Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

21 Mar 2013

Schatz, Gabbert, Glennon, and Waldman: Process Improvement

Football Outsiders Chief Aaron Schatz asked me a great question yesterday. One that I imagine some people with my business interests in mind would tell me not to answer within the context of a book season where I’m trying to generate sales. They want me to say – and only say – I was the guy that said last March that Russell Wilson was indeed comparable to Drew Brees in style and had the potential skill to get there. Fortunately, my right shoulder tends to be hunched higher to my ear when I’m talking, so the voice in the white robe and halo is easier to hear.

Posted by: Matt Waldman on 21 Mar 2013

14 comments, Last at 25 Mar 2013, 5:58pm by Karl Cuba


by Scott P. (not verified) :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 10:26am

This post confuses me.

by Chappy (not verified) :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 12:29pm

I thought the same thing. He says that Aaron Schatz asked him a question, but there is no question.

by Insancipitory :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 12:34pm

"Why do you think you were so wrong about Gabbert when you rated him the best prospect in 2011? Or, do you think maybe you weren’t entirely wrong and there’s still room for growth because he’s just 23?"

by Insancipitory :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 12:29pm

I thought it was particularly illuminating, if somewhat oddly structured. There are some multilevel elements to the article. It may be about better prospect scouting, and what makes better scouts, but there's some multilevel stuff in there about the battle between ego and insight, and the value of a persistant focus on the small details.

by Noah Arkadia :: Sat, 03/23/2013 - 10:56am

Yeah, I found it odd at first, but then it turned out to be really interesting stuff about scouting in general and Gabbert and Glennon in particular.

FO posters are a peacock. You got to let us fly!

by Scott P. (not verified) :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 12:54pm

Oh, this is not a standalone post, but a link to an article, and text is from the beginning of the article.

I thought this was an intra-FO post about improvements to DVOA in the offseason or something.

by shamah (not verified) :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 12:57pm

The article is not much clearer. I honestly have no idea what he's talking about. I know what all the words mean individually, but when strung together in the order in which they appear in the article, it all comes out as gibberish.

by nath :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 4:17pm

It seems like the linked article, particularly the section on Glennon, is riddled with typos and missing words.

by JonFrum :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 6:18pm

I think I get what he's saying - usually - but there are some stinker sentences in there. Which is what we should expect when there is no editor reading copy. Blog writing is often like that - you get the gist of it, but some of the sentences get squiggly and then die. Right at the top, the second sentence needs a re-write into a reader-friendly form.

by RickD :: Fri, 03/22/2013 - 6:42pm

Stuff like this needs editing:

"N.C. State’s Mike Glennon and what I just wrote about him in the 2013 Rookie Scouting Portfolio as an Overrated Talent is a good example:"

by Karl Cuba :: Sat, 03/23/2013 - 5:48pm

1- Manuel- The only qb in this draft that deserves a first round grade. Good size and athleticism with a nice, high, quick release with good hip snap, mobile and has good accuracy and placement, seems to be hard working and coachable. He could start from day one and has the potential to be a franchise quarterback.

2- Scott- Really reminds me of Jeff Garcia, is a gamer. Doesn't look like a prototype qb but has accuracy, anticipation and timing with very good ball placement, can deliver the ball from multiple launch points and has good mobility. He'll be a steal if he falls out of the second round, could start early on.

3- Wilson- Has talent, I can see why Waldman compares him to Tannehill but for me the difference is that Tannehill had shown clear improvement from his first year as a qb into his second whereas Wilson seems to have regressed a little. Not entirely his fault, unless you want to blame him for ever trusting Bobby Petrino, which would be harsh but it does make Wilson a bit more of a projection than Tannehill when you look at the player they were in their final year. From his production in his final year he's a second round project, you would have to be very certain that he is capable of more to take him higher. A low floor, high ceiling prospect.

4- Smith- Really looks the part, big and strong with good mechanics in his delivery. However, when you watch West Virginia you see the ball moving down the field but Smith is throwing at or behind the line of scrimmage on predefined plays a lot and he isn't nearly as impressive when trying to push the ball down the field. It's the down field ability that will define his play in the NFL and he struggles to anticipate and move through his reads.

5- Nassib- Lots of folks like his ability to read the game but I just can't get past that hideous release. The hip snaps, then the shoulder releases and then the elbow fires. It is not a recipe for accuracy or consistency. He also has a slight hitch and the combination of both means that the ball comes out low and later than it should. His ball placement can be poor but it's probably down to his throwing motion rather than his football IQ. I don't believe that he will be able to thrive in the NFL without remodelling that action, which makes him a project and his lack of elite physical talents means that he is a project with limited upside.

by Anger...rising :: Sat, 03/23/2013 - 11:51pm

Manuel has no football instincts whatsoever. Waits for receivers to come open and gets the ball there late as a consequence. Has not zero, but negative, pocket presence -- loves to try spinning away from sacks, turning them into fifteen-yard losses. That is, when he shows any awareness of the rush at all.

He's accurate inside 15 yards, but not beyond. But I guess that's okay, because his need to see his man open before he'll throw keeps him from making as many deep throws as he should, anyway.

Don't ask him to do anything involving reading, be it defenses or zone options, on which he will hand the ball off 100% of the time.

He's supposedly a swell guy. Doesn't choke coaches, but mopes when they yell at him. Not remotely a franchise quarterback unless there are rule changes allowing combine performance to translate directly to the scoreboard.

by CoachDave :: Sun, 03/24/2013 - 1:30pm

He also has a hitch in his delivery that they've never been able to correct in spite of a lot of FSU coaching.

It's worse beyond 15 and I think it's why his deep ball timing and accuracy is terrible.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but if wouldn't touch Manuel with anything North of a 5th rounder for all the reasons stated above.

He's a walking coach killer, IMO.

by Karl Cuba :: Mon, 03/25/2013 - 5:58pm

In reply to you and Mr Rising, I don't think anyone in this draft compares to the talents at the top last year. The bunch of them will be overdrafted but I dislike Manuel the least.

If you can point out which one has shown the consistent ability to make good reads and hit tight throws down the field then I'd love to see it.