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While Saturday won't give us an answer to which is the best one-loss team, it is still a big week for conference races across the country.

24 Nov 2006

The Week in Quotes: November 24, 2006

compiled by Alex Carnevale

WE'RE SO THANKFUL, AND WE SO WANT TO MUTILATE THE OPPOSITION THIS SUNDAY

"We are especially thankful after another huge victory for the Titans."

-- Tennessee Titans DL Travis LaBoy, in his newspaper column after the Titans' win over the Eagles this past Sunday.

"We could be at home right now with our families, but we've been blessed to play a game for a living."

-- Broncos LB Al Wilson, before Thursday night's Chiefs-Broncos game. (The NFL Network)

"I figured out that I've been fighting for this for 37 years. That's my understanding. And I would not want it any other way. I'm not seeking for us to get a priority right, like Dallas and Detroit have. But I am seeking that those teams not have that priority right."

-- Lamar Hunt, owner of the Kansas City Chiefs, on the fact that the Thanksgiving night game will rotate between NFL teams.

OH THE THINGS TIKI WILL SAY TO OBSCURE THE FACT THAT HIS QUARTERBACK CAN'T PLAY

"We have to find a way to correct it. That's the bottom line. I talked about this earlier in the season; if you don't have balance you can't win in the NFL. A disproportionate amount of teams that win, win it by running the football. That's football. It's not complicated. This is something that teams and kids and coaches do from 12 years old to college and beyond. It isn't rocket science."

-- Tiki Barber, on the Giants abandoning the run in a Monday night defeat at the hands of the Jaguars.

"Yeah, it's a challenge, but we are not scared of anyone. We have played against the best defenses in this league, against the run and overall, and we've run the ball. We've done effective things. We have executed in the pass game."

-- Barber

"We got away from it early and never got back to it because we felt like we weren't executing or finding any type of rhythm, but we never got back to it. I felt insignificant for the first time in my career -- I should say this season -- and it was frustrating."

-- Barber

I'M SURE THEY'RE SCARED OF A LAME DUCK RUNNING BACK AND HIS UNDERSIZED PALS

"So I think you put yourself halfway to failure to say we can't do something because of another team's personnel. It's a slap in the face of me and a slap of my front five guys. We don't take to that very kindly."

-- Barber

"I am not here to be a cheerleader, someone who fades into the background. My job is to help this team win. The opportunities I get will dictate that."

-- Barber

"You say you have a couple of negative plays you just can't do it any more? That's a cop-out. The one thing you have to do as a team, whether it's passing the ball or running the ball is establish an identity and believe in something and have faith in it and do it over and over again. In some ways dare a team to stop you. We haven't done that. I think that's why we've faltered these last couple of games."

-- Barber (New York Post)

OK, WE F---ED UP. WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TRADED FOR HIM. WE CRY EVERY SUNDAY FOR WHAT WE'VE LOST.

"Obviously, in this business, you need the courage of your convictions. I'm totally convinced by Eli's ability. I have the same conviction about him I always did and so does everybody in this organization. All the hysteria doesn't mean a thing to me."

-- Giants general manager Ernie Accorsi

"Eli's a concern. When you talk about nine dropped balls you are not talking about a very good performance. Everybody around him has to play better."

-- Giants coach Tom Coughlin

"I have faith in Eli. I think he will find a way to correct the mistakes he has been making. He can shore up his mechanics and become the leader we saw earlier this season. I really do believe that."

-- Barber

AND PEYTON THREW HIS O-LINE UNDER THE BUS?

"Fred Taylor's an outstanding running back."

-- Coughlin (WFAN.com)

"We feel like he's got to play better. We feel like we've got to get more consistency ... the interceptions are just killing us."

-- Coughlin, backing up his franchise quarterback.

"Your quarterback has to play well for you to have the opportunity or the chance to win. So many of us are so dependent on how the quarterback plays.... There's no doubt he has to play better."

-- Coughlin

"We didn't play well enough, we didn't execute real well, and we got to fix that. We got to make plays. We got to keep the defense on the field. Every quarterback goes through a phase when he's not playing great football. You can't lose your confidence. You can't be gun-shy. I haven't played well in two games. That doesn't mean I have to change everything."

-- Giants QB Eli Manning (New York Daily News)

"LAST THANKSGIVING/I GAVE YOU MY HEART/BUT THE VERY NEXT DAY YOU GAVE IT AWAY/THIS YEAR TO SAVE ME FROM TEARS/I'LL GIVE IT TO SOMEONE SPECIAL"

"He needs to worry about right now and next year will come. Let's go ahead and take care of this year and then, if he feels that way, then we'll address that at the end of the year. But right now, we're trying to win football games. He's a part of the football team. I expect him to try to help us win football games.''

-- Raiders head coach Art Shell, on Moss

"You're not going to get him to understand that there's 57 other guys in here trying to get this job done, too, so, if you have an issue with upstairs or whatever the hell it may be, you have a month and a half. That's six weeks."

-- Raiders DT Warren Sapp, on Randy Moss (ESPN.com)

"Sit down, shut up and let's play football, and then go talk to those people about whatever you got going. But you're not going to get that.''

-- Sapp

I CAN'T BRING MYSELF TO WATCH, BUT I ASSUME HE'S GIVING HIS BEST EFFORT

"I assume he's putting forth every effort to be successful when he's running his routes and trying to get open. That's the assumption, and let's hope that that's happening. He's doing that. He's trying.''

-- Shell

"I stay away from that drama. You can't be buying into a lot of the hoopla going around from certain individuals.''

-- Raiders QB Aaron Brooks

SINCE WE REFUSE TO EAT THE COST, WE FEEL THAT WE SHOULD DETERMINE WHICH OF OUR CUSTOMERS DOES

"It's still a matter of us believing the price is too high and that NFL Network should be part of a sports tier so the price of the network isn't spread to all our customers. It should go only to those who wish to subscribe to the channel."

-- Time Warner Houston spokesman Ray Purser, on the conflict between the NFL Network and major cable systems over carrying the network.

"It's the most valuable programming a cable company can offer, and a cable company not carrying live NFL games is like a grocery store not carrying milk."

-- NFL Network spokesman Seth Palansky (Indianapolis Star)

DO 'PLAYOFFS?' JUST ONCE FOR US THERE JIMMY

"It worries me a little bit because my son is the head coach down there. But he's a great athlete, my son likes him a lot, he's a good kid. But he's not a passer. And you need a passer at quarterback to be successful consistently in the National Football League. And he ain't getting it done in that category."

-- NFL Network analyst Jim Mora, on his son's franchise quarterback Michael Vick.

"He regrets it."

-- Falcons coach Jim Mora Jr., on his dad's comments.

HE'S NOT A COACH-KILLER, NO. HE'S THE GREATEST PLAYER ... EVER

"I'm a huge Mike Vick fan. I always have been. I love the guy. He's a great player and I think he's a better person. I don't care what anybody says about Mike. If I was starting a franchise and I could pick one guy all-time, I would pick Mike Vick. That's how I feel about it."

-- Jim Mora Jr.

"Honestly, I don't even know what to say. I think it was inappropriate. But, hey, when you're commentating, I guess you've got a right to say what you want to say. I just keep playing football. At the same time, it's crazy."

-- Falcons QB Michael Vick

BUNCHA COMPLAINING DEFENSIVE BACKS

"That's bull. Obviously, I won't say anything to Brian because he didn't hit me and the guy is on the opposite team and I'm not taking up for that guy. But if you look at the nature of the game, they always complain when we put our hands on them or cut block."

-- Braylon Edwards, on the hit Browns DB Brian Russell put on Chad Johnson last week.

"But yet you have a play like that where Chad Johnson clearly wasn't going to catch the pass, Leigh Bodden already intercepted it and Brian just leveled him. You see it time and time again. It's a rough game and we choose to play it, so it comes with the territory."

-- Edwards

"But at the same time, protect the players. We're trying to do the same thing those guys are."

-- Edwards

"I don't see the need for those two plays. I really don't."

-- Edwards, on that play and the Houshmanzadeh hit from the week before.

"I'm going to try to hit anybody I get a chance to, if it's a clean shot. If I get a chance to hit somebody this week it's going to happen."

-- Hitter Brian Russell

"It's football. I don't care about hits. It's going to happen. It's part of the game."

-- Hittee Chad Johnson (MSNBC.com)

WHISPER THOSE SWEET NOTHINGS TO ME AGAIN BILL

"I think we're all looking forward to it, but right now I think the most important thing is just getting ready for the Bears. No matter what field you play them on, or play them in a parking lot or whatever, they're a great football team. So we need good preparation. We need to be on top of everything. We'll let the people that are working on the field worry about the field and we'll just worry about the Bears.... If we can get on it later in the week, we probably will."

-- Bill Belichick, on the new FieldTurf at Gillette Stadium (Patriots.com)

"I guess the easiest way to put it would be that those numbers signify how many players are in the deep part of the field. So in Cover-2 you have the two safeties that are in the deepest part of the field and basically five players in the underneath zone. In Cover-3, you have three players in the deep part of the field and basically four players in the underneath zones. And in 4-coverage, you have four players potentially in the deep part of the field if they send four receivers deep; if they only send three receivers deep then you'd only have three and if they only send two, you'd only have two. But it's how many players defend the deep part of the field and that, naturally, is reciprocal to how many players you have defending the underneath areas. So if they're throwing short, you'd like to be Cover-2 and have that extra guy down there. If they're throwing deep, you'd like to be in Cover-4 and be able to carry four vertical receivers. If you want to be somewhere in the middle, then that's kind of Cover-3. So that's sort of where that comes from."

-- Bill Belichick, on the difference between cover schemes.

"I think he's a good player. I think he's a really good player. I think he's having a really good year. I think he's done a really good job for us. He does a lot of things well. He rushes well. He covers well. He plays the run. He's a smart player and hardly makes any mistakes. I think he's a real solid guy."

-- Belichick, on DL Rosevelt Colvin

AND ... PEYTON MANNING HAS A MOM. WE HAD ASSUMED ARCHIE HAD AN IMMACULATE CONCEPTION.

"Those are your children. That's where your heart is."

-- Olivia Manning, on watching her kids play football. (CBC.ca)

"The father will go to the game or the uncle or anyone else, and they'll watch the son, but they'll watch the play. The mother will not take her eyes off the son."

-- John Madden

"It's extremely hard watching him."

-- Sheryl Carr, whose son David has been sacked a whopping 232 times so far in 4 1/2 seasons with the Houston Texans.

"If Don would catch a pass or get tackled, he'd be on the ground for a short amount of time. In the stands I'm thinking, 'You're OK. You're a big tough guy, you can handle this. When it's your own child out there, this is somebody you've cared for. It's been your responsibility their entire life. It's kind of hard to just turn that switch off."

-- Betsey Hasselbeck

YOU AND EVERY GIANTS FAN OUT THERE, OLIVIA

"With Peyton, as he's gotten older and I know he's in command of his team and situations, I think it's easier to watch him than Eli, who's in his third year and still making some younger-player mistakes."

-- Olivia Manning

JEFF GARCIA'S MOM IS PRETENDING SHE DOESN'T KNOW HIM, BUT YES, WE SEE YOUR POINT

"They're still our little boys."

-- Wilma McNabb

VANDERJAGT GETS HIS AND ALL IS RIGHT WITH THE WORLD

"I'm not saying I'm losing patience, but you have to look at it for what it is. Right now, it needs to get better."

-- Cowboys head coach Bill Parcells, on the struggles of the Cowboys kicker.

"We have to make those field goals. He's the most accurate kicker in the game, but that hasn't shown like, hopefully, it will. He's got to get some confidence and knock those balls through like he has his whole career."

-- Cowboys owner Jerry Jones, on Vanderjagt.

DR. LIVINGSTONE, DR. PARCELLS

"It doesn't make any difference if I know what it is. I don't have a Dr. Livingstone's frozen elixir. I don't know what I can do. This guy is 36 years old and has been kicking for a long time. He has his way of doing things. Hopefully, things get a little bit better."

-- Parcells (Houston Chronicle)

"He gets it. He has that. The good thing about this football team is, their sensitivity level is pretty well gone by now. They can say anything to each other."

-- Parcells, on LB Bradie James (Cowboys.com)

"He's managing the game well. And that's what he's supposed to do. He's a football guy and he's interested in playing well. But we've got a ways to go here. So put the anointing oil away, OK?"

-- Parcells, on Tony Romo's five-TD performance on Thanksgiving.

A LITTLE HOLIDAY WISDOM FROM THE HEAD MAN IN KC

"I'm just thankful for that afternoon during the combine that Herman [Edwards] said 'How about that UCLA guy?' How about him, we got to draft him.'"

-- Chiefs defensive coordinator Gunther Cunningham, on S Jarrad Page. (KCChiefs.com)

"Basically, yeah, because they were in field goal range. But I just felt at that point we were going to go for it and I'm glad we did. We talked about it and everybody was kinda saying, 'What should we do?' I said, 'Let's go for it. Here's the game. We'll see what we are.'"

-- Chiefs head coach Herman Edwards, on a crucial fourth down decision in Sunday's win over the Raiders.

"That's why he's our quarterback and why he's been a great quarterback, to be quite honest. He's the guy at the end when you need seven games -- and it's a seven-game series for us -- that he's the guy who enables us to win football games. He did that and he did that with help. That's why you bring a guy like that back. I'm a firm believer that there are reasons guys are starters. It's not by accident."

-- Edwards, on QB Trent Green.

CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR THERE BOSS

"Matt's not down here playing football, we are. If they want to chant 'Fire Millen,' they should be chanting to fire the whole damn team. All Matt does is bring in players, and every year we talk about how much talent we have. So it should be on us. This isn't about Matt."

-- Lions LB Boss Bailey

NATURALLY, EVERYBODY KNOWS HE SUCKS BUT COACH GIBBS

"For whatever reason, sometimes you have a tough time. I don't know if it's something he ate, something he drank, a different hairdo. You can't really explain it."

-- LB Marcus Washington on teammate Sean Taylor's ineffectiveness this season.

"He's not a guy that's going to be loud or talkative -- unless somebody's in his face. They took that away from him this year. Getting in people's face, that was his game."

-- Philip Daniels, on the effect of the NFL's crackdown against taunting on Taylor's play.

"Sean's been in there every play, and we think he's playing at a high level. When you're not doing well as a team, it reflects on everybody. He's one-11th of what's going on over there."

-- Skins head coach Joe Gibbs

WELL, LT DID GO NO. 5

"That would be too easy to use that as an excuse. Because at some point, he's the fifth pick, he's got to be able to do it all. The fifth pick, you've got to be smart, you've got to be athletic, you've got to be able to hit, you've to be able to cover."

-- Skins DB Shawn Springs

"Everybody's struggling on the team, not just Sean. A lot of guys are not playing the same way they did last year, you can see it in the results."

-- Skins CB Carlos Rogers

"I'm just happy that he's changed. He's got a family. Anything on the field, he can correct. I'm just satisfied with him being a better guy that way."

-- Daniels (CBC.ca)

HE'S A FIERY GUY WHO HATES JEWS, AND WE'RE GONNA MISS HIM

"It stinks. I'm not real excited about that. I don't know why they decided to do it right now. He's been a great player for our team, and he's done a good job for us. We're going to miss him. He's a fiery guy. He has a good time out there. We're all good friends with him on defense, and we're gonna miss the personality in the locker room because he's not going to be around this week. It stinks, man. Like I said, I don't know why they did it this week, but that's the NFL for you."

-- Bears LB Brian Urlacher, on the NFL suspending Ricky Manning Jr. for his drunken anti-Semitic assault.

"I can't really talk about it. It's a decision Ricky made; we'll live with it. We knew it was coming. We didn't exactly know what it would be. Now we know, and we'll move on from here."

-- Bears head coach Lovie Smith

BYE BYE JAKE

"We have had some good games, we have had some average games, and we have had some poor games on offense."

-- Broncos head coach Mike Shanahan

"I've been on the hot seat all year. If I have one good game, it doesn't mean I'm off it."

-- Jake Plummer

"We are just going to keep on working to get better. A lot of people, a lot of components that make it work and hopefully we can improve a little bit in that area because we are off a little bit, especially in our drop-back passing."

-- Shanahan

HE MAY HAVE REALIZED THIS A BIT TOO LATE

"Just making decisions, making the right decisions. I don't like my completion percentage. If we complete the ball more, it's just more chances for guys to make plays."

-- Plummer

"For all of you who have never played a game, everything doesn't work perfectly at times. But you've got to fight through those times. Eventually, things go your way."

-- Plummer (MSNBC.com)

BETTER ASK WILL CARROLL IF YOU'RE GONNA PLAY THIS SUNDAY

"When did he tell you that? Today?"

-- Bills running back Willis McGahee, on head coach Dick Jauron saying he's a game-time decision. (ESPN.com)

"I guess. To tell you the truth, I don't even know. I would like to."

-- McGahee, on whether or not Jauron's assessment was realistic.

I SWEAR TO GOD THEY THREW THIS GAME

"[An official] said that [Williams] made contact within the [5-yard limit] and it was before the ball was thrown. I said, 'I find it hard to believe my quarterback would throw to a guy who's on the ground and just throw it right to someone on defense.'"

-- Colts coach Tony Dungy on Manning's first INT Sunday to Dallas Clark who may have been pushed down (ESPN.com)

PERHAPS ELI WAS POISONED? TOM HAS SOMEONE LOOKING INTO IT.

"You get your food poisoned. They don't want you out there on Sunday. You don't think about it. It just got crazy."

-- Warren Sapp, on malicious evildoers trying to poison him before games.

"I know it's real, especially in Philly, come on."

-- Sapp

"I know what Warren's talking about. If you were Warren, a lot of people may target you.... When I was in Jacksonville, Tom [Coughlin] said, 'Don't eat anything outside of what we're served as a team.'"

-- Chargers wideout Keenan McCardell

THE REST

"We have been wanting to do some community service and had been praying about it, and the Clubhouse seemed like the perfect place because it helps so many people have an outlet for support."

-- Brandy Myers, wife of Denver Broncos DT Michael Myers (Clarion Ledger)

"I think it's important that I have the confidence from Coach Reid that I am the guy, that this team knows who the quarterback is going to be."

-- new Eagles starting quarterback Jeff Garcia

"Watching them play last year, I thought they had the best left side in football that I saw live, in the games that I participated in last year. I don't think it's the same this year."

-- Packers coach Mike McCarthy, on the Seattle Seahawks.

"We don't think of ourselves as a bunch of deadbeats."

-- Bucs head coach Jon Gruden, whose team was obliterated on Thanksgiving.

"It was away from the ball. I sent it into the league to ask for a clarification. I don't know that I would classify it as illegal or dirty. I think it's avoidable. I'd like to see the competition committee look at it just to take it out. The league has done a great job making this game a little bit safer, taking away some of the unnecessary exposure from guys. I don't know there's a rule against what I saw on tape, but I think we can avoid it."

-- Jaguars coach Jack Del Rio, on the hit that took out DB Donovin Darius for the season (Seattle Post-Intelligencer)

"I feel a lot better. I feel like I changed sexes. I feel like I'm a different human being. Changed sexes. I'm a different human being right now."

-- Bengals DT Sam Adams (Cincinnati.com)

"It's not always going to be peachy for you where the quarterback does a bootleg and falls down. But you have to be able to change and go with the flow and not get uptight and get bent out of shape when things aren't going your way."

-- Panthers DL Mike Rucker (

-- Chad Johnson, on DL Adalius Thomas defending him last November. (Sports Illustrated)

"On a personal level, you feel terrible for him ... He finally gets the opportunity to play and that happens to him."

-- Mike McCarthy, on the plight of the now-done-for-the-season Aaron Rodgers (RealFootball365.com)

Posted by: Alex Carnevale on 24 Nov 2006

29 comments, Last at 27 Nov 2006, 6:06pm by Bobman

Comments

1
by Marko (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 3:51pm

I just read that Lamar Hunt was unable to attend last night's game because he was in a Dallas hospital. I hope he is OK, and it's too bad he had to miss his team finally hosting a Thanksgiving game.

As for the Giants, is anyone else getting sick of Tiki Barber like I am? There's some truth in what he's saying, but he comes off in such a condescending and arrogant manner. I'm sure Coughlin didn't appreciate his comments, just like he didn't appreciate his comments after last year's playoff loss to Carolina, when he threw Coughlin and his staff under the bus.

As for Ricky Manning Jr., I think you're being a bit harsh. First of all, it is far from established that he actually made the anti-Semitic comments that have been attributed to him. He has vehemently denied making the statements, and the judge who accepted his plea bargain apparently believed him, because from what I have read about his case, the judge could not have accepted the plea bargain if Manning had made the statements. (I think this has to do with a hate crime statute.) The person claiming Manning made the statements, the victim in the attack, apparently did not initially tell the police that Manning had many anti-Semitic statements. That claim only came later, when the victim was preparing to file a civil suit against Manning. That puts the credibility of the accuser seriously at issue.

Thus, this is not like the recent Mel Gibson and Michael Richards incidents, where blatantly offensive anti-Semitic or racially charge statements are not just alleged, but have been corroborated or even recorded. If it is established that Manning actually made the highly offensive statements, then condemnation of Manning definitely is appropriate, and he deserves whatever criticism comes his way. Until that time, your comments strike me as irresponsible. I also note that Manning formerly was engaged to a woman who is half-Jewish. I don't think that someone who had been engaged to such a woman would make the comments that the victim claims Manning made.

Second, I haven't seen it reported anywhere that Manning was drunk at the time of the incident. Maybe you are assuming he must have been drunk to be at Denny's in the early hours of the morning. However, unless there is evidence that he was drunk, I again think it is inappropriate to claim he was drunk.

Notwithstanding the above, I do think the one game suspension of Manning was warranted. He did play a role in the incident, although it was minor. From what I have read, the videotape of the incident did show that Manning pushed or shoved the victim in the head and then immediately left the diner. (Manning claims he was provoked, but even if he was, he shouldn't have responded physically.) The savage beating of the victim then took place after Manning was gone. In light of what happened, a one game suspension seems fair.

2
by MFurtek (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 4:01pm

The Washington front 7 has dropped off the planet this year. Taylor has to be all over the field... although he seems a bit slow both mentally and physically defending the pass.

3
by Towens (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 4:51pm

1. Um, time and energy spent defending the likes of Ricky Manning Jr. could really be better spent elsewhere. So he shoved the guy in the head, but left before the savage beating? Wow, what a guy!

I am sick of Tiki. 100 percent agree. You're going to retire, fine, now shut it.

I am also sick of the NFL network thing. The more I watch the more I dislike the NFL. Inane commercials on frequent loops, and endless press conferences where players and coaches betray how dumb and cliche-dependent they are. So I'm supposed to side with that over the cable companies? The NFL and the cable companies are both semi-monopolies. One's more evil than the other?

4
by Marko (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 5:04pm

I didn't claim Ricky Manning Jr. was a great guy. I said he shouldn't have shoved the guy in the head (even if provoked) and agreed that he deserved a suspension. I merely criticized the characterization as fact of the unsubstantiated claim that he made anti-Semitic comments and the speculative claim that he was drunk at the time of the incident.

5
by Towens (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 5:06pm

4. True, but "drunken anti-Semitic assault" does flow ever so nicely.

6
by Kyle (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 5:17pm

Re: 1
Yes. Up until, I'd say, the first week after the retirement plans went public, every person I discussed football with, whether a fan of the Giants, neutral to the team, or sworn enemy, everyone spoke of how great a person Tiki was. Consummate professional. Team player. Intelligent. Well-spoken. Renaissance Man. We all, myself included, ignored his outburst after Carolina, because we all left the stadium that day shaking our heads at the poor coaching, so his stab at Coughlin seemed not only justified, not only necessary, but painfully obvious.

Now, however, in what I want to estimate is Week 6 of the Tiki Barber Retirement Tour 2006, public opinion is changing. Your chosen words mirror what I myself and many others use to describe him now. Arrogant. Condescending. Convinced of his own genius. Smug. Skill-wise, the man is still one of the top 3 running backs in the NFL, miniscule touchdown total and all. Personality wise, he's far too high and mighty at this point. EA Matchup caught film of him lecturing Eli how to throw a seam pass to the TE in the Houston game two weeks ago, and the I admittedly missed the context of the clip as I woke up late (830am show and all), but I assume Tiki's Seam Pass 101 lesson came after Shockey's "drop" in the end zone. I can only imagine what the camera doesn't pick up with him and every player on the team.

He went from no-name to budding star to underappreciated All-Pro to Easterbrook's TTNY (The Toast of New York) to tiresome in a span of 3 years.

7
by Tighthead (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 6:16pm

Tighthead went on record as leading the anti-Tiki backlash a few weeks ago.

8
by MFurtek (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 7:06pm

Throwing this out here, I don't think any FO commentators have said this but it seems like *some* people are about one step away from this thought. To make it clear I'm not referring to any of the above commentators.

"We like our African American athletes uneducated, not-well spoken, and cliche' filled. Instead of calling them outlawwed racial terms, we'll call them thugs and knuckleheads. Don't get educated, don't have ambition, and don't do anything but play sports."

I've had this thought for awhile when hearing Tiki discussed. Maybe everyone is just expressing, "I'm sick of hearing Tiki Barber all the time...".

9
by mawbrew (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 7:14pm

Braylon Edwards owes Brian Russell an apology, immediately if not sooner. Russell's hit on Johnson was clean. Russell's gotta figure Johnson's going to catch that ball and try to hit him hard enough to separate it. There's no way Russell can anticipate that Johnson will miss the catch anymore than the Bengal defender could have anticipated that Trent Green was going to slide late the week before.

The only bull(bleep) on that play sits right in the laps of the Bengal coaches. Up 24 points with a few minutes left in the game and they've still got their starters in and are calling pass plays. Karma.

Edwards may be friends with Johnson, but he's not going to have many friends in the Cleveland locker room if he doesn't straighten this out.

10
by Towens (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 7:27pm

8. I see your point. I don't at all mind the idea of an outspoken athlete, black or otherwise, and I certainly don't mind anyone who retires early.

Barber's gotten old for me because he seems to be whining a lot. About his team and teammates, coaching, the media giving him a hard time about retiring. There is a fine line between being outspoken and unseemly whining.

I like the idea of an athlete speaking his mind when he has something to say, but Barber seems to be mostly bitching lately.

11
by mawbrew (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 7:30pm

Regarding Manning, given that it was a plea agreement, I don't think there was any evidence presented inconsistent with Manning's account. So a judge wouldn't have had any basis for determining the accuracy of that account. The point about it being a mistake to charaterize Manning as drunken and anti-semetic, is right I think, given it is still a subject of dispute. That said, I wouldn't be too quick to believe Manning's version of the story.

Re: 8

I'm just throwing this hand grenade out there. To be clear, I'm not intending for it to hurt anyone. Think the cops will buy that rationale?

12
by Tighthead (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 7:35pm

My issue with Barber had more to do with the media gush. He seems like a decent guy, but all of a sudden the media were in competition over how to praise the guy.

My all time favourite player is Emmitt, who was also pretty much a non-thug. For the record, I am not in favour of athletes of any colour appearing on a dance contest. That transcends all racial divides.

13
by jdb (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 9:51pm

re-Ricky Manning.
I'm a Bears fan, and I'm as sick of hearing about athletes and and their domestic battery/fn'dc (fightin in da' club)/drunk driving/other various idiotic exploits as the next person. and manning definitely screwed up. I think a mere one game suspension is pretty darned generous.
but calling someone an anti-Semite is a really serious charge (I'm also half Jewish). manning might be an immature jerkoff but there's a pretty big difference. at the very least, I think if you're going to make a charge like that, it's wrong to do it in jest.
oh, and one more thing.

14
by MFurtek (not verified) :: Fri, 11/24/2006 - 11:35pm

maybrew,
You could've just said, "I'm not touching that one with a 20 foot pole".

There's a sensitive line between: we can't criticize him because he is black--He's smart, for being black--I'm threatened by him because he is smart and black--everyone is talking about him only because he is black--I don't care what color he is but he has overtaken Favre in media annoyance.

It's probably too hard to sort out how much about but I do believe his race factors into individual perceptions about him.... moreso than say... Doug Flutie or the Gumble's.

15
by Derek (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 12:23am

, You know what that is? The world's smallest violin playing a sweet elegy for Ricky Manning Jr. He gets arrested twice for senselessly hitting people; he should probably get a little jail time. I'm Jewish, and I don't care if he's anti-Semitic. He's a freaking moron. Leonard "The Car" Little. Randy "Oops, I Did It Again" McMichael. Marcus "Age Ain't Nothin But a Number" Vick. Bobby "Soulless Honkey" Knight. All idiots that need either jail time or serious counselling and medication. Give me T.O.'s big mouth any day of the week.

And, yes, I did enjoy coming up with those nicknames. Especially getting to reference a cheesy 1970s James Brolin movie.

16
by young curmudgeon (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 1:29am

Re 8 & 14: OK, here's a partial list of athletes or people associated with sports who, at one time or another, have struck me as annoying: Dick Vitale, Pete Rose, Eli Manning, J.J. Redick, Brent Musberger, Lou Holtz, Brian Billick, Bill Parcells, Jeremy Shockey, that guard called "Wojo" who played for Duke. May I say that Tiki Barber seems to be auditioning for a place on that list without being thought a racist?

You are correct that "some" people are probably drawing negative conclusions about Tiki Barber because of his race...heck, there are probably "some" people who think Beyonce is not an attractive woman because of her race. But I'd like to think that a whole lot of these people can be easily identified by the hooded sheets they are wearing and may be easily ignored and disregarded. I think that some of the criticism leveled at Randy Moss and Terrell Owens is linked to their race, but I also think that if a white player acted in similar ways, that player would receive 95% as much criticism, and with about 90% of the vitriol.

When an individual whose public persona is "pleasant, handsome, team oriented, bright, plays the game the way it should be played, likable, nice guy, the 'toast of New York'..." starts coming across as "self-centered, whiner, full of complaints, tiresome...", people are going to be disconcerted by the dissonance and the guy is going to take a few hits.

17
by jp (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 4:45am

What's with the Tiki bashing? All the man is doing is telling the truth. Coughlin is past his prime. Sure, he had some success in Jacksonville early on, but could never win the big game. His career record is just slightly better than .500. That's it. Add on to that his history of alienating players and you are stuck with an average coach that demoralises his players. The Giants blew it by passing on Lovie Smith. Sometimes, the Mara family is TOO loyal! Tiki is a class act, a top RB, and the Jints will be lucky to go 6-10 next year when he's gone. All the man is doing is stating what ANYONE who knows football can see every Sunday. Coughlin is the "strict" Jim Fassel - under prepared, predictable, and out classed just about every Sunday. He's better than Ray Handley, but not by much. I can only dream of what Belichick or Fox (past Jints coordinators) would have done with this team! BTW, why are the Giants being killed by injuries two years in a row? Every team gets key players hurt - but this many two years running?!?!?!?

18
by Flux (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 5:08am

I hate to complain about free content but guys.... wheat / chaff. These are the highlights, not the archives. The majority of us have already heard 3/4 of the quotes anyway. Look for insight and oddity, not recapping; I enjoy the QotW feature on BP even though I don't follow baseball at all, since they find oddball quotes and amusing stuff.

19
by johnt (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 5:09am

17: For the same reason people bashed Peyton Manning for "problems in protection" on a day his line let people through unblocked on every other play. Yes, it's obvious to the world but saying it out loud does not help your team at all and hurts it by insulting your teammates and destroying cohesiveness.

I dislike Tiki the more I see him because he's just so .. incredibly smug. Lecturing the QB on what to pass, telling the coach what plays to call, freaking out on ESPN commentators, the guy just seems like he thinks he knows everybody's job better than they do. Marvin Harrison is probably my favorite NFL player these days, just for his total commitment to excellence and complete indifference to shooting off his mouth.

20
by cowfez (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 6:30am

I'd love to hear or see a clip of Sam Adams quote if anyone's got it.

21
by nicanor (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 11:24am

If I was a college coach, or acedemic advisor for a chap who has the chance to go into professional sports, I would, without a doubt, tell that person to take acting classes. The player could learn how to act when all eyes are upon him. How great would it be to hear a player quote ; 'once more into the breach...' when asked about the teams chances the next week? Acting classes could help players with memory, and how to handle press conferences. Plus they would have a whole host of things to say instead of the usual clichés. God damn, I would advise acting classes!

22
by mawbrew (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 12:03pm

Re: 14

The concern I have is that you can't reasonably say that you believe much/some of the criticism of Tiki is related to race (after several posts critical of Tiki) and at the same time claim you aren't suggesting that some of those posts are influenced by race. What other possible point can there be to making the comment in the first place? Not surprising that some of those posters felt compelled to reply back defending their early Tiki posts as not racially based.

I have no idea if any particular person has the mentallity you outlined in post #8, but by putting that out there it tars everybody that commented about Barber, whether you intended it to or not.

23
by noah of the ark (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 1:01pm

I didn't know changing sexes could feel so good. Maybe I'll try it someday...

24
by MFurtek (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 2:21pm

Re: maybrew
Yes. In hindsight I see the futility of having an honest discussion on racism especially on a messageboard.
1) No one will outright admit they have any racist thought/bone in their body. Isn't that right Kramer actor and Mel Gibson?
2) People who aren't racist will be very defensive and feel attacked.

So it's really a lose-lose situation to talk about it. I was hoping to have the discussion without tarring anyone, which is why I tried to make it clear I don't think the commenters had come close to the extreme thought I had expressed. In the end it's just something not possible to discuss without a firestorm brewing or close.

25
by MFurtek (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 2:34pm

Here's a transcript of the Eli-Barber exchange on the sideline.

Tiki: "10, Eli. Shockey said he's... running these seams and he's beating Derrick because they are playing up so much for the run. Throw it short, back shoulder for him, so he can come back to it... so you don't have what happened down here... cause you had him, that was a touchdown..."

"Seams are hard... sometimes you have to lob it and it gets caught up in the wind."

Jaws and Sal then proceeded to make fun of Shockey because Tiki was the one going between them. Merrill was joking about how RBs are always helping QBs. Sal then joked about how Tiki wants to go into coaching.

26
by Bright Blue Shorts (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 6:32pm

With regards to all those comments about Eli ...

In English football (soccerball) often just before a manager (coach) gets sacked (dismissed) he receives a "vote of confidence" from the board of directors.

In fact the press (media) have got to the point where they refer to it as "the dread vote of confidence" because it usually guarantees that the manager will be gone in a week or two. I guess it's not the same for Eli though!

BBS

27
by Jersey (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 7:29pm

RE: 8

Tom Brady. Peyton Manning. Brett Favre. Tiki Barber.

What do these four people have in common? They are very skilled football players who put up good numbers and win football games. They are all considered the key elements to their teams offenses. They are all smart, articulate people who speak correct enlish and are not Thugs or Knuckleheads. They are all praised endlessly by media talking heads, even if their team isn't playing. They are all the toast of their respective fan bases, and the player most likely to be respected by opposing fans on those teams. They all generate controversy because of the large number of fans who say, "yes they're good, but we're tired of the endless media coverage"

Three of them are white.
One is black.

Only one is being listed as a victum of racism.

28
by Towens (not verified) :: Sat, 11/25/2006 - 9:39pm

"So it’s really a lose-lose situation to talk about it. I was hoping to have the discussion without tarring anyone, which is why I tried to make it clear I don’t think the commenters had come close to the extreme thought I had expressed. In the end it’s just something not possible to discuss without a firestorm brewing or close."

Yeah, I think the much more interesting discussion is that black athletes like Tiger Woods and Michael Jordan are silent when it comes to speaking out about making things better for poor people, a disproportionate number of whom are black. They just don't give a damn.

29
by Bobman (not verified) :: Mon, 11/27/2006 - 6:06pm

I'm with #20... what the HELL is going on with Sam Adams? Switch from briefs to boxers? Maybe a little feather boa to make him feel pretty...? Maybe he plays the next game in drag--those stiletto heels really give good traction (but are murder on ankle stability) (or so I hear) (not that there's anything wrong with that....)