Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

11 Oct 2010

MMQB: Very Little Feels Normal

This week, PK tackles Brett Favre's issues, details Carson Palmer's further regression, wraps up New England's youth movement, invents a new word ("semi-decimated", which is a legit 40 percent of "decimated"), reveals Ron Borges' most recent embarrassment, and reviews the new "Lombardi" play.

Posted by: Doug Farrar on 11 Oct 2010

77 comments, Last at 12 Oct 2010, 8:06pm by The Woody Allen of Gangsta Rap


by Dennis :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:05am

"Half the free world picked the Cowboys to play the first home Super Bowl ever"

Maybe I was living under a rock, but I had no idea the Cowboys were that much of a pick. I think more people were riding the 49ers' bandwagon, not necessarily to go to the Super Bowl but to win their division.

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:25am

This ESPN article doesn't have a single pick for the Cowboys, but it's only for predicting who will win, not both teams.

by QCIC (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 11:20am

I think Dallas was 12/1 with SD, PIT, IND, NE, NO, GB, MIN ahead of them. Of course that was early in the preseason.

But I don't think it changed that much. They were seen as a contender, nothing more.

by ammek :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:20pm

So Atlanta might be the best team in the NFC; Dallas is bottom of the NFC East; the Chiefs, Bucs and Skins are all in the playoff hunt. What a turn-up! How could any preseason publication have predicted such a thing?

by crack (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 11:46am

Stupid Peter King and his hyperbole. What does he think he's doing, writing an opinion column?

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:10am

Dallas not good oivk. E. Phillips crap head coach. Romo up and fown. RBs okay. Line shaky. Defense alroght. Coeboys not clearly bettrr than any other nfc easst teams in summer and same now.

Raiders 2-3 now. Going to catch kc cheifs soon. Will defintrly beat SF 49ers.

by Will Allen :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:27am

The Kingster is just feeling jilted; he thought Ol' Stubbleface only sent pictures of Lil' Stubbleface to The Kingster.

I am never surprised to hear of a famous athlete acting like a jackass, but I guess I'm still naive, because I still get surprised by how effin' stupid so many are. Being the agent for one of these geniuses has to sometimes feel like being the manager in "This is Spinal Tap".

Having The Kingster revealing Ron Borges' most recent embarassment is kind of like watching New Mexico versus New Mexico State.

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:40am

Do you think Bus Cook keeps a cricket bat with him at all times?

by Quincy :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 11:07am

Certainly, in the topsy-turvy world of pro football, having a good solid piece of wood in your hand is often useful.

by Will Allen :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:08pm

There's no sex and drugs for Bus!

by Independent George :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:41am

The Favre situation goes well beyond him just being a jerk:

1. The dong shots unquestionably counts as a hostile workplace environment.
2. Since Favre was the Jets highest-paid employee, it could arguably count as quid-pro-quo, as well.
3. Even if no threats were issued, his very fame and prominence counts against him as she implicitly has a strong disincentive to file a complaint. This counts doubly so if other female employees were aware of his behavior, and the lack of action against him, even if they were never subjected to it.
4. The alleged involvement of a middle-man would prove that ownership was either aware or should have been aware.
5. He persisted even after being refused.
6. He was never disciplined for it by management.

by hbh_uk :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 11:27am

Agreed: of course he gets the presumption of innocence until this stuff is corroborated, but if/when it is then he should be in serious sh**.

For any buffoons like Stephen A(-hole) Smith who think this is just some sort of silly caper, let's draw a parallel. Imagine if there was a boutique investment bank where one of the hotshot traders, making $20M a year, left sexual voicemail messages for a young woman in Marketing, and then sent her pictures of his wang. If you read about this in the newspaper you'd think he was a pretty bad guy. And if senior management at the bank had known about it and done nothing, they would (I expect) be exposed to liability for sexual harrassment.

This is a pretty good approximation of what is alleged with Favre: the traders are the highest-paid employees in investment banks (much more so than the board) but they have little or no 'official' management responsibility. Favre wasn't the President of the NY Jets, but you can bet your arse that everyone in that organisation knew that he was very powerful: do you think that the equipment guys would have kept their jobs had they disobeyed an instruction from Favre? So why would a young woman in the organisation feel differently?

That power, and its abuse, is what makes these allegations so serious. If Goodell confirms that this stuff is true then he has to suspend Favre. Anything less would be pretty pathetic.

by QCIC (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:17pm

Lets wait until all the facts are in eh?

I saw one of my professors get taken down for "harassing" a fellow graduate student who was clearly trying to seduce him. She was really pretty crazy, but he was 50, had horrible interpersonal skills, and out of touch with such things. He just thought she was interested in him (which she clearly was for quite a while), and then she went all wacko and was able to coast to her degree through the ensuing fiasco. He certainly displayed some poor judgment, but there wasn't any doubt even among the female graduate students that he got jobbed by the system. Of course his punishment was permanent paid leave, so I suppose it wasn't the end of the world for him, but it was highly embarrassing.

Yes a lot of people are huge jerks, but that happens on BOTH sides of court cases.

by Independent George :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:42pm

The facts in dispute are:

1. Was that Favre's dong?
2. Was that Favre's fake MySpace page?
3. Was that Favre's voice on those messages?
4. Was anyone else involved from the Jets organization?

Based on the facts in evidence, Favre's only defense is that he's been set up in an elaborate frame job. That's certainly a possibility - Deadspin and/or Sterger could well have been suckered by a ruse - but nothing seems to indicate this so far.

If any of #s 1-3 is true, that would be cause for civil action against Favre. If #4 is true in combination with any of #s 1-3, then that's cause for civil action against the Jets. If all 4 are true, then the NFL's got a major problem on its hands.

by QCIC (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:02pm

I don't dig into the gory details of stories like this. So it is beyond dispute that this wasn't consensual at the time? That was not clear to me from the little tidbits I picked up in the serious football reading I do. Also as far as I know making lewd advances at a coworker is not a crime.

Anyway I am just going to stop paying attention to this permanently now. My $.02

by Eddo :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:08pm

"Also as far as I know making lewd advances at a coworker is not a crime."

Do you live in the US? Generally, that's considered a hostile working environment. While that's not a criminal offense, it can be a civil one and will often lead to termination.


It doesn't appear to be consensual. In the voice mail, Favre says he got Steger's number from another guy. That obviously isn't enough to prove lack of consent, but it's quite suggestive.

by Led :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:25pm

Number 4 needs to be fleshed out a bit. A PR guy passing social messages from Favre to Sterger isn't an issue. Depends on what the messages are. PR guy may have no idea that there are harrassing phone calls/texts involved. Or the PR guy may be a massive creep trying to pressure Sterger into complying with Favre's (alleged) requests. It depends. But I think it's a stretch to argue some per se legal prohibition against Favre having a romantic relationship with a person in Sterger's position, such that it would be improper for a Jets employee to play any role in facilitating such a relationship.

by Independent George :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:57pm

Good points. From what I'd read, the PR guy got involved precisely because Favre had already been refused, but that just gets back to your point: how much of the backstory was the PR guy aware of, and who (if anyone) did he consult prior to acting on Favre's behalf.

by QCIC (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 4:37pm

Wait a second, I just read in another column (cannot get away from the off-field stuff in modern NFL reporting :( ) that this is the same girl who made a career out of breast implants and skimpy outfits at Florida State?!?!?

I am sorry, but she clearly should know enough to realize what she was getting herself into with her decision making processes.

You make a career as a sex object, hang out with a bunch of undereducated hyper-competitive men with unnatural hormone levels, and then are SHOCKED SHOCKED when they treat you as a sex object? Life is tough.

Am I saying that women who make a career path out of looking like a hussy do not deserve the same personal boundaries as other people? You bet I am. Just like celebrities need to put up with behavior you could file a restraining order for if you were a private citizen. Context matters.

What is the story here? Floosie employed by Jets for boobs is upset players are attempting to get her to have sex with them?

by Sander :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 6:05pm

Floosie employed by Jets never made an issue out of this, actually. She's not pressing any charges, she wasn't the one who leaked stuff to the media. Your rant is misguided.

Besides, the story is: Favre sent sleazy pictures to someone employed by the same organisation who had made it clear she didn't want that attention.

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 6:20pm

that make no sense.

How else did media get Farev pecker photos and sex messages if Sterger did nolt leak to media?

obviouklsy steger release them to somebody becauuase wanted attention or money or both.

maybw going to be in Playboy someday. Be sure to buy issue.

by t.d. :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 6:35pm

pretty sure that's already happened

by Dave Bernreuther :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 7:23pm
by Sander :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:35pm

Who knows? Stuff gets hacked. Maybe she showed a friend and friend leaked it.

Sterger hasn't commented on this, ever. She hasn't sought any publicity. She's not doing so now, either. She's maintaining a very low profile while this goes on. Hard to see how people are then saying that she's trying to exploit this.

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:44pm

would have started last sentencne with difficult

Anywya yes maybe sterger phone got hacked but nott easy to hink that. Think that sterger played keyy role in getting photo and mewssages to deadpsin which is like supermaket tabloid website. not big fan of that kidn of crap. but to each, own. some like Miller lite, some like Sierra Nevada. some like red, some like blue.

by Sander :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:59pm

Maybe she did play a role in getting it out there, it's certainly not unlikely. But she's not exploiting it in any way right now. So the accusations that she's just trying to ruin Favre for her own gain seem off-base.

Besides, even if she was doing that that doesn't make what Favre did any better.

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 8:05pm

oh yes, Favre defintely morre wrong than bimbo. brett facre is major perv. something wrong with him.

by AudacityOfHoops :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 8:19pm

I cannot overstate how much I wish this would have happened with Bruce Gradkowski instead of Favre, simply so I could hear Raiderjoe's take on the situation.

by Mark S. (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 1:35pm

The story of what kind of a role she played in the photos getting at there is relayed by Deadspin here: http://deadspin.com/5603701/brett-favre-once-sent-me-cock-shots-not-a-lo...

Short version: While collaborating with Deadspin on something else last year, Sterger mentioned (possibly offhandedly) to one of their writers that she had been on the receiving end of lewd photos from a high-profile NFL player (it was a year ofr so after the fact at the time of this meeting). After being pressed, she admitted it was Favre, although she refused to go on record or release the photos. Although Deadspin pressed her over the course of several emails to go with the story, she refused until Deadspin wrote back and said they were running the allegations regardless, and that they would use their aforementioned email correspondence to back up the story if they did not have photos or an on-the-record statement from Sterger. A day or two later the photos hit.

by Sander :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 4:53pm

More like a month or two later.

by The Woody Allen of Gangsta Rap (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 8:06pm

In other words, yet another pass from Brett Favre was intercepted.

by Dave Bernreuther :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 7:16pm

She did show it to a friend(s). She said so in the first Deadspin article several months ago. The seller was obviously one of those people.

I have a crazy theory that perhaps her reluctance to get involved in all this is because she'll be exposed in ways she hoped not to be (as opposed to exposing herself in all the ways that got her her jobs in the first place). I think it's at least a little bit likely that she wasn't as opposed to his advances as she said she was. And Favre's initial comments about it (along the lines of "that'll all get sorted out later", I forget his actual quote) are a pretty clear non-denial, but from a place of confidence. Why else might he act that way?

This is 100% speculation, of course.

by the cat in the box is dead (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 4:22am

No, the story is 'a woman employed for being attractive still has a right to choose who she wants to have sex with, and guys should let it drop if she says no. Large publicly-visible organisation and highly marketable star in a position who is often held up as a role-model may not have understood this very simple point.'

I feel sorry for any attractive women you work with.

by the cat in the box is dead (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 4:23am

That was at QCIC, by the way.

by ammek :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 7:31am

My question: why are the Jets employing a "floosie" for her "boobs"?

Favre is halfway through finding out that our societies (I'm not going to restrict this to the US) will excuse their heroes many things — but not the transgression of a certain threshold of prudery.

The visible space given to women in football is still tiny and pathetically prehistoric. There are plenty of female scouts and executives and reporters and commentators, but the female faces of the sport are still cheerleaders and the Lingerie Bowl and surgically-enhanced-and-then-unenhanced-again "game hosts". It's my single least favorite thing about the game.

by thendcomes :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:44pm

Permanent paid leave? So the guy ended up winning the lottery basically. Reputation is overrated.

by Revenge of the NURBS (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 4:55pm

Yeah, it left him free to focus on Fight Club full time.

by the cat in the box is dead (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 4:25am

by Revenge of the NURBS (not verified) :
'Yeah, it left him free to focus on Fight Club full time.'

I was going to say something serious about reputation being important to an academic's career, and then I saw this winning the thread and decided just to congratulate you instead.

by Will Allen :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:02pm

Oh, I don't care what Goodell decides to do one way or another; he seems competent at protecting the interests of his employer, so I suspect he'll be competent in handling this. I don't know the details of this matter, nor am I expert in employment law in New Jersey/New York, or any other state, or on the Federal level. I don't think any of the women alleged to have interaction with Ol' Stubbleface is or was a Jet employee, although certainly independent contractors can have legal status resembling employees, and the NFL is reasonably hypersensitive regarding any issue, involving anyone who can in any way fall under the category of being a member of the media.

Being a jackass quite frequently has legal ramifications (and I didn't mean to imply otherwise) and being an extraordinarily stupid jackass can get REALLY expensive, of course.

by bravehoptoad :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:47pm

Not only that, but that's one ugly dick.

I may not be a sports millionaire, I may not have a golden arm, etc., but at least I ain't cursed with gonads like that. Yee gads.

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:43pm

I've wondered why someone would send a picture of their genitals to another unsolicited. They usually aren't that attractive of a part of the body. You'd be better served with a full body shot where you happen to be nude.

by Marko :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:45pm

According to everything that I have seen reported thus far, Sterger apparently ignored Favre's repeated attempts to contact her and meet up with her. So unless the reporting so far on this is wrong, his advances toward Sterger were entirely unwelcome.

And after the details of Favre's pursuit of Sterger emerged a few days ago (after first hitting the media a few months ago, but without the evidence in the form of voicemails, photos and MySpace messages), another story broke about Favre's crude and unwelcome advances towards two female massage therapists who did work for the Jets (apparently as independent contractors). MMQB doesn't even mention the issue with the massage therapists. If all of this is true, then it shows that Favre has a pattern of engaging in this type of inappropriate behavior towards people who work for his team (at least as independent contractors).

By the way, I remember reading a while back that Tiger Woods watched the Super Bowl this year with Brett Favre at Favre's home in Mississippi. When I heard the voicemail allegedly from Favre to Sterger, I couldn't help but think of Tiger Woods' infamous voicemail ("Uh, this is Tiger . . . .") I wonder what Deanna Favre thinks about all of this.

by Jimmy :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 8:46pm

I do wonder how many times this happened in Green Bay (not that I have any priviliged information on this matter, just good old honest speculation). He was the Packers QB in Green Bay, maybe whatever Brett wanted he got and he got used to it. It explains why he was so averse to retiring, especially a couple of months after the season ended. You know, this man clearly has needs!!!! And a now famous penis. Maybe wrangler should start advertising how quickly the zippers come down on their jeans. Also not that supprising that he seemed to condone Chumura's behaviour.

All very seedy.

by Led :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:36am

As hysterical it would be if Favre's ironman streak was broken by a suspension for (allegedly) sending pictures of his bits and pieces in a pathetically desperate come on to a woman almost 20 years younger than him, it is never going to happen. By imposing that suspension, Goodell would basically be enshrining the whole fiasco in Canton with Favre. And it would all come up again in a big way in six years if Manning stays healthy.

I'm sure being a young beautiful woman has plenty of advantages, but dealing with d-bags and lechers all day long (to say nothing of the occasional abusive ex-boyfriend and stalker) must really suck.

by andrew :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 11:55am

Josh Freeman in the MVP race? rly?

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:42pm

Mvp watch kist in october=moronicness. Gotta wait tilk at least nobember. Just as ztupid as heisman wat ch list september. Guy from mich wolvers wsa leading that and then crapped up thr stadium on saturday

by Sander :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:49pm

I'm a Bucs fan and I think Freeman has the potential to be a great quarterback in time. But MVP Watch? He's completely lost it. Peter King sure is doing a full 180 from his "Bucs are awful 2-14" projection before the season.

by AudacityOfHoops :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 4:14pm

I think the "Bucs are awful 2-14" projection is precisely WHY Freeman is on King's MVP short list. After all, Freeman's leadership qualities are so great that he has turned a 2-14 team into a 3-1 team. All by himself. It's Favre-esque.

by Sander :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:46pm

Oh god no, I like him way too much to have him be Peter King's latest object of adoration.

by CoachDave :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:12pm

That is the worst "MVP Watch" list in the history of football.

by bubqr :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:02pm

Clearly. McNabb at #2 and Freeman #5 is completely absurd. I'm pretty sure he got that Max Hall kid at #6.

I do agree however that this is a very weird year.

by BadAxe (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:26pm

Peter continues his mystifying inability to understand normal human emotions by suggesting that Favre's mindset is most similar to the way he felt upon the death of his father or during a revenge game against his former team.

by ammek :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:28pm

Oh that the article did "detail Carson Palmer's further regression". I'm not sure how a Cover-3 article by PK would read, but you'd think he could talk to someone among his list of contacts or his buddies at NBC and provide a hint at what's afflicting Palmer.

As it is, we're left to understand that, unlike Donovan McNabb, Palmer is moxie-less.

by drobviousso :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 12:36pm

"Carson Palmer's in trouble -- and the Michael Spurlock was Sunday's beneficiary."
He's directing the pseudo-documentary "Overthrow Me!", out this winter.

by bubqr :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:07pm

"Take away the Patriots from Bill Belichick and what is he? A gym teacher with better jewelry, no disrespect to gym teachers intended.''
-- Ron Borges, columnist for the Boston Herald, in a scathing column critical of Belichick for trading Randy Moss."


by QCIC (not verified) :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:22pm

Actually if you take away the Patriots from him he is one of the best football minds in the country who is looking at either a relaxing retirement and half of fame enshrinement, or a new gig making IDK 5 10 million a year

Ah the plebs are so stupid, I cannot believe they facilitate careers for people like Borges.

by bravehoptoad :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 1:43pm

Take away physics from Albert Einstein, and what is he? A janitor with better hair, no disrespect to janitors intended.

by The Ninjalectual :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:00pm

Good one, Mr. Toad.

by drobviousso :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:47pm

Actually, he'd be a patent examiner.

by Sippican (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 2:34am

Ron Borges is now the head of the People's Front of Rahvee-ah. Or is it the Rahvee-ah People's Front? What has Bill Belichick's Roman(Phifer)Empire ever done for us?!

Borges: All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, winning Super Bowl 36, finding Tom Brady in the sixth round, winning Super Bowl 38, winning with a slot receiver playing nickel back, winning Super Bowl 39, beating the Rams by having the placekicker throw a TD, turning Ty Law into the leading receiver on the Colts by having him line up in Rodney Harrison's spot, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what has the Belichick Roman(Phifer)Empire ever done for us?
Attendee: Won 70% of the games he coached?
Borges: Oh shut up! There is not one of us who would not gladly suffer death to rid this country of the Belichick and the Roman(Phifer)Empire once and for all.
Bob Kraft:(raises hand) Uh, well, one.
Borges: Oh, yeah, yeah, there's one. But otherwise, we're solid.

by Big Johnson :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 2:42pm

That is the worst MVP list i have ever seen. And once again MVP is peytons to lose. If anyone outplays him they will either lose the mvp to him by A) having a worse record or B) by having a better surrounding cast. Its gotten quite sad that any writer would suggest that an offense with reggie wayne and dallas clark is anything but an elite surrounding cast.

Sigh i want to like peyton but his worship makes it almost impossible. Im surprised peyton doesnt get looked at like the tebow of the nfl.

by Purds :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 4:07pm

You're falling to the same hyperbole that PK does. Yes, Wayne and Clark are outstanding. Now, tell me about the outstanding offensive lineman who give Manning so much time to pass this year and allow Clark and/or Addai to not have to stay in to block?
Who were those great WR's lining up across from Wayne last week? Blair White anyone?
Who played RB for the entire second half yesterday? First round pick Addai? First round pick D. Brown? Nope, and nope.

And, I am guessing PK wasn't just talking about the offense when he mentioned "decimated." Can you name the SS that the Colts signed off the street last Monday and started in yesterday's game? He's fast, he was the guy who often ran down opposing kick returners a few years ago, and he was cut this spring after playing a few years for the Colts because he has no clue how to take an angle to the ball. They lost the starting SS, the back up SS, and had two safeties go down in preseason.

Now, you're right that Manning shouldn't be anyone's lock for MVP right now. He's not even in the lead, in my book. But, you're overstating what PK said. The Colts, like many teams already, have serious injury issues. They have not been pounded by the overall number of injuries, but the injuries all seem to be in the same places (SS, RB, WR, returners). They look like a very average team, and when Manning looked like a very average QB yesterday, it was ugly.

by Big Johnson :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 5:21pm

when will people realize that how effective the running game is does not affect how effective the passing game is. Last year the colts finished 31st in rushing dvoa and the chargers finished 32nd in rushing dvoa. Non effective rushing didnt affect either of those passing games at all. Also, hasnt footballoutsiders done an article on how the quarterback is more to blame than the offensive line when it comes to sacks? While the line obviously matters, it doesnt matter as much as receivers. Peyton is in an enviable position with clark and wayne lining up for him. Peyton very well may make his receivers look better than they really are (collie, garcon) but to say other quarterbacks dont (lance moore, legadu naanee, brandon lloyd) is just ignorant.

So what does defense have to do with peytons effectiveness? Hes the only player in the league that will get someone to irrationally bring up defensive players in an argument of why a quarterback should be mvp. This is exactly why i dislike peyton manning, he gets more excuses than any player in league history. Every year its the same old story

by Eddo :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 6:20pm

Big Johnson: "i dislike peyton manning"

Everyone else, in unison: "we know"

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 10:48pm

It's like the new Chris, but less racis--I mean he has a different target.

by Purds :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 8:57pm

I'll bite, Big J. Three responses:

1) Just because Indy and SD had good passing offenses while having terrible run offenses doesn't mean that they are not connected. Had each possessed a good running game, who's to say their passing offenses would not have been other worldly, ala NE 2008 (not sure if that's the right season, but you know what I mean)? Logic would dictate that if a defense has to commit linebackers and strong safeties to the run threat, the opposing QB will have more opportunities with the ball. KC played 5+ defensive backs the entire game.

2) Isn't there a tipping point with offensive lines? At some point, even a robo-QB could not make up for an offensive line made of you, me, and the guy sitting at the end of the bar. I am not suggesting that the Colts O line is that bad yet, but to act as though they are "fine" is a bit foolish.

3) I brought up defense because PK was talking about the Colts team being decimated by injuries. YOU made that a statement that the offense was decimated. I was suggesting you were overstating PK's point. The Colts have been decimated by injuries, though not all on offense. Blame PK for saying that makes Manning more of a MVP candidate. I really don't have an opinion on that, though I can see that PK is emphasizing the "valuable" part of MVP by saying the Colts don't have others who can carry the team.

Finally, I would suggest you reread my post, and actually read it before making assumptions. You suggest that I "irrationally [brought] up defensive players in an argument of why a quarterback should be mvp," but if you'll notice, I never said Manning is a lock, or even the leader. I am not sure who is the leader at this point. It's way, way too early, and I can't honestly say I have followed the whole league so far.

But then, maybe others are right -- you just hate PM.

by Big Johnson :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 1:51am

Youre right, you did say that was PK's point and not your own. That makes more sense because PK doesnt make sense. I dont think i stated that you irrationally brought it up but that it seems irrational that anyone would bring it up. But im not reading my post as im typing so i cant say for sure.

with the runningback argument, it doesnt seem to me like there is a coorelation of effective running to effective passing. There were good passing offenses last year with bad running games (colts, chargers, cards) and good running games (saints, steelers, pats). There were good running teams with bad passing games (jets, titans) and there were bad running teams with bad passing games (raiders, redskins). Even the addition of a huge upgrade at quarterback with favre going to the vikings made peterson regress on his effectiveness. If they help each other out so much then why wouldnt peterson get better with a clearly better quarterback? Steven jackson is playing like his same old self this year even though bradford is head and heels better than any qb they have had for quite a while. And lastly, remember how cutler was supposed to help forte become an elite runner?

and i dont hate peyton, i hate his worship.

by dmstorm22 :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 5:52pm

Who else should be the frontrunner for the MVP? Manning is 3-2 (which is only 1 game behind the best record in the league), and has put up the best numbers of any QB.

I heard this same stuff in 2008, but there really wasn't a better option. It might be old and tired to give it to Manning, but he's playing the best.

by Sophandros :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 3:36pm

What I'm really enjoying about the latest Favre saga is that Jenn Sterger used to have a column on SI.com, and SI refuses to acknowledge that...

Sports talk radio and sports message boards are the killing fields of intellectual discourse.

by Marko :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 3:56pm

You should hear the voicemails and see the photos that MMQB sent to Sterger when she was his colleague at SI. The voicemails were about the 4 mocha lattes he just downed at Starbucks after having another of his annoying travel experiences, and the photos were from his colonoscopy.

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:12pm

You got me to laugh out loud with that one.

Just don't get him started on his daughter's softball team.

by Spielman :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 4:31pm

"The Lions had been 2-35 in their previous 37 games. I mean, how many times have you seen Detroit in the victory formation on offense, which is how they ended this game? Hill was the biggest reason."

Very much no. The pathetic impersonation of an NFL defense put forth by the St. Louis Rams was the biggest reason. Good grief, what an embarrassment.

by Raiderjoe :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 6:48pm

Is Goodell goign to make Favre take off pants to compare pecker to one in photo?

by tuluse :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 7:13pm

Sometimes I wish you were the NFL commissioner, Raiderjoe.

by Marko :: Mon, 10/11/2010 - 9:48pm

Pants on the ground, pants on the ground, lookin' like a fool with your pants on the ground . . . .

by edswood (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 12:17pm

I think Rodger Goodell will call in his secret weapon for that one. Beulah Balbricker from Porky's. We can put up "Wanted" posters all over the NFL... "Have you seen this prick? Report immediately to Beulah Balbricker. Do not attempt to apprehend this prick, as it is armed and dangerous. It was last seen hanging out in a pair of crocs in Minnesota."

by the cat in the box is dead (not verified) :: Tue, 10/12/2010 - 4:36am

God bless Raiderjoe.