UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Who gets a tender? I'll try and make a semi-comprehensive list here.

We won't have a full list until Thursday, so I'll update this as warranted.

UPDATED on Thursday at 5:50 PM ET with the Colts and Chiefs...

Arizona Cardinals

WR Steve Breaston (1st)
G Deuce Lutui (2nd)
TE Ben Patrick (2nd)
C Lyle Sendlein (2nd)
DT Gabe Watson (2nd)

Atlanta Falcons

G Tyson Clabo (1st)
G Harvey Dahl (1st)
P Michael Koenen (2nd)
RB Jerious Norwood (1st)
OL Quinn Ojinnaka (5th)
RB Jason Snelling (2nd)

The decision to tender Norwood -- who was playing behind Snelling at the end of the season when he was healthy -- at a level ahead of Snelling is intriguing.

Baltimore Ravens

K Billy Cundiff (right of first refusal, no compensation)
OT Jared Gaither (1st)
P Sam Koch (2nd)
FB Le'Ron McClain (1st)
QB Troy Smith (5th)
CB Fabian Washington (1st)
WR Demetrius Williams (unknown)

Gaither's play really slipped last year, as he played at an extremely high level in his first year at the position. He was very spotty in pass protection, perhaps owing to a neck injury he suffered in midseason. Smith's tender level indicates how little interest there actually is in him around the league.

Buffalo Bills

LB Keith Ellison (6th)
QB Gibran Hamdan (not tendered)
G Richie Incognito (not tendered)
TE Joe Klopfenstein (not tendered)
TE Derek Schouman (unknown)
DB George Wilson (2nd)
DB Ashton Youboty (unknown)

Surprise that Incognito wasn't tendered after attracting a lot of attention as a free agent during the season. He continues to be a crazy person with some talent.

Carolina Panthers

LB James Anderson (3rd)
LB Thomas Davis (1st, 3rd)
TE Jeff King (2nd)
DT Louis Leonard (2nd)
K Rhys Lloyd (not tendered)
CB Richard Marshall (2nd)
QB Matt Moore (1st, 3rd)
T Rob Petitti (not tendered)
DB Quinton Teal (not tendered)
DB C.J. Wilson (7th)

Davis is coming off of a torn ACL. Pettiti is best remembered as the punchline starting tackle for the Cowboys.

Chicago Bears

DE Mark Anderson (2nd)
DB Josh Bullocks (2nd)
DB Danieal Manning (2nd)
LB Nick Roach (2nd)
LB Jamar Williams (4th)

If the Bears get a second-round pick for Mark Anderson, they should throw a parade. And not a small one, either. They'll also hope teams haven't seen Josh Bullocks' video.

Cincinnati Bengals

TE Daniel Coats (not tendered)
TE J.P. Foschi (not tendered)
LB Abdul Hodge (3rd)
LB Rashad Jeanty (right of first refusal, no compensation)
LB Brandon Johnson (2nd)
DB David Jones (5th)
OL Evan Mathis (3rd)
DE Frostee Rucker (3rd)
DT Shaun Smith (not tendered)

Cleveland Browns

LB Matt Roth (2nd)

Dallas Cowboys

WR Miles Austin (1st, 3rd)
DE Stephen Bowen (2nd)
WR Sam Hurd (2nd)
OL Cory Procter (2nd)

Denver Broncos

DE Elvis Dumervil (1st, 3rd)
OL Chris Kuper (1st)
WR Brandon Marshall (1st)
QB Kyle Orton (1st)
TE Tony Scheffler (2nd)

And if I were Brian Xanders, I would jump for joy if I got two firsts and a third-rounder for Dumervil and Marshall.

Detroit Lions

DE Copeland Bryan (not tendered)
DB Daniel Bullocks (3rd)
G Dylan Gandy (4th)
DB Kevin Hobbs (right of first refusal, no compensation)
DE Jason Hunter (2nd)
OL Daniel Loper (right of first refusal, no compensation)
G Manny Ramirez (4th)
DB Ko Simpson (4th)
LB Cody Spencer (not tendered)

Green Bay Packers

S Atari Bigby (2nd)
DB Will Blackmon (4th)
OL Daryn Colledge (unknown)
S Nick Collins (1st, 3rd)
TE Spencer Havner (exclusive rights)
DL Johnny Jolly (unknown)
P Jeremy Kapinos (not tendered)
FB John Kuhn (right of first refusal, no compensation)
OL Jason Spitz (2nd)
CB Tramon Williams (1st)
RB DeShawn Wynn (not tendered)

Still not sure what the Colledge tender was yet.

Houston Texans

DE Tim Bulman (right of first refusal, no compensation)
S John Busing (not tendered)
T Rashad Butler (3rd)
TE Owen Daniels (1st, 3rd)
RB Ryan Moats (3rd)
LB DeMeco Ryans (1st, 3rd)
S Bernard Pollard (1st)
G Chris White (right of first refusal, no compensation)

Indianapolis Colts

DB Antoine Bethea (1st)
DB Melvin Bullitt (2nd)
DB Aaron Francisco (not tendered)
CB Marlin Jackson (not tendered)
CB Tim Jennings (not tendered)

Jacksonville Jaguars

LB Clint Ingram (3rd)

Kansas City Chiefs

LB Derrick Johnson (1st)
OL Ike Ndukwe (2nd)
C Rudy Niswanger (2nd)
T Ryan O'Callaghan (2nd)

Miami Dolphins

RB Ronnie Brown (1st)
TE Anthony Fasano (2nd)
DE Quentin Moses (3rd)

Minnesota Vikings

DE Ray Edwards (1st)
DT Fred Evans (2nd)
QB Tarvaris Jackson (3rd)
FB Naufahu Tahi (right of first refusal, no compensation)

New England Patriots

K Stephen Gostkowski (2nd)
G Logan Mankins (1st, 3rd)
LB Pierre Woods (right of first refusal, no compensation)

Would imagine Woods can probably start packing his bags for Kansas City right about now.

New Orleans Saints

DT Remi Ayodele (right of first refusal, no compensation)
T Jammal Brown (1st, 3rd)
T Jermon Bushrod (2nd)
G Jahri Evans (1st, 3rd)
DE Anthony Hargrove (3rd)
S Roman Harper (1st)
LB Marvin Mitchell (7th)
WR Lance Moore (2nd)
S Chris Reis (right of first refusal, no compensation)
KR Courtney Roby (3rd)
T Zach Strief (2nd)
TE David Thomas (3rd)
RB Pierre Thomas (2nd)
S Usama Young (3rd)

Here's the one we were waiting for. It's pretty clear the team still sees Brown as the long-term starting LT; it'll be interesting to see if someone takes the bait on Bushrod.

New York Giants

OT Kevin Boothe (6th)
S C.C. Brown (I will peel myself if anyone signs him away)
DT Barry Cofield (2nd)
CB Kevin Dockery (not tendered)
WR Derek Hagan (unknown)
WR Domenik Hixon (2nd)
WR Sinorice Moss (3rd)
DE Dave Tollefson (2nd)
T Guy Whimper (4th)
LB Gerris Wilkinson (3rd)

Surprised that the team would let Dockery go; he wasn't very good last year, but injuries thrust him into a starting role when he's really a dime corner.

New York Jets

WR Braylon Edwards (1st, 3rd)
WR Brad Smith (2nd)
RB Leon Washington (2nd)

There was actually an interesting quote from Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum. "I think some of Braylon's contributions were not just stat-driven, he was a great blocker and I think some of the defenses, the way they look at us, were quite different after we acquired him."

Jets' offensive DVOA before acquiring Edwards was 25th in the league. After acquiring Edwards, if we remove the game against the Bengals' backups, they were 23rd. I don't doubt that teams needed to keep a safety back more frequently to account for Edwards, but there wasn't a major change in their offensive output.

Oakland Raiders

LB Ricky Brown (2nd)
QB Bruce Gradkowski (2nd)
LB Thomas Howard (2nd)
LB Kirk Morrison (3rd)
CB Stanford Routt (1st and 3rd)

The Morrison thing is out of whack, even for the Raiders. Something's up there. He's not a great player, since his numbers get inflated by the detritus playing in front of him, but he's definitely worthy of a third-round pick. Maybe he's asking for big money in a long-term deal?

Philadelphia Eagles

WR Jason Avant (2nd)
C Nick Cole (2nd)
LB Omar Gaither (5th)
LB Chris Gocong (3rd)
CB Ellis Hobbs (2nd)
LB Akeem Jordan (2nd)
TE Alex Smith (not tendered)

Pittsburgh Steelers

FB Carey Davis (not tendered)
CB William Gay (5th)
TE Matt Spaeth (3rd)
P Daniel Sepulveda (4th)
G Darnell Stapleton (not tendered)

Even though Gay's stock dropped a lot this year, tendering him at a fifth-round level is shockingly low. I'd be really surprised if a cornerback-needy team like the Lions didn't think he was worth a fifth-round pick. Certainly better than giving up a tangible asset for Antonio Cromartie. Stapleton not being tendered was also surprising; again, he's not great or anything, but geez, in a world where Stanford Routt is worth a first and a third...

San Diego Chargers

WR Malcom Floyd (1st, 3rd)
WR Vincent Jackson (1st, 3rd)
T Marcus McNeill (1st, 3rd)
LB Shawne Merriman (1st, 3rd)
RB Darren Sproles (1st, 3rd)

The brute force approach. Sproles was unexpectedly tendered after being told he'd be released.

San Francisco 49ers

RB Thomas Clayton (not tendered)
G David Baas (2nd)
LB Ahmad Brooks (2nd)

St. Louis Rams

DE Victor Adeyanju (4th)
DB O.J. Atogwe (unknown)
T Alex Barron (2nd)
RB Samkon Gado (not tendered)
WR Ruvell Martin (not tendered)
LS Ryan Neill (not tendered)
DT Clifton Ryan (2nd)
OL Mark Setterstrom (not tendered)
CB Jonathan Wade (not tendered)

The Rams also released former third-round pick Claude Wroten.

Seattle Seahawks

OL Brandon Frye (not tendered)
LB David Hawthorne (right of first refusal, no compensation)
LB Lance Laury (not tendered)
WR Ben Obomanu (7th)
OL Rob Sims (4th)
OL Chris Spencer (1st)
DL Darryl Tapp (2nd)

Tampa Bay Buccaneers

LB Barrett Ruud (1st, 3rd)
T Donald Penn (1st, 3rd)
WR Maurice Stovall (3rd)

Tennessee Titans

DT Dave Ball (2nd)
DT Tony Brown (1st)
TE Bo Scaife (1st)
LB Stephen Tulloch (1st)
DL Kevin Vickerson (2nd)
RB LenDale White (2nd)

Because Scaife was the team's Franchise Player last year, his tender figure is nearly $4.9 million.

Washington Redskins

QB Jason Campbell (1st)
RB Quinton Ganther (not tendered)
T Stephon Heyer (2nd)
LB Rocky McIntosh (2nd)
CB Carlos Rogers (1st)

Since Rogers was originally selected in the first round, the team chose to tender him with his "original round" tender (~$1.5 million) instead of tendering him with the first round compensation that other teams are granting their players taken in lower rounds, which would be for 110% of his 2009 base salary. (I think.)

Ganther going untendered was a surprise to me; he was passable behind a terrible line at the end of the 2009 season.

Hat tips to ESPN and PFT and our readers.

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90 comments, Last at 07 Mar 2010, 4:49pm

1 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Leon Washington would be an excellent pick-up for a 2nd rounder for N.E. Patriots. He could fit into a third down role in place of Kevin Faulk whose retirement should be within the next year. Plus, he has killed the Patriots on many third downs in the past couple of years.
Would also be fun to if the Patriots did some rediculous poison pill type contract just to keep the whole NE v. NY drama entertaining.

2 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Cue up the king:

First round tender, originel
Never let me go
You have made my life a hell
And I hate you so

I completely believe this is an organized collusion by the owners as part of their carefully orchestrated plan to break the player's union. Not just break it, obliterate it.

3 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

And if I were Brian Xanders, I would jump for joy if I got two firsts and a third-rounder for Dumervil and Marshall.

Bill, this is why Brian has his job, and you have yours. Actually, we have no idea why you have yours, but that is a different discussion. In the same vein, it is difficult to support Brian Xanders having his job, but it is far less offensive than the idea of Bill Barnwell being a GM.

What sane team, drafting at the bottom of the first round, wouldn't give up that pick for Brandon Marshall? What, they insist on Golden Tate?

And you ignore the fact that Brandon Marshall and Chris Kuper have the same tender. So Xanders (of whom you had not heard before his promotion) should jump for joy exchanging Marshall for a first-rounder, but losing Kuper for the same compensation would be a shrug of the shoulders. Ok.

Bill, next time you want to provide analysis, just refer instead to a random potato, which not only exceeds your knowledge of football, but also provides a rich source of potassium. Also, the potato is more likely to exhibit a basic grasp of grammar. And as for applied statistics, well, never mind.

As a matter of principle, I never publicly lobby for an individual to lose his job, but if a well-deserving spud were to suddenly gain an opportunity, I would not feel remorse.

6 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Misplaced anger.

Because of his owner made a bad hire, the Broncos are going to squander one of the best draft classes in modern history in the space of about 14 months. The only things coming back are Kyle Orton and draft picks, and Josh McDaniels drafted three first-round busts last year.

The Broncos fans are just ornery because they are moving to share the cellar with their Raider neighbors.

5 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

You're probably better off not using "sane" and "Brandon Marshall" in the same sentence if you're trying to make an argument about his value. His talent is beyond question, it's a question of whether his constant drama is worth the hassle.

10 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I seriously doubt anyone will give up a 1st for Marshall. Especially when the Cardinals reportedly want a 3rd for Boldin.

I would actually be bummed if my team, which incidentally is drafting in the last quarter of the 1st round, gave up our 1st rounder for Marshall.

44 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Is Brandon Marshall "surefire"? Yes, he has demonstrated that he can be a top-flight WR in the NFL. He also has demonstrated a propensity to be a major headache. Seems like every year he's making a pain of himself in the offseason, and sometimes even during the season. The plusses outweigh the minuses after a while.

For what it's worth, I expect Marshall to have a career somewhat like TO -- Hall-of-Fame caliber production, on about 5 different teams.

48 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

The WRs you can get in the 20's, Benn and Tate, definitely won't have TO's career. That's the point. New England, Cincy and Baltimore would kill to have a 26 year old TO on their hands, headache and all.

Coaches on 31 other teams must figure they have better people skills than the headcase that currently "headcoaches" the Broncos.

50 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

You know what else makes Benn and Tate different from Brandon Marshall? First off, they won't demand comparable compensation to the #1 overall draft pick. Second off, they won't enter the league just one strike away from a year-long suspension bringing with them a lengthy rap sheet (Marshall's gotten involved with the police 6 times since entering the league, and that's not counting the charges he faced in college for assaulting an officer or his admission that he escalated the confrontation that led to Darrent Williams' death), a penchant for domestic violence (incidents with two different women), and a reputation for insubordination.

Sure, Marshall is probably a better player than Benn or Tate will become (although it's hardly a sure thing, by any stretch of the imagination)... but Benn and Tate come at a fraction of the cost and with a fraction of the baggage. In all, I think a 1st rounder is a fair price for Marshall.

52 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

You know who cares about the time you wasted to type all that stuff? You and Florio and nobody else.

He's a thug. So?

This is professional spectator sports. Talent will get paid.

57 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

T.O. was drafted in the 3rd round! How can you possibly say "these low-1st WRs will never be T.O. or Marshall ever" when this is an all-world class of college talent this year? You, me, we know nothing of how these guys will do in the pros. So don't just presume that these guys are chopped liver.

Marshall is not a guy I would trade a 1st for, ESPECIALLY this year with all the talent in this draft. You could get a 10-year Pro Bowl-caliber Guard or Center in the bottom of the 1st. That's more valuable to me than a guy who I wouldn't even call a Top 10 WR who will probably not even be on your team in 5 years!

The proof will be in the pudding when no one takes Marshall away from Denver because they know that Marshall is not worth it.

67 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

When there's a very realistic chance that thuggery will have an impact on a player's on-field production, teams are going to take that into consideration. Taking a cynical view of off-field behavior is fine, but assuming that teams don't factor the probability of a player missing games due to suspension is as naive as believing that teams truly care about every moral fiber in their employees.

14 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Bill, next time you want to provide analysis, just refer instead to a random potato, which not only exceeds your knowledge of football, but also provides a rich source of potassium. Also, the potato is more likely to exhibit a basic grasp of grammar. And as for applied statistics, well, never mind.

I wish my hate mail was this entertaining.

30 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I really can't see the reason for the Barnwell hatred and think that you may have underestimated Marshall's ability to be an utter nutcase. If you throw in his disappointing catch percentage for a possession receiver then I can see how the Broncos could use a first round pick in exchange for him.

I would have concentrated on the Dumervil quote. The guy has 43 sacks in his first four years despite very little help from the rest of the front seven, I can easily see how a 3-4 team picking low would give up a 1 and a 3 for a player with a history of getting to the qb entering the prime of his career.

The Barnwell/potato comparison needs more clearly defined parameters. Potatoes can make fries, wedges and mash as well as having the ability to power a small digital clock if you shove the right electrodes in. I have no idea where you would stick the electrodes in Bill to power a clock and I don't think he'd respond well to the treatment. So if those metrics were the basis for judging the Barnwell/spud conundrum, then you'd have to give the win to the tuber.

However, all of the conversations I've had with potatoes regarding football have been very unsatisfactory, even if you've been very careful with your placement of the little feet and hat. They just don't have a proper understanding of the principles of zone defence, though Maris Pipers seem to have a better grasp of blocking schemes than King Edwards. I may be biased as a result of the rudeness of the spuds (they tend to just ignore me, even though their eyes are looking right at me) but I'm going to give the win on football analysis to Bill, who has less of a chip on his shoulder.

34 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

The potato is clearly ranked too high because sweet potatos make superior fries and chips. Plus their failure to grow properly starved many an Irishman. NutraSystem's Glycemic Index is way better than this. IF U R not snaking on sweet potatos, U R teh suck.

43 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

As a Bronco fan, I would be glad to see Dumervil go for a 1 and a 3. Here's what I see: He can't play the run at all, can't cover at all, and is not as good a pass rusher as the sack totals indicate.

I could easily be wrong, especially since I only saw the Broncos play twice this year, but that's how I've felt about him.

By the way, your potato analysis is inspired.

68 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

So how does one account for Doom's sack totals? It's not like Denver has a blocker-eating NT. The rest of the LB corps is solid but Elvis is by far the Bronco's chief pass rush threat. A solid pass defense in a weak pass blocking division probably contributed as well, but that doesn't negate Doom's legit talent. Imagine what he could do on a team that's actually equipped to run a 3-4 from a personnel standpoint.

72 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I, for once, agree with TGYDWTH. I have no numbers to base this on (other than watching substantially more Broncos games than 2), but it seemed all his sacks was coverage sacks, and that he would never even get pressure on plays where the secondary didn't give him 5 seconds to get there.

76 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I've been thinking for a while now that a very large percentage of most player's sacks are coverage sacks. Whether Dumervil is only getting these or not, the guy has 43 sacks in four years, someone has to make those plays for your team and I would point out that he is cat quick in his second effort towards the qb. His moderate stature allows him to change direction much more quickly than the wookie-esque tackles blocking him.

85 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

We agreed! (I think we had already discovered this agreement before, actually.)

Since I didn't mention this above when I should have, I did watch every game the two years before last year, so I certainly have seen him play plenty--I was just leaving room for the possibility that he made some sort of quantum leap this season.

As DDF said, he only seems to get coverage sacks. I at least feel like those are really situational things and a replacement-level player could generally get them. (If anyone has studied this, I would like to hear about it, by the way.)

That doesn't really mean that he's useless, but throw in that he's a liability in every other aspect of the game and I think it's difficult to say that he's more valuable than a first- and a third-round draft pick.

64 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I propose an experiment in which we peel Barnwell and then slice him up and fry him. Otherwise we will never truly know how useful he is for making chips / fries.

Careful on your trip to the UK Bill, there are questions to be answered now. We may just decide to see how well you respond to being lightly fried in oil.

33 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I have my disagreements with Bill -- see the Dunta Robinson and Charting XP -- but this seemed pretty uncalled for.

(Though I have to admit that the image of him gorging on bananas so that his potassium content rivals the potato's is an amusing one...)

45 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Wow. I have my own issues with Barnwell, but for the most part, I feel that he adds value to the site.

That said, your rant was awesome.

Sports talk radio and sports message boards are the killing fields of intellectual discourse.

8 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Info on Giants tenders here: http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/free-agency/2010-free-agent-scorecard/

Nothing too surprising other than not kicking C.C. Brown to the curb, and non-tendering CB Kevin Dockery. The 2nd-round tender for 4th DE Dave Tollefson seems high, but he's a good ST guy, and was a 7th-round pick, so the upgraded tender was the only way to give him any meaningful protection.

80 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I don't understand how not tendering Dockery was a surprise. He is an undersized corner who projects at best as a nickel/dime guy... but the Giants just picked up the same type of player as an undrafted fa last year in Bruce Johnson. Assuming that Aaron Ross moves back to corner that would make Dockery the 4th or 5th guy... not worth a restriced tender when you can pick up a guy like that late in the draft...

11 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Baltimore Sun reporting these additions for the Ravens not currently listed above:

CB Fabian Washington (1st)
WR Mark Clayton (expected to be tendered a 1st)
P Sam Koch (2nd)
S Dawan Landry (2nd)
G Chris Chester (3rd)
QB John Beck (3rd)
LB Prescott Burgess (6th)
OL Tony Moll (5th)

15 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

If the Broncos get a 1st Rounder for Kyle Orton, I will just have to laugh.

16 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I honestly don't think I see a single guy that would be worth it for a team to sign away.

Well I should redefine that, I can see a team that has no ILB's who are even half decent taking Morrison away from the Raiders, and perhaps a team with a late first round pick and desperate for help at WR (but who would that be exactly?) taking a shot at Marshall assuming he would agree to sign a non-crazy long term deal. Ray Edwards is also intriguing. I wouldn't touch anyone else.

18 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Disagree. As a Packer fan I'd be devastated if the Vikings (pick 30) put in a tender for CB Tramon Williams (1st) or FS Nick Collins (1st and 3rd).

Deep draft class be damned, everyone needs proven secondary help.

21 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Baltimore seems like the obvious destination for Marshall. I think if I'm Ozzie Newsome I probably make that trade.

I think it's very tough to know what is and isn't worthwhile in an uncapped environment, because a team's priorities are so much less clear, and the means available to them so much more varied. For a high revenue team that wants first and foremost to win rather than maximise profitability by being cheap and mediocre, veteran players are worth more relative to picks than they used to be, because their salary demands are less important without a cap. Suppose you use a lateish 1 and 3 on rush linebacker prospects. Can you really expect their combined value to be as high as Elvis Dumervil's? Sure, they'd come a lot cheaper than Dumervil, but if you're, say, the Patriots, and you're painfully aware that you've never adequately replaced Willie McGinest, wouldn't you consider making that deal? Is the best guard in football worth a 1 and a 3, plus a big contract? Minnesota and Seattle fans might say yes, and they're the ones best placed to know. And does anyone really think no team will be willing to take a flyer on the possibility of Merriman returning to pre-injury form?

19 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Ronnie Brown 'only' got the 1st round tender after the 'Fins declined to exercise a $5M option on his contract. If I were a team with a low 1st round pick that was crying out for an excellent RB who can contribute in the passing game and block (and pass a bit too), *cough* San Diego *cough*, I'd be looking into this...

As a Miami fan I hope they don't.

Phil Simms is a Cretin.

22 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Brown's a terrific player when healthy, no doubt, but I don't know that I'd give up a first round pick for a back who's had as many injuries as he has and has never carried the load for a full season.

20 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread


LB Demeco Ryans (1st, 3rd)
TE Owen Daniels (1st, 3rd)
S Bernard Pollard (1st)
T Rashad Butler (3rd)
RB Ryan Moats (3rd)
DE Tim Bulman (no compensation)
G Chris White (no compensation)
DT DelJuan Robinson (exclusive rights)
S John Busing (not tendered)

41 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Wauw. Going from Chiefs washout to getting a first round tender. It goes up and down in the NFL.

Also: Brutal tender on Owen Daniels - maybe the most unlikely player to get signed away in this entire thread...

82 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

As I understand it, Pollard was basically a casualty of the regime change in KC - he wasn't a great fit for the new system, and he didn't get on with the new coaching staff, who supposedly badmouthed his character around the league. The Texans signed him on the basis of Herm vouching for him from a character standpoint, and he appears to have settled in very well and very quickly in the Houston locker room. More importantly, his play in his limited role was really pretty damn good: he's strictly a box-type SS, but his play was a major reason for the dramatic improvement in the Texans run defense after the first couple of weeks. He may have to wait in line a little while for the team to deal with higher priority cases, but I'm quite certain that management would like to sign him to a long term deal.

Daniels is impossible to value at this point. Pre-injury, he was playing at a Pro Bowl level. Who knows whether, when, or to what extent he will recover? If he'd stayed healthy he might well have got a pretty good long term deal; as is, there's nothing for it but to tender him and wait and see.

25 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

So many high tenders to so many ordinary players. I guess it does beat paying them. The union screwed the pooch on this one.

The uncapped year really sucks. The possibility of a lockout sucks even more. The things I care about regarding the CBA renegotiation (in order):

- Continuation of football.
- Parity.
- Increased benefits for retired players.
- Funtional rookie wage scale.

Note that players or owners making modifications to how they divide up a massively profitable pie does not enter into the things I care about. Both sides are doing just fine, they could really do with removing their heads from their fundaments and behaving like adults.

28 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Thanks to Mr Potato Head for putting this list together. ;-)

I'd be interested in the cap guy's analysis on signing RFAs.

I think there must be some balancing going on between the drat pick value and the cap hits associated with signing these players.

For example, Marshall. Leaving aside his personal issues in this assessment... If the Chiefs signed him, they'd give up a very high 1st round pick while the Ravens would be giving up a fairly low pick. Advantage: Ravens. On the other hand, the Chiefs' pick comes with a cap cost probably close to what they'd pay Marshall while the Ravens would have to spend far more on Marshall than they'd pay their 1st round pick. Advantage: Chiefs.

And the uncaapped year plus uncertainty about the future of the cap further cloud the analysis.

29 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Every time I see Jamar Williams play, I'm impressed. The coaches don't seem as high on him as I do, however. If any team has a big hole at weakside linebacker they should give him a look, Maybe even inside linebacker if you have the d-line to protect him.

31 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Reports from PFT have the Rams tendering Atogwe at the lowest level. If this happens it would be the most glaring case for a spot of poison pilling since Michael Jackson (too soon?). If I was in charge of the 49ers (or the Bears, or half the damn league), I'd be trying to come up with the most absurd set of contract clauses with the most astronomical guarantees attached. The NFLPA will have real evidence of collusion if he remains in St Louis.

35 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

It makes some sense for the Rams. The minimum "right of first refusal" tender is the only one that carries a defined salary without some kind of "or 110% of the player's prior year salary, whichever is higher" term. Since Atogwe played under a Franchise Player contract in 2009, STL's choice is to either pay him more than $7M for 2010, or let other teams make offers and hope that the one Atogwe signs is match-able. (Or sign him to a long-term deal before tomorrow, I suppose.)

37 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I was all set to point this out.

Atogwe is probably the only Ram to hit the market that will be in high demand. To be fair to the Rams, any higher tender they put on him would have meant a salary in excess of $6M. Atogwe is good, but he's not worth $6M.

However, if all you have to do is give him a creative contract and you don't have to give up compensation, I would expect that he just jumped to the head of the line. I would certainly rather sign him then Antrel Rolle.

He looks, to me, to be the perfect solution for the Eagles woes at Safety.

40 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I'd like it for the Seahawks as well (and they probably catch the least flak for using a poison pill, since they're still reeling from Hutchison's leaving), but here's the thing to remember--you can only use a poison pill if the player wants to leave his current team. If Hutchison had wanted to stay a Seahawk instead of leaving for the Vikings, he would have come back to management, said "I've got a $49 million offer with a poison pill, but I'll sign a $50 million dollar contract to stay instead," and that deal would have gotten done. Not saying it would be hard to convince Atogwe his prospects were better outside of St. Louis, but it's not a foregone conclusion.

36 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Here is the list of the Saints' tenders:


It should be noted that Mike Bell got a right to first refusal tender, which will only add fuel to the LDT rumor fire.

Sports talk radio and sports message boards are the killing fields of intellectual discourse.

39 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

If I were the Cardinals or some other team, with a mid-late 2nd rounder and in need of a TE, I would probably go for Scheffler.

47 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I don't expect to see a lot of movement with any of these guys. There are some good players in there, but there's an additional wrinkle beyond just the draft pick compensation. You're essentially trading for a guy in the final year of his contract. In all likelihood, this means you have to be willing to give up the draft pick AND a long term contract, or you risk losing the guy in free agency a year later.

So it's not just "do I want to trade a 1st round pick for Brandon Marshall?". I think there would be takers on that deal. The real quesiton is "do I want to trade a 1st round pick for Brandon Marshall, and then immediately turn around and give him a $50 million contract in a negotiation where he has more leverage than normal because I just traded a 1st round pick for him?". Less appealing.

51 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

But they're free agents, so you can negociate the deal with them prior to negociating the compensation without it being tampering. If you can't sign the guy, you just move on and you don't get him in the first place.

I do agree that there'll be less movement then the pundits would have you believe, but I do see a couple guys that look like they could move.

53 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Really, you have to negotiate the compensation first. That's how the RFA process works-- you negotiate with the RFA on contract terms; he signs the offer sheet; the old team gets 7 days to match; and, if no match, the offer sheet becomes the contract and the draft picks associated with the tender level (if any) are transferred.

The only way to do it in reverse is to make a trade, like the Pats did for Wes Welker a few years back.

56 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

Not necessairily. If you are content to pay the compensation required by the tender offer, sure. But if you want to pay something else, then you negociate with the player and agree to terms. Then you negociate the compensation with the other franchise. THEN you actually sign the contracts and do the trade.

60 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I may have been unclear: the "you" in my above post refers to a team trying to sign a RFA who has been tendered by another team (but who has not signed that tender yet, which, of course, would terminate the player's free agency).

The process is spelled out pretty clearly in Article XIX, section 3 of the CBA. It begins when a new team submits a contract offer sheet to a RFA, and the RFA signs it. There is no trade and no negotiating with the other team at all-- the old team simply makes the decision whether to exercise the right of first refusal or not, and, if not, the new team then transfers the draft pick required by the player's tender level and the player becomes officially under contract with the new team.

As I said, the only way to do this differently is to make a Welker-style trade. In that case, the new team told the old team's management that it intended to offer the contract to the player (presumably having already gotten the player to agree in principle), and worked out a trade with an extra 7th round pick thrown in (in addition to the 2nd that the player's tender level would require) to avoid either the uncertainty of a week spent waiting for the match/nomatch decision or the precedent of using a poison pill.

62 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

I suppose this is hair splitting at this point, but in essence, the team who is signing the player is still agreeing to compensation first, in that they've made the organizational decision that they're willing to pay the compensation as tendered before they even negociate/submit an offer sheet to the player.

66 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

True enough, I had it backwards. Nevertheless, the overall point still stands. It's not as simple as "trade pick, receive player". There's a phat contract involved too.

49 Re: The Great Big Tender Thread

The update on the Giants is missing 4 names:

WR Sinorice Moss: Original Round, which would be a 2nd, but is reduced to a 3rd by virtue of the "upgraded tender" rule.
G Kevin Boothe: Unknown (I'm guessing original round, a 6th)
S C.C. Brown: Right of First Refusal
TE Darcy Johnson: Not Tendered

58 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Philly has tendered Omar Gaither with 5th round compensation and expects to have a new contract with Leonard Weaver sometime this afternoon.


71 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

That low tender to Gaither makes me think the birds will take a LB high in the draft. They really don't have much at the SAM, and Gaither is the backup at WILL and MIKE. If he leaves, they'd have to get somebody just for depth - may as well be a rookie with potential.

74 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

I had pegged Gaither for trade bait regardless. He's shown that while he tries hard, he can't play the MIKE, and while he's solid at WILL, he'd already lost the job to Jordan, and then adding 'Spoon drops him to 3rd there. If he's, at best, the 5th LB on the depth chart (depending on their opinion of Moise Fokou), then he has more value to the organization by what he can fetch in trade.

Somebody will be glad to have him for a 5th round pick though. St. Louis is the first one to come to mind. He started for Spagnulo in Philly 3 years ago, they have a GIANT hole at WILL, and he's young enough to be still productive when they (if they) get it turned around.

61 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Jahri Evans was given a 1st and 3rd from the Saints.

Sports talk radio and sports message boards are the killing fields of intellectual discourse.

70 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Troy Smith got a 5th round tender


73 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

According to Mike Sando at the ESPN.com NFC West Blog, these are the Seattle RFA tenders (http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/14955/seahawks-announce-rfa-tenders):
OL Brandon Frye (not tendered)
LB David Hawthorne (exclusive rights)
LB Lance Laury (not tendered)
WR Ben Obomanu (7th)
OL Rob Simms (4th)
OL Chris Spencer (1st)
DE Darryl Tapp (2nd)

Obomanu, Simms, Spencer, and Tapp all received original round tenders.

77 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Full list of Bengals tenders is at http://cincinnati.com/blogs/bengals/2010/03/04/six-of-bengals-nine-rfas-tendered/

86 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Additional Redskins tenders:

Lorenzo Alexander: Right of first refusal
Reed Doughty: 2nd round
Kedric Golston: 2nd round
Anthony Montgomery: 5th round
Will Montgomery: 7th round
Chris Wilson: 2nd round

88 Re: UPDATED: The Great Big Tender Thread

Jerious Norwood actually got the 2nd Round tender, not 1st as originally reported: