 flag that is flying in the stadium - right behind it is a big billboard for "Bruchi's". Conspiracy? I think so.
Anyone here ever try Brooklyn Dark Chocolate Stout? To quote a noted Fox celebrity, it's sacrilicious.
As an obligatory football comment, if NE wins, Corey Dillon gains 100 yards rushing, and yes, that's reversed purposely.
Whoa.. that was definitely an 8-man blitz.
Serious disrespect for Brady by Lynch and the officials.
HOW DARE YOU DISRESPECT THE BRADY!
You know what this means - Brady's going to have to drill a ref to restore order...
Over/under for number of genuflects and disrepectings the next 3 hours of posts will bring: 100? 200?
Sorry, I misread MDS' post. I thought Dierdorf and Enberg were doing tonights game. Once the game started and we got the feed I began feeling a little silly.
Jeff Triplette is reffing this game? Was Walt Coleman not available?
Disrespect. Genuflect. Disrespect. Genuflect. Wash, rinse, repeat. Disreflect. Genuspect. Wait... who fed Brady roofies?
Man, that Steve Largent is fast.
now we have perfected the burger king commercial, we have to find a way to get marcus vick in one of the ronald mcdonald on the park bench commercials.
Maybe it's just due to his team being on my tv all the time, but in my mind Tom Brady bitches and whines to the officials more than anyone this side of Coach K.
I call a QB sneak.
What I'm trying to figure out about the Seattle/Washington game is why so many injuries? Is there something about the Qwest field surface that doesn't hold up well to rain? The last time Seattle played a playoff game there, the weather was sunny, and it was actually moderately warm for the time of year, as I recall.
A playing surface in Seattle that responds poorly to rain. The joke tells itself.
HOW DARE YOU TAKE HIS NAME IN VAIN! Forgive him, Lord Brady, for he knows not what he does.
Perfect example of why Triplette is a terrible ref: He calls for a measurement there even though the Patriots were obviously a full yard short of the first down. Why delay the game by a couple of minutes when you can see just by looking that they're not close to the line? Please, spare me the announcer-speak of "the Patriots requested the spot." Triplette should have denied the request.
Itâ€™s Lynch, itâ€™s Brady, itâ€™s the honkey showboat showdown!
OK, can I request that we limit the "Brady genuflect" references? People know that nobody is as annoyed by the "Brady can do anything" mindset as I am, but if people are making fun of it every three comments for the rest of the playoffs, I'm going to lose my mind. And I'm guessing I'm not the only one.
Re: 283 I'd watch that show. They should put it on before Big Man Dance Challenge. Brett Farve could play the banjo and Tom Brady can just be handsome.
3 yard pass on 3rd and 6, I love it.
One more thing. Apparently, comment 378 has never seen a New York Giants game. A team of 11 Tom Bradys could not whine as much as Jeremy Shockey and Plaxico Burress combined.
Can we still genuflect on every post number that is divisible by twelve?
Thanks, Aaron. Agree in full on 384.
only if it is prime.
That's what sets Brady apart from the other top QBs. When he hits a linebacker right between the numbers, he knows how to make the linebacker miss.
I disagree, today is the last chance to respect and flect for him, so may as well have fun with it.
I watch the Giants all the time. I'm pretty sure Shockey's too dumb to know when to complain though, and that limits his total.
Highlight of the game so far - after the first Patriots false start penalty on the first drive, Lynch got to Brady before he realized the play was dead, then started celebrating the penalty, pumping his fist in the air. ... Then Brady decides to follow him and mock him by imitating his celebration, then patting him in the butt. Made Brady look like an A-Hole, but it was funny.
It's Kyle Orton for the Patriots!
What is Coach B so upset about?
Aaron: You cannot possibly be as sick of the "Brady can do anything" mindset as the rest of us. You at least like Brady (I presume).
Hey, no fair: MDS gets to make Brady jokes but the rest of us can't?
397: My guess would be he wanted a measurement.
That pass was positively Vince Young-ian.
Who put a thin Grizzly Adams in as QB for the Broncos? Did he bring Ben?
Good tackle by Tatum Bell.
What I like about Jeb is that he's so much Putzier than the rest of their tight ends.
4th & 1. Bradlee Van Pelt on the QB draw again?
What a bad call.
Worst. Playcall. Evar.
Awful play call. What's wrong with a rollout TE drag with an option for Jake to run?
Awful call. Unless you have an All-Pro, tall WR, you should never run the fade pass on 4th and goal.
If you're trying to use your WR's height advantage, shouldn't you not throw the ball so he doesnt't have to go through the defender?
Once again, the NE defense comes thru in the playoffs. That pass is an admission that Shanahan knows he can't run on NE unless he fools them.
Well, most receivers look tall next to Asante Samuel.
Why are so many pro teams fascinated with the fade pass? I've never understood that and I guess I never will. It's pretty tricky to execute most of the time. (I'm not basing this on the last snap, of course. I've felt this way for a while. Remember all thsoe chances the Dolphins flushed against New England, down in Florida, on the same bloody call?)
Did Denver really need to burn a TO (after the clock stops for a measurement) to call a fade? Or has Herm Edwards been advising on how to manage the clock?
If I'm New England, I'm testing Denver deep, especially if they keep blitzing.
Also, I agreed with the choice of going for it on 4th and 1, but the playcall was dumb.
There was no measurement, because they lost yardage on 3rd down.
I agree with 413, it's such a low percentage play.. unless your receiver is 7foot tall and the corner is 5feet tall, then I might do it. But on 4th down, it's definately a bad call. They could have thrown on third down and then come up with a sneak on 4th down. That would be respectable even if they don't make it.
Wow. That was so stupid. Either Shanahan has lost all faith in his offensive line, or he's really that dumb.
Who throws a fade on that route - especially when you can actually get a first down as well as a TD? Lame.
Does anyone else think that false start penalties are getting called really late this postseason? I swear I've never seen so many plays run mostly to completion when they should have been never happen because of a pre-snap penalty.
Does this game seem a ittle extra chippy to anyone else? Looks like a lot of semi-late hits getting thrown in, at least to me. (Faulk limping off as I type this.)
Asante Samuel looks tall... next to Ellis Hobbs.
The PAts are doing a good job picking up the Denver blitzers. Albeit, it's an overload so there are more people than they can cover.. the Pats trust Brady to find either the short guy who can stretch the other defenders (Branch) or the deep routes being run. Brady is being rushed and I'm pretty sure he's thrown to Branch twice in such Denver blitz situations.
should have been never happen
Wow. "Should have never happened"
after watching every player on closeup jabber at the camera i have to wonder... whatever happened to the classic old school glory of "hi mom"?
A few more things:
Colvin looked like a moron with the repeated signalling of false start, up to the point that an official had to push him away.
Triplette, you don't need to signal it 18 times. BB isn't blind.
The announcers were saying the D was built for the LBs to make plays. Well, ALL 34 defenses are like that. On this Pats team, though, the strength is the DL. Did you see how the Denver OL got pushed back on 3rd and 1? Kudos to Wilfork and Seymour.
Agreed. Several almost, maybe should have, not called in the playoffs late hits.
That's the Jake Plummer I know and love.
Watch his feet!
I have to admit, Dever looks better than NE so far, but at least the Pats look respectable.
Where's a Plummer int when you need one?... so close
Anyone taking bets on whether Triplette has the stones to overturn this?
Wilfork is the unheralded hero of the Pat's D line. The minute he faces less than a double team, the offense has a problem. Sooner or later, he's going to cost too much for the Patriots to keep him.
I think the discussion between Triplette and Belichick, was over whether the 5 yards would get a first down.
I was wondering which Plummer would show up.
Go go gadget replay!
Why didn't they hustle and try to get another play off before BB got the oppurtunity to decide to challenge it?
And they called a timeout! WTF is Denver doing?
Bad bad throw. And Denver call TO after the play. They must have known that the Pats would challenge, so why burn a TO?
Dumbest. Timeout. Ever. Mike Tice is relieved.
Whoa, Jeff! I apologize!
435: Clearly they borrowed Herm Edward's book of clock management.
By the way, for those of you playing the home game, Vince Wilfork was chosen with the pick the Patriots got from Baltimore so they could move up and take Kyle Boller. Thanks, Brian Billick!
The ball moved! The ball fucking moved!
Consistency? Anyone? Please?
Herm Edwards has done the exact same thing.
Are Bailey's arms that short? Wow, he didn't really make a play on the ball, so it looked to me.
Terry Bradshaw says that turnovers may determine the course of the game... or was that the impersonator? Was it the last game? Does anyone give a rat's ass? Do I?
Am I allowed to say that the announcers are disrespecting Plummer?
Am I allowed more questions?
Wasn't the left tackle downfield early?
Swagger alert... Swagger alert brady brady on fire
Branch took his Reggie Williams pill before the game. Yap, yap, yap. I'm all for the catches, but get back to the huddle, son.
That Brady to Davis pass was a thing of beauty. Genuflect indeed.
I don't think calling the fade on 4th and 1 was a bad decision, Plummer just overthrew the pass.
Just to clarify, I wasn't asking people not to joke about Brady. I was just asking people not to tell the same joke over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.
Jon (#445 )--
Branch backed up on the screen. The tackle was ahead of him, at the line.
Brady's completed less than 50% of his passes.
I'M SORRY! I'M SORRY! PLEASE FORGIVE ME! *genuflects profusely*
I just re-watched the play. The LOS is the 38, Branch catches it at the 39, while Ashworth is on the 36.
449, Why can't we tell the same joke over and over again? Isn't this Saturday Night Live? (Most. Overrated. Show. Ever.) Actually, i'm with Aaron on that.
If we didn't watch football, we wouldn't know how inspiid CBS's programming is.
No worries Aaron. Standup tip of the week, never acknowledge even the politest heckler unless you're making a joke out of them. Shows the audience their place.
3rd and 7, Brady magic time? Not so much. Time for Adam.
No picture on that scorecard. 3-0, Pats.
I like how Simms says, before the play, "Nice disguise of the blitz." Phil, if you can spot it before the snap, I guess they weren't disguising it all that well.
I've got bad feelings for Denver at this point. They've played well so far, but still manage to trail. NE is great at halftime adjustments.
Not liking how the Pats have been mostly unable to pick up the DEN blitz. Meanwhile, Plummer has all day back there.
If Vinatieri doesn't kick that way right there, it's blocked.
It went just around the hands of three Broncos.
Alright, I'm officially scared of Jake turning back into a pumpkin.
In the Seattle/Washington game, they called that intentional grounding.
Thinking more about the Lelie fade - why would you throw your critical goal-line pass to a guy who scored all of one TD all season? Not to mention the fact that Lelie's a deep threat, not a possession guy . . .
I think Shanahan's a bright guy and I like going for it there, but the call, yuck. In other words, I agree with the other 47 people who said this.
Jeb Putzier kind of scares me.
wow, Asante is really having a pretty good half. Even disregarding the INT.
We are almost thru the half and Brady has yet to throw a quality pass. The long one was thrown too close to Bailey, who should have easily knocked it away. Witht the safety drawn up, the ball should have been put where it led the receiver away from the coverage.
Every other completion has been a dink to a wide open receiver. Some of the misses have been really awful.
OK, sorry to keep bashing Phil Simms, but he just said the Broncos have dominated the game. What game is he watching? The Patriots' defense is destroying the Broncos' offense. Anderson and Bell have combined for eight carries and 20 yards.
Denver has to wonder how it's behind. They've had the better of it through the opening 27 minutes.
This is Todd Sauerbrun's field. Everyone else is just playing on it.
Do you think TMQ wrote "Game Over" when Denver did the 4th and 1 fade route?
465: I thought that strike to Givens was pretty nice. Of course, it happened after you posted.
Sauerbrun does get the best kicking "thud" in the league. It's unfair to have a former steroid user kicking in Mile High air.
In a game as low scoring as this, 3 pts mean a lot. Anyone else got a problem with Denver going for it and not taking the chip shot? And not 2d guessing just cause it didn't work.
Damn it. I missed the multiple of 12, so I'm just going to say it here: How did the genuflect cliche start? Is FO trying to become Fark or something?
I think Denver *has* dominated the game. They're definitely winning the field possesion battle. The score could easily be 14-3 Denver.
463: I believe it's called the Vrabel Maneuver.
469, Gregg will write GO when a team gets burned on a blitz. He'll forget all the blitzes the Broncos have executed perfectly tonight.
Get the alpo and the bone, Faulk just fumbled.
Great job, Asante.
That looked like obvious interference to me. I was wondering where the hell the flag was, when it finally came.
I guess the refs forgot about the "it's not PI if it's not catchable" rule. Typical Triplette bullshit.
Yikes - fumble, pass interference.
Wow, late flag. And geesh, Lelie's pushing him. I think that's a bad call, not to mention an insanely late call.
that's a crappy call - that ball was way too high
It looked to me like Samuel was trying to ride Lelie out of bounds. Is that legal if you have position? Is it legal if you're looking for the ball?
Bad PI call though.
Looked like Lelie initiated the contact there. May have been a late arm bar by Samuel, but that's reaching to say the least...
How was that even a catchable ball? It landed out of bounds.
And I'm in on the Broncos.
Horrible call, and the flag came way too late.
I don't really care who wins this game and I have a little bit of money on DEN, but that was a completely horseshit call. It was A; wrong, and B; about 5 secs too late.
Objective Eagles fan here.......not pass interference
464: back when Starks was starting, Samuel used to be known as NE's "good" cornerback. That would be before a small, untested rookie took over as their number one.
Did the Patriots just melt down so hard they took the FO server with them?
482: Normally I'm all for going for it on 4th and 1 inside the 10, but when you lose yardage on 3rd and short, it's time to kick a fieldgoal.
That looked like obvious interference to me. I was wondering where the hell the flag was, when it finally came.
Hardly. That was a BS call through and through. If anything it was offensive PI.
Huge turnover, and an even bigger penalty. I thought the call was harsh, and as I write Denver goes in from the 1.
Followed by another fumble! Two huge breaks for Denver and they needed them. They've had fantastic field position all through this half and not to take advantage of that would have been criminal.
While I'm on the subject of criminal, the more I see the P.I call, the less I like it.
Aaron, I like the new WordPress message. It makes a change.
So, how does the offensive player shoving the defensive player's shoulder (while said offensive player is clearly playing the ball, too) count as defensive pass interference? I mean, that was just a horrible call.
Also, on the huge Davis catch, I think there should have been a facemask penalty. While Davis was catching the ball, Bailey had his hands on Davis's helmet, and then grabbed his facemask as they were going down or as they hit the ground.
I don't think there's a time limit on calling penalties.
And it looked to me like the DB was trying to ride the WR out of bounds. But, that happened at the 12 or 15, not in the end zone.
492, I agree with the new WordPress message too.. At least it's creative.
That's the line of the year so far
samuel had a chance to play the ball b/c he knew where it was but decided to ride lelie out of the play instead. i think its PI if the defender plays the reciever instead of the ball even if he knows where it is, samuel initiated contact with the body instead of running to the ball.
asante samuel shouldn't worry too much, jake plummer will throw him another interception this half.
That PI call was bogus, and I am absolutely rooting for the Broncos in this one. It was just a BS call.
Sauerbrun causing the fumble - how on earth do you go back into the locker room after that one? Can you even be allowed to play football after that? Ever? It was a great form tackle though.
The DB is allowed to ride the guy out of bounds as long as he's looking for the ball. It's fine. Samuel had damn near perfect position, was looking back, and the contact was incidental at best. It was just a BS call from the league's worst officiating team.
Was that a naked screen?
I think the Pat decided to roll Brady out for the second half.
*genuflect* is from an ESPN Page 2 article... but I don't have the link.
An announcer just said QB sacks are overrated! Progress.
w00t! welcome back, passing game!
Big blitz on 3rd down. Big completion for a first down. Denver should know better. That was six, maybe seven men rushing. Bad, bad idea versus a good QB.
Denver's been blitzing all day, seemed good so far.
Looks like the Pats may have adjusted though.
There is a vast difference between a surprise blitz and a predictable blitz. Given a telegraph message that a blitz is coming, even mediocre pass blockers can adjust. Dash. Dot. Dash. Dash. Dot. Third and long, blitz coming...
The Refs have single-handedly given the Broncos 10 points in this game.
Crushinator (#507 )--
I dunno, those two fumbles may have contributed. :-(
Anyone else think the Broncos aren't running enough?
Leading the game + 2nd best rushing offense in NFL + Jake the Snake = RUN THE BALL ONCE IN A WHILE
Well, Belichek's certainly gotten the Broncos to turn away from the running game, and kept them from doing a damn thing with it.
I feel like everything's going the way the Patriots hoped they would, save the fumbles.
...and the score. That tends to count rather heavily in the end.
Looks like I was right. Best player on the field.
That was kind of implicit in my comment, that they want to be winning.
And it looks like they may soon be.
1st @ goal NE. Mike Vrabel time.
Re: 510, 511
I did some statistics, and the team with the most points at the game had high correlation with the team that won.
491: No way it was offensive PI. Samuel was in his way, and neither player really did much to the other except Samuel getting in Lelie's way and Lelie running into his back.
But it's irrelevant, since the ball was definitely uncatchable. No PI either way.
HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP HOLY CRAP
BEN WATSON JUST WENT DON BEEBE ON HIM!
My, My, My. What a play.
(insert disrespect joke here)
Probably won't mean anything, but great hustle by Watson.
Bailey is hurt. But what a great play.
Whoah, nice hustle by Ben Watson. Shades of Lett/Beebe. How does the TE from across the field catch Champ Bailey?
Brady gets owned for throwing a crazy pass, and Bailey gets owned for showboating.
At least no one can complain about league conspiracies theories about the officials giving the game to the refs. I don;t want to hear DEN complain about another call during the game.
Um, I know Bailey shouldn't pull up, but did no one else think about blocking Watson there?
If he fumbled it out of the end zone, what happens?
That has to be the first time a 100+ yard return was not a touchdown. Anyone?
I say it's out of bounds at the 1. Opinions?
I don't think there's any way that can be overturned. There's nothing close to indisputable evidence.
They can't overturn this. It's not "incontravertable"
Bailey did grab his hammy when he hit the ground - he may have pulled something. Or he may just have been gassed.
Still, hold the ball in the right hand!
It would be hilarious if this is a safety. Does back line of the endzone extend to infinity as well?
Ah, the ball didn't go far enough back.
WOW. I wish the camera shot was a little wider, because Watson looked like a damn rocket.
529. I think it should be a touchback because Bailey going out of bounds tossess the ball while his leg hits the pylon. This is a tough call though.
Kudos to Ben Watson though, to not give up.
That is really hard to find conclusive evidence to overturn. I'm sure if it was called a touchback it would've been hard to overturn too.
I don't think there's indisputable evidence here. Baily should have been carrying the ball in his outside hand.
So what's the rule?
If it crosses the plane of the sideline before crossing hteplane of the goalline, is it atouchback or OOB?
Payback for the year's of NE getting the breaks.
Payback for the tuck rule, the 20 uncalled interference calls against St. Louis in SB 36 and against Indy in '04.
Death to NE's colorless corpratism and arrogance! BB might be the rudest man of all-time...
Fantastic effort from Ben Watson. From that last aerial shot, he must have covered 120 yds.
Good call; there simply wasn't enough visual evidence.
But that was one hell of a save.
Not looking good for the magic beans.
101 yard non-touchdown, new record?
If the NFL is smart, the dispute over the Bailey fumble will lead to fixed cameras at both goal lines at all games. There is no way any of CBS's current cameras (or the refs) could have been in position to see anything there.
Damnit, damnit, damnit. Now for the next 84 years, I'm going to either have to hear how the refs gave the game to the Broncos and that's the only way the Patriots could lose, or the Patriots won in spite of having horrible calls and came back after huge odds against them.
Either way, those Pats fans (you know who they are) are going to be insufferable. Damn.
The player (#25) running with him kept looking over his left shoulder at Troy Brown and near the end steps in front of him. Should have checked his other shoulder. The other guy was heavy and gassed and unable to move to the block. Bailey needed to put that ball in his other hand, in that case, there would have been no doubt it would have been out of bounds. Honestly, I am rooting for a Denver win (Steeler fan, Patriot hater) but that ball probably went through the end zone. Visual evidence was unclear at best, so ruling on the field stands is understandable, but I think it went through the endzone and should have been a touchback.
I agree, there's no way you can overturn that.
That hustle by Ben Watson, shown from the blimp, is one of the most impressive plays I have ever seen.
Note to Patriots fans:
If the Pats lose, and you want to make the argument that the refs are to blame, DO NOT use this call as evidence. It will make you look like a blind homer.
Brady throws an INT, 2 fumbles lost and now Vinatieri misses a FG. Someone forgot their magic beans tonight.
and then Vinatieri misses - those beans had better get jumping in a hurry
Magic beans will only ever get you a giant beanstalk.
550: I plan on using the phantom pass interference call for this game.
Visual evidence is easy. You know where the ball landed. You know where the pylon is. Extend the line. On which side of the line was the ball when it left the ballcarrier?
Fumbles bounce funny. But, oddly enough, they fly through the air in a straight line.
Looked like a gutless noncall to me.
What happened to Brady stepping it up in the playoffs and Vinatieri being the best clutch kicker in NFL history?
NE fumbles the punt. If this goes in, game over.
Oh thing of beauty.
Today isn't a good day to be fielding punts, apparently.
I think that might have all but sealed up this game with that fumble.
Has Brady ever actually come back? All his "game-winning drives" of lore are when they're tied???
I think history is going to remember this more as a game where the Patriots lost because they played worse and couldn't hold onto the ball, and happened to get a bad call and a borderline call against them.
So help me, if the Pats come back and win this and the writers rave about how Brady willed them to victory, I will vomit from my eyes. Course, with that catch I would say the odds are against it.
Brady misses another open receiver...and Vinatieri clutches one wide right.
Ding-dong the witch is dead, the witch is dead, the witch is dead.
Or a nice cow.
Well this has been an atrocious game by the Patriots.
Two fumbles, a muffed fair catch, and a pick. Ugly.
Anyone else notice the similarities between this game and last playoff game in Denver, the 1998 AFC Championship? So many opposition fumbles, all recovered by the Broncos; really poor special teams play; a really low scoring first half, etc.
One crucial difference: Ed Hochuli was the ref in that game.
I'll agree with you on that one :)
If the Pats pull this out, there will be global genuflecting on a scale never seen before.
Bailey's position had changed during the ball's flight from his hand to the ground. You must fix his location when the ball left his hand, then trace the line to the landing spot. I don't know if the present technology enables that.
I come down on the "it's not incontrovertible and let's not hear any more about the tuck rule" side.
Well regardless of what happens from here on out, I do not think DEN has looked very good at all and I expect IND to win by 10 minimum. NE has handed this game to DEN with all the fumbles and such and DEN has not done anything convincing with it.
I believe Bobby Wade has pulled a Frank Drebin / Enrico Palazzo on every Patriots return man. They'll find Ellis Hobbs and Troy Brown trussed up in a utility closet after the game.
Mike Anderson is having the greatest 17-carries-for-47-yards game in the history of the NFL.
DEN needs to review the defensive concept of "selling yardage for time"
Just to be certain, Pittsburgh havent conceded tomorrows game have they?
#571 - I think that while the Broncos as a whole looked pretty good, but Plummer and the cornerback have not.
I don't see the point of the Broncos kicking that field goal. How is being up by 14 any better than being up by 11? If Denver runs it again, they take more time off the clock, and have a pretty good shot of ending the game.
TomC, outstanding Naked Gun reference. Well said.
Who swapped the Patriots for the Saints? They've been terrible. And yet, they still have a shot to win this one. Kicking the FG means the Pats need 2 TDS, but a 1st down on 4th and 2 wins the game.
As I write Lynch picks Brady, and my point is moot.
"I'm sorry sir, but the Blue Plate Magic Beans Special is off today".
571: Indy ain't in the AFC Championship yet.
I see four key differences between this game and the last PIT-IND game:
1. Silent count.
2. Better D-line play.
3. Marvel Smith back in for revolving door.
4. Roethlisberger not in first game back, no thumb issues, no knee issues.
admit it. you are dying to see what borges writes tomorrow.
The silver lining of all this for the Pats is - more rest == fewer injuries == better luck next year.
Can't expect a super bowl every year, I guess...
pats blew that game with the turnovers,
but I've never seen a worse called game. Its like they replaced them with the Sun Belt refs. That PI on samual should have been called on ashley lelie. I counted 3 obvious PI on denvers DBs that werent called, and that muffed punt, brown fumbled it, but the bronco hit him before the ball hit the ground, which is suppsed to be a 15 yard penalty, whether or not the guy has control of the ball.
Pats lost because people started giving them enough respect.
Oh, delicious apples. Tasty, delicious apples.
I think complaining about the refs is one of the lesser-known stages of grief.
Pats lost because they played a good team that got to Brady early and often. I was very impressed by the way Denver played. Sure, there were a couple non-calls that would have heled the patriots, but Asante Samuel was a walking pass interference flag today, and only got caught once. Compared to the early game, the officiating was brilliant.
Let's give the Broncos some credit. They played a heck of a game.
um, are we still supposed to genuflect?
582: Only a penalty if he still has a chance to catch it. Considering the ball was nearly on the ground and several feet from him, it was NOT fair catch interference.
The fair catch interference call against Pittsburgh I assume you're referring to was made because officials erroneously believed the ball was still within his reach.
Re 555: Can you always assume that a football is traveling straight in the air in a fumble. Footballs can spin (like a field goal). The wind could slightly change the trajectory of the football's path during the fumble. Yes, I know the path would only be changed very very slightly, but this is why you cant try to draw a line in this situation. It seems very harsh to call the non-reversible gutless in this case.
Apologies in advance to Aaron and nice Pats fans.
But... everyone who gave the Broncos no chance in this one... how's that pie?
The Pats lost because they had 5 turnovers. I don't care what team you are - you turn the ball over 5 times, and ref calls or no, you're highly unlikely to win that game.
Yeah, there were two fairly questionable calls - the PI call and the int return - but the 5 turnovers were totally unquestionably the Patriot's fault (or Denver's success, take your pick).
Dude, you know good and well that PI penalty that was called on Samuel that set up that TD was such an utter B.S. call.
Denver was the better team today because they won, but don't act like Denver was the '85 Bears or anything out there.
If anyone seriously thinks PIT has a chance tommorow I will take bets of any amount just post your email and I will arrange a straightup wager :)
Seriously, minus the Polamalu interception that game was 100% IND and I am guessing IND will be more prepared for this one. All of those things you mentioned about PIT playing better can be repeated in various ways for IND.
I would say the 10pt line is just about right and for those of you who haven't bet playoff games in the past 10pt is a pretty big line.
Obviously PIT could win tommorow but I would put the odds at less than 20%
And I like PIT a lot more than IND from a fan perspective.
Only two questions - when did the NFL change the rule regarding uncatchable balls and pass interference? And if Bailey was carrying the ball in his right hand and is in the field of play how is his fumble not a touchback? All that said without either the Faulk or the Brown fumble the Pats win the game, so they had their chances.
How hard to you think Peyton is smiling right now?
pbp at NFL.com doesn't have the Bailey interception. It's just blank, then the next play Denver has the ball.
Apologies to Patriots fans, but I was really happy to see Denver win.
I have to admit that I'm a Broncos fan and am glad they won. Having said that, I think they were very lucky at home to win this game. The Patriots had at least one very questionable call against them, and Denver lucked out on getting some turnovers. Still, I think that Denver deserves the win.
As a through-and-through Denver fan, I will say the following:
1. Tom Brady got the hell smacked out of him out there...ouch.
2. That PI call was awful.
3. Asante Samuel reached "Deion Sanders early in his career" levels in the first half in my mind. Throw to the other side of the field!
4. What a play by Ben Watson, that blimp shot was fantastic
Congrats to Sauerbrun on player-of-the-game honors. Grats to everyone who picked him before kickoff.
Becephalus: Do you really think it's crazy to think that one top-flight team stands no chance against another? It's not like the Colts haven't lost this year. And the PIT/IND game was not going too poorly until happy onside kick time. I think Indianapolis is getting a bit of the same awe that the Patriots have been getting. We just saw what happened to them today.
Oh, and according to Aaron's "games that matter" weighted DVOA, I believe the Steelers are 4% behind. They're a good road team, Indy's a good home team. Looks like a good matchup to me.
Correction: "stands a chance."
Denver won by 14 points. Even if all of the calls go the Pat's way, 14 points is a lot to explain away. If it was a 3 pointer or a even a touchdown game, the Pats fans might have a point, but face it, we won legit.
Patrick Peterson's dominant coverage was a big reason the Cardinals won their first division title in six years.
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