Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

23 Sep 2009

Hardwick Out Eight Weeks

Kevin Acee of the San Diego Union-Tribune notes that Chargers center Nick Hardwick will have surgery on a tear in his ankle (the story doesn't specify) and will miss at least eight weeks.

Posted by: Bill Barnwell on 23 Sep 2009

26 comments, Last at 25 Sep 2009, 3:26pm by Dave0


by TuMadre (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 5:34pm

Wow, has any team been decimated by injuries to their star players more than the Chargers over the past three years? Gates, Tomlinson, Hardwick, Williams, Rivers, Merriman, McNeil, all Pro Bowlers...the list goes on and on. It's amazing they've remained competitive throughout it all.

by E :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 6:13pm

Decimated by injuries to their star players? It sure feels like they've lost more than 1/10 of their stars to injuries over the past 3 years [see comments to this week's Cover-3]

by Dave0 :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 6:37pm

decimated used to mean that but due to overwhelming incorrect common usage it doesn't mean that anymore. language is a living thing and pedants are tiresome.

by elhondo2 (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 7:15pm

It does mean that. It may mean other things, but the original definition still stands.

Even if the OP was using decimate in the vernacular, how can you be sure that the OP didn't mean the literal usage, and merely got his stats wrong. In other words, maybe the correcting poster was making a stylistic point of saying "it's been more than 10% man", which may be pedantic, but that's sort of the point of the site.

Correcting common grammatical errors, especially ones that may change the meaning of the post isn't pedantic - it helps provide clarity to whatever points are brought up. We, as a community on this site, don't generally correct minor usage errors, but this is a useful clarification to me. At the very least, it may cause someone to look up the original meaning of the word, and that isn't all bad.

In fact, I would say that it doesn't get pedantic until the second response to the original correction.

by Benjamin Light (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 7:47pm

The original definition refers to killing one in every ten soldiers in a Roman Army Division as a form of punishment, which may or may not have ever actually been carried out.

by Joe T. :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 8:46pm

You guys are dramastically debacling the definition of decimate.

by Tundrapaddy (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 8:52pm

Good point - can we now switch this discussion back to something relevant to football?

Such as the increasing use of the (recently) made up word 'envisage'?

I mean c'mon already, stretching the use of 'decimate' is NOTHING compared to wholesale creation of a new word due to mispronunciation of the original ('envision').

PS - appropriately, my Captcha is 'hazel igloos'. I have yet to see igloos constructed of hazel up here. Maybe in the Canadian arctic...

by Theo :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 8:58pm

I brought it up a week ago.
Why the hell are people doing this 'I made a word up' routine?
Do they get a kick out of it when is becomes a household word, does that boost their ego? Or are they just very stupid and make up words, just like toddlers do?
Questions, questions.

by Bobman :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 12:13am

My wife uses it all the time in place of "envision." What does it mean... to put a face on something? Anyway, I am currently re-reading Pillars of the Earth by Ken Follett (circa 1992 pub date) and came across it a few times in that exact context--instead of envision.

whatever. Back to football.

I'd rather not hear Chargers fans weeping about losing stars/key players to injury. Two years ago Indy lost a HOF WR, a pro-bowl DE both for most of the season (and the other eventual pro-bowl DE for a few games later that season), one of their pro-bowl safeties regularly skips 12 games, and the last season their pro-bowl C missed four games while the rest of the OL combined for 19 missed games. In addition, their future HOF QB was one-legged for about half a season.

I'm sorry, what was that about one-tenth we were talking about...?

We're more injured than you and have been the past two seasons, we just don't whine about it. (We do, I freely admit, bitch in private. A common refrain is that if Freeney hadn't Lis Franced himself vs SD in 2007, we'd have been as good as the 18-1 Pats and could well have made the SB. It's speculative but has some merit.)

by TuMadre (not verified) :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 12:27pm

Uh, where did you see any whining or weeping about the Chargers? You're bitching more than anyone else in this thread. I only said it was impressive that the Chargers remained competitive despite their injuries. You know, competitive like beating the Colts in the playoffs every year, even with a back up QB, RB, TE, etc...ah-hah! Now I realize why you sound so bitter.

No, the Colts have not had more injuries than the Chargers, that's just factually inaccurate. Last season, the Chargers had six Pro Bowlers (not a great barometer, I know, but a barometer nonetheless) miss at least one start due to injury, and another three played with significant injuries. The Colts certainly didn't exceed those numbers.

by Bowl Game Anomaly :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 12:18am

Envisage is a real word which dates back to about 1820.

Now if you want to talk about "defense" as a verb, I'm with you.

by Mr Shush :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 7:42am

Beat me to it on envisage, but I can't agree on "defense". Is it a recent addition to the language? Of course. But to my mind it fills a useful and previously unoccupied semantic niche. It's not synonymous with "defend" - it means something like "successfully defend against". It's closer to "repulse" or "fend off", but it's not quite synonymous with either. It's a new word/usage, but a useful one.

by Independent George :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 2:52pm

These are all perfectly cromulent words.

by tuluse :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 2:54pm

I don't want to see any debacling of the English language.

by Dave0 :: Fri, 09/25/2009 - 3:26pm

the first responder sure sounds like he's trying to show how wonderful his vocabulary is. this is the same kind of response people are fearful of when they type a comment of several paragraph lengths, hit 'submit', then notice a typo in the middle of their post and reply with another post corecting that typo. they're afraid someone is going to give an arse and call them on it. in reality, nobody cares, but i can't blame them for thinking that when there are people running around saying "YOU SAID DECIMATE, HA HA, I DON"T HTINK REDUCE BY 1/10 BY KILLING IS WHAT YOU MEANT" in response to posts with the currently popularly agreed upon usage of decimate.

let's keep things reasonable, give each other a break, and talk some football and we'll all live longer.

by Tundrapaddy (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 8:56pm

Actually, given the 2-year span and a 45-man roster, they'd have to lose 9 players to injuries to be 'decimated'. The original post only lists 7 - some of which were only 'part-time decimations' (i.e. were not out for the whole year).

by bravehoptoad :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 7:11pm

Seahawks have more AGL from their starters than any other team in the league the past two years...way more.

by Anonymous45543 (not verified) :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 9:16pm

Maybe, but he said star players. What makes a star player? We can use the metric that having been to at least one pro bowl = star player, but I'm not sure I agree with that. However, having been to a pro bowl at least once usually means that you're a valuable contributor, and can expect to be valuable to your team for at least several years after the pro bowl appearance. Here is the list of Chargers pro bowlers for the last three years:

Tomlinson 06, 07
Gates 06, 07, 08
Rivers 06
McNeil 06, 07
Neal 06, 07
Merriman 06, 07
Williams 06, 07
Cromartie 07
Osgood 06, 07
Dielman 07, 08
Hardwick 06
Binn 06
Kaeding 06

Of this list, I would say that Binn, Kaeding, Osgood, and Neal are much less important than the others. Of the remaining players, I think all of them but Dielman have been hurt within the last two years:

Tomlinson: turf toe, strained abdominal, groin, ankle
Rivers: knee
Gates: turf toe, hip, ankle
Cromartie: fractured hip
Hardwick: foot, ankle
Williams: triceps
Merriman: knee
McNeil: hands, neck, ankle

Football is a violent game and people get hurt. Is it all that unusual that most of the star players for a team have gotten hurt in a relatively short time frame? Probably. But I seem to recall that the Chargers were fairly healthy from 2004-2006, so this might just be bad luck. Or it might have to do with the age of the players, although none of them are over 28 except LT and Williams.

by Dice :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 5:47pm

Slightly less amazing given their division over the last three years, but kudos to them.

by Raiderjoe :: Wed, 09/23/2009 - 11:02pm

road to Afc West cworn just got easiier for Raiders. This seaosn shaoing up to be good for Raiders. Qb has great comeback ability. cna be bad or medicore all game but then when game on line Russell come through like Ken Stabler when Stabler at best like in 74 75 and 76. Or like J Plunkett in 80. Just great stuff late in game from Russell. nerves of steel that is called. Defense good except for Chargers game. Run game vaunted. McFadden and Bush real dela.
Sopercial teams great. When have Janikowski and returnes that have you have special teams that get job fone.
So real good. Should be higher than 20 in dvoa or Dave(. showed ranked as 20 but not sure for what.)
So good. Forgot what else was going to writie. Drinking some of the Sierra Nevada Stout tonight so a little rough on the memory.

by Jerry :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 3:53am

If only this thread was more saranated...

by The Other Ben Johnson (not verified) :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 12:24pm

It's like God wants the AFC West to be crappy.

by justanothersteve :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 3:25pm

Or Western Divisions.

by Tundrapaddy (not verified) :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 5:55pm

It's one way of balancing the 'quality of life' benefits out west.

by Big Johnson (not verified) :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 6:20pm

Or the AFC west was footballs best division 3 years ago. considering that only 6 teams are actually in the western USA it sounds pretty average. just a guess but isnt dallas the 7th closest team to the west coast? sad that they are considered an "east" team

by elhondo :: Thu, 09/24/2009 - 7:55pm

Ya know, as long as god also hates the redskins, I think I'm ok with that.