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01 Nov 2007

The Week in Quotes: November 1, 2007

compiled by Ben Riley


"I think I'm definitely a better person now because I have more money."

-- Cowboys quarterback Tony Romo, discussing (with tongue firmly in cheek) his new six-year, $67.5 million contract ($30 million guaranteed)

"We looked at some numbers, tried 'em on, wore 'em around here for a few months."

-- Cowboys owner Jerry Jones, on how the Cowboys and Romo agreed to the $67.5 million figure (Dallas Morning News)

"It was substantial."

-- Romo's agent Ken Kremer, describing the difference between Romo's asking price in August and the recently completed deal

"Yeah, well, that's of course what he's going to say."

-- Cowboys chief negotiator Stephen Jones (Dallas Morning News)

"We were at the same place. I wasn't partying with her, though. That's for sure."

-- Romo, switching gears and responding to rumors that he partied with Britney Spears in Los Angeles last Friday (San Antonio Express-News)

"I tell you this, Tony. Sometimes they can smell fresh cash."

-- Jerry Jones (Dallas Morning News)


-- Britney Spears, when asked whether she was partying with Romo (from Ryan Seacrest's radio interview of Spears on KIIS-FM radio)


Note: This is news, but it doesn't have to take over the comment thread. Really.

"I said something to [Belichick] after the game. I told him, 'You need to show some respect for the game.' You just don't do that. I don't care how bad it is. You're up 35 points and you're still throwing deep? That's no respect."

-- Redskins linebacker Randall Godfrey, expressing mild irritation over the Patriots' offensive game plan

"They're up 30-some points and they're throwing deep. That was blatant disrespect. I hope we can see them again, definitely."

-- Godfrey

"You don't see Joe Gibbs doing that. You can't even imagine that kind of stuff coming from him. Joe Gibbs. Bill Walsh. Bill Parcells. This isn't like college going for power rankings. This is the pros. You show some respect, show some class."

-- Godfrey

"What did you want me to do, kick a field goal? We're just playing."

-- Bill Belichick, defending his decisions

"When I was coaching defense it was my job to keep the score down, not theirs. When you're playing defense it's your job to stop them. It's not [the offense's] job to not score."

-- Belichick

"It's like I tell the offense, what the ([expletive] do you think I send you guys out there for? To punt?"

-- Belichick

"I have no problem with anything they did. No problem with me."

-- Redskins head coach Joe Gibbs (NBC Sports)

"They have one objective. They whoop people's asses. If you understand that, it answers all your questions. They might not lose."

-- Redskins cornerback Shawn Springs (Washington Post)


"And, to me, I guess I look at it like when I was in high school and it was Frazier against Ali. Ali was the people's champ and he had been the greatest and all of a sudden Frazier comes along. But they said now Ali's back and he's better than ever. And it was, it was just an unbelievable situation and I think this is the same thing."

-- Colts head coach Tony Dungy, offering his analogy for "The Game" this Sunday

"This might be, if this was cartoons, this is Godzilla vs. Megalodon."

-- Former Broncos tight end Shannon Sharpe, offering a slightly less poetic analogy (Sirius Radio via the Boston Globe)


"It's a problem that started all the way back in camp. We've done X-rays, bone scans, MRIs, cat scans and this week I flew to Pittsburgh and met with a specialist. He confirmed what the team told me, that they think it's an arthritis type of thing. The thing that's so frustrating is there is no clear-cut solution to give me relief. I just have to deal with the pain."

-- Bears linebacker and new Fox Sports blogger Brian Urlacher, revealing that he is suffering extensive back pain. For reasons that aren't quite clear, Urlacher is refusing to talk to the local Chicago media.

"But I decided to open up about this because the media didn't like my answers and started saying I was doing a disservice to the fans. But the fans aren't the ones getting ticked about my answers. The fans aren't the ones who I'm trying to avoid. I just don't want to talk about an injury where there are no answers. But when the media throws the fan angle in, I'm talking. That's what I'm doing now. Don't use the fan excuse with me."

-- Urlacher (Fox Sports)

"To me, you guys wanted Brian to talk. The fans would like to know exactly what was going on with Brian. Brian chose that forum to go over it. I thought that was a good thing."

-- Bears head coach Lovie Smith, offering some tepid support for "Blogging with Brian"

"Personally, I don't know why we would put that much information out there. But this is what Brian chose to do. He wanted to clear everything up."

-- Smith, withdrawing said support (Chicago Tribune)

''Obviously, everybody knows I really don't care.''

-- Bears center Olin Kreutz, when asked about Urlacher's blogging

''My whole approach on that is you can't make another man speak if he doesn't want to speak. These are men here, so if I'm the commissioner or anyone, who am I to say you have to go talk to him? You're not my dad. I am a grown man. I should be able to say: 'No, I don't want to speak.'"

-- Bears cornerback Charles Tillman (Chicago Sun Times)


"I've been hearing a lot of people criticize and talk stuff. They're not watching the games or the plays. They're just throwing out criticism."

-- Bears running back Cedric Benson, lashing out at critics who dare question his two-touchdown, 3.1 yards-per-carry performance this year

"Do I need to run with more of a burst? No."

-- Benson, who needs to run with more of a burst

"And [expletive] them. So I guess I'm getting to the hole and walking through the hole, right?"

-- Benson. To be fair, he typically falls down around the vicinity of the hole, rather than walking or running through it.

"I only got 13 carries today [on Sunday, when he totaled 50 yards]. Ten more and I probably could have got 100. Eight more and I probably could have got 100."

-- Benson. Probably not.

"This is like my rookie year, this is like my first time starting and being 'The Guy.' Nobody said it was just going to all of a sudden take off."

-- Benson

"You're not going to have these great games every game."

-- Benson, who has not had a great game all year

"I don't appreciate all that criticism coming my way. I can understand if I'm tugging the ball for 18, 20 carries and still getting 50 yards. But what am I doing that's so bad? I don't understand."

-- Benson (Chicago Tribune)


''That's why they're 5-2 and we're 2-5. Good teams put it in the end zone. Teams like us kick field goals.''

-- Bengals wide receiver and TWIQ-favorite T.J. Houshmandzadeh, questioning whether Bengals head coach should have gone for it on fourth-and-1 from inside the 2-yard line against the Pittsburgh Steelers. The Bengals kicked a field goal and went on to lose, 24-13.

''In hindsight, we probably should have gone for it."

-- Marvin Lewis, offering a succinct post-game thought on his decision (Chicago Sun Times)

"I still feel we're going to possess the ball three more times, by taking the points. We have an opportunity to stop them, get the ball back before halftime then have the ball coming out in the third quarter. So I'm probably going to still kick the field goal at that point with where we were in the game. It was a good yard that way. I have to go with how I'm getting information. We weren't sure, we had a little bit of rundown on the play clock because they didn't get the ball spotted exactly right away. If you look at the tape, once I called timeout, it was a little bit further. But again, I have to go with what is there. It's easy to look back on it now, particularly after they score a touchdown, and think that makes a difference ... It was important to get points."

-- Lewis, apparently retracting his post-game admission (Cincinnati Enquirer)


"A lot of the guys on the team remember what happened. It's far enough removed that you can laugh at it now."

-- Lions quarterback Jon Kitna, defending his controversial decision to go as "Naked Joe Cullen" to a Halloween party hosted by Lions wide receiver Mike Furrey. Joe Cullen is the Lions' defensive line coach who was arrested last year for driving on a public street while naked after ordering from a Detroit-area Wendy's restaurant. According to published reports, Kitna's costume "involved a bodysuit, a T-shirt with a bare chest stamped across the front and a thong." Oh, and Kitna's wife went as a Wendy drive-through attendant. (Detroit Free Press)


"Instead of talking to the media, why don't you go watch some film?''

-- Panthers wide receiver Steve Smith, interrupting an interview Panthers wide receiver Dwayne Jarrett was giving to the local Charlotte media in the locker room


-- Smith, in a "strong tone," after Jarrett gave a slight smile and continued with his interview (Charlotte Observer)


"He's been more mentally tough than I anticipated."

-- Herm Edwards, describing Chiefs quarterback Damon Huard

"At times, it's not very pretty."

-- Edwards, still describing his quarterback

"But then all of a sudden, like in the Raider game in the fourth quarter, we needed to make some plays. And he made a couple of really nice plays under duress."

-- Edwards

"There are so many highs and so many lows. It's never as bad as you think. It's never as good as you think. You just keep fighting the fight. That's what it is."

-- Damon Huard

"I'm sure everybody in Kansas City wants Damon Huard to put up Tom Brady numbers. You know what? If Tom Brady comes to Kansas City, he's not going to put up very good numbers."

-- Phil Simms, supporting Huard while burying the Chiefs wide receivers


"Listen man, bring your own salt and pepper when you come. 'Cause none of the food ... it's a little bland."

-- Giants cornerback Sam Madison, offering some advice when visiting England (As shown on Inside the NFL)

"It puts the team in dishevel.''

-- Mike Ditka, offering his unique take on playing a regular-season game in England (on ESPN's NFL Countdown)

"I'm going as the Burger King Guy."

-- Seahawks quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, describing his Halloween costume (Tacoma News-Tribune)

"I apologize for my gesture at today's game."

-- 49ers placekicker Joe Nedney, who was caught giving one of the Niners faithful the proverbial bird after Nedney booted the ball out of bounds on a kickoff. The NFL later fined Nedney $7,500. (San Jose Mercury News)

"You've got to look at all three of the teams we've beat. They're not the cream of the NFL. You have to say it is what it is."

-- Chargers fullback Lorenzo Neal, trying to temper enthusiasm over the Chargers' recent resurgence. Incidentally, "it is what it is" is this year's hot sports cliché -- look for it in a sports section near you. (San Diego Union-Tribune)

"You can either give it to us on the 40, or you can pitch to Barry Bonds."

-- Bears cornerback/wide receiver/kick returning mastermind Devin Hester (Sports Illustrated)

"It's very frustrating because he's our leader. We feel comfortable with Sage, though. He's a leader, too."

-- Texans wide receiver Kevin Walter, expressing his sentiments regarding the frequent injuries to quarterback Matt Schaub and his trust in backup Sage Rosenfels (Houston Chronicle)

"Whirlpool, hot tub, ice, cold tub, ultrasound on there and whatever else they can think of."

-- Panthers quarterback Vinny Testaverde, describing treatment proscribed by Panthers' trainers for his strained Achilles' tendon

"Probably some ribs, some chicken.''

-- Jaguars running back Fred Taylor, when asked what quarterback Quinn Gray "brings to the table" for Jacksonville (Sports Illustrated)


"With any team, not just Minnesota, that might need a quarterback, I would hope someone would overlook what happened 10 years ago, or whoever they got their information from, and just give me an opportunity. You don't have to sign me. But it won't hurt to bring me in and take a look."

-- Jeff George, still hungry to play football

"Probably maybe go to a fantasy camp or something like that."

-- Brad Childress on how George could play for the Vikings again

"Downside would probably be -- I think -- kind."

-- Childress, when asked if George is on the downside of his career (St. Paul Pioneer-Press)

Remember to send your quotes to quotes-at-footballoutsiders.com. By the way, English food is better than you think.

Posted by: Ben Riley on 01 Nov 2007

145 comments, Last at 06 Nov 2007, 9:38am by Sid


by mactbone (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 12:54pm

The filmroom is where Steve Smith really gives his teammates hands on instruction.

by Bobman (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 12:55pm

Holy Crap! Colts are playing the Pats this weekend??!! Man, that should be worth watching. That one really snuck up on me... anybody else know about this??

Shannon Sharpe, way to pit a fictional post-nuclear mutant dinosaur against the largest shark to ever swim. We get the idea, though.... Megalodon was good, Godzilla, evil. Right?

by Bobman (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:01pm

Fred Taylor, that was some poetic response.

And Jon "naked coach at the Wendy's drive-thru" Kitna, you, sir, are a halloween deity.

by JasonK (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:09pm

Great job on the category headings this week.

by Malene, cph, dk (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:12pm

FWIW, Dungy's referring to the Pats as Ali, and the Colts as Frazier. Belichick, Bumaye, doesn't have quite the same ring, though.

How about "Brady, bumaye"?

by Joe T. (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:16pm

If I was Jon Kitna, I'd feel plenty naked already with that Lions offensive line protecting me.

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:20pm

"You don’t see Joe Gibbs doing that. You can’t even imagine that kind of stuff coming from him."

Is he talking about throwing deep, or scoring 30 points? I'm confused.

by Will (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:21pm

As a Jets fan, I think I'm by law required to hate Belichick and the Pats but that quote was an all-timer. Parcells-esque.

“It’s like I tell the offense, what the ([expletive] do you think I send you guys out there for? To punt?�

– Belichick

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:23pm

Yeah, the only thing that would have made Kitna's costume choice better is if Joe Cullen was quarterbacks coach.

by Phil (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:23pm

Nice choice of song with the Rolling Stones reference.

Gregg Easterbrook would be proud

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:27pm

I've spent way too many pixels on doing you know what to the score, but let it be noted that the list of HOF coaches who have had their offense throw fourth quarter touchdown passes while up a ton is not short.

by Richie (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:32pm

This week's winners are Steve Smith and Fred Taylor.

by Richie (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:37pm

Does anybody know if Belichick has such a sour demeanor in his personal life, or is it just his coaching style?

Was he like this in Cleveland?

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:38pm

Ya' know, I never heard the details of how Smith clocked somebody in the film room; I can't even remember who it was. Stephen Davis? Was Smith provoked in some way? Did Smith contemplate legal action?

by NewsToTom (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:40pm

Re #12
Agreed, but I'd nominate Childress as a co-winner, in part because of the Whitlock-hope crushing effect.

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:42pm


Does anybody know if Belichick has such a sour demeanor in his personal life, or is it just his coaching style?"

His coaching style isn't sour either. Watch how he interacts with the players.

He has a sour demeanor when the Media asks him stupid questions. You ask him about football, and hes chatty. You ask him about "the story behind the football" and he'll bite your head off.

by B (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:48pm

I'm most definitely a Patriots fan, but somehow "we're just playing" is a pretty dickish response from Bellicheck. Still, comparing Godfrey's comments to those of his coach and teammate, he sounds really whiny.

by Richie (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:49pm

I think Michael Westbrook was the one who beat up Stephen Davis during a practice with the Redskins.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:50pm

Ah, just looked it up. Got my sucker punching receivers mixed up. Westbrook clocked Davis when they were with the Redskins, and Smith hammered Anthony Bright into the hospital for two days after Bright made a wisecrack about Smith's performance. Gotta believe that a settlement check was cut for that loss of temper.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 1:54pm

Well, it's an error to think we know any of these people, but the difference bewteen Parcells and Belichik's disdain for the media is that Parcells' disdain is more consistently funny, although Belichik has a certain flair for being funny in the way he speaks like each word weighs a ton as he excretes them.

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:26pm

16 is correct, assuming we stipulate that every single question ever asked by the media is stupid. (Not that that's a bad stipulation or anything.) He is especially chatty about football after his rare losses.

Does anyone else find the expression "tongue planted firmly in cheek" to be kind of odd. It used to be okay if you just had tongue in cheek, but now it always has to be firm.

by Richie (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:32pm

#21, I was thinking the same thing about the tongue. LOL. What does that expression really mean anyway? Did people really stick their tongues in their cheeks when they were being sarcastic?

by Jeremiah (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:32pm

Godzilla vs. Megalodon? More like Godzilla vs. Mecha-Godzilla.

by Jason (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:35pm

“It’s like I tell the offense, what the ([expletive] do you think I send you guys out there for? To punt?�

With a decent sized lead their job should be to run clock so the game ends as quickly as possible and with the fewest amount of injuries.

It amazes me how teams let the Pats run up the score on them. If Brady was in with a 30 point lead in the 2nd half I would tell my D Line after every single play (run or pass) to intentionally rough Brady. I guarantee you that watching Brady take a gigantic cheap shot after every single play that could potentially ruin their season would prove extremely effective in getting Bellichick to remove him.

by PatsFan (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:39pm

Re: #24

What part of:

Note: This is news, but it doesn’t have to take over the comment thread. Really.

is beyond your ability to understand?

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:40pm


"With a decent sized lead their job should be to run clock so the game ends as quickly as possible and with the fewest amount of injuries."
Check the time of the drives the patriots have been running. They are doing exactly that. They're just doing it extremely effectively, and running out of field.

"guarantee you that watching Brady take a gigantic cheap shot after every single play that could potentially ruin their season would prove extremely effective in getting Bellichick to remove him."

Tom Brady has been pulled early in the 4th quarter in 6 of their games. He IS removing him.

by PatsFan (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:40pm

[sigh -- closing the damn tag just to be safe.]

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:45pm

24 - I've been one of the biggest Belichick detractors on here after last week, I think, although maybe I am in a tie for first place among several such complainers.

So understanding that, and with the benefit of calm reflection, advocating for or coaching cheap shots at Brady would be wrong and also unnecessary, as the same message can be sent legally.

If the Pats are up 20, 30, or 40 in the second half, defenses could rush 7 or 8 on every play. If it's a run, then the D is in run blitz. If Brady feels the need to pass, then you smack him and smack him hard but well within the rules. Doesn't need to be anything cheap about it.

If he completes passes against the all-out blitz, so what? You get the ball back sooner, and all you risk is losing by 50 instead of 40. If you hit him hard enough and often enough, all the better. (What the **** do I send the defense out there for? To NOT hit the quarterback?)

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:45pm

Sheesh, it never ends......Fine, I think opposing teams should develop tactical nuclear capability, and take out Patriot Headquarters upon the Patriots hurting the opposing players' feelings.

by zenbitz (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:49pm

24. Get fined by the league much?

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:51pm

I refuse to be lumped in with "intentionally rough Brady" guy, but I suppose others will lump anyway. All I ask is that they lump firmly.

by lagfish (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:56pm

That would be a good start.

by vanya (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 2:59pm

Who knows what Belichick is like in real life. I do know that he does a great little weekly feature called the "Belestrator" where he diagrams last weeks plays and explains them, or reviews the upcoming team strengths and weaknesses, on a local Boston show called "Patriots All Access". (Not sure why that feature has never gotten attention on FO, btw, seems a natural for the people who read this site). That's probably as close to the real Belichick as any outsider is ever going to see. While he's certainly not the most animated guy in the world, he comes off as deeply knowledgeable with a real passion for the game, certainly not "a jerk", and certainly someone that anyone who likes football would enjoy talking to.

by Rodney Harrison (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:05pm

"Godzilla vs. Megalodon."

WTF? All I keep hearing about is Megalodon. No Mothra, Rodan, or Gamera? That's some major disrespect right there!

by lagfish (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:05pm

Kidding btw, I would never condone the nuclear destruction of an NFL's team headquarters. But I do like Matt's idea.

by MarkB (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:06pm

The Evil Belichick Meme has expressed, and the parrots repeat it, not really knowing why.

by Yaguar (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:08pm

7: Very well played.

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:10pm

36 - True enough perhaps, as it was for the "classy Patriots" meme that generally held sway up until this year.

by Joe T. (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:13pm

comments that break the page are out

by Levente from Hungary (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:20pm

My favourite line from last weekend:

"2000? Two thousand years?"
Roy Williams was surprised to find out the Detroit Lions are 5-2 for the first time since 2000.

by Ted Thompson (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:21pm

Why would Godfrey want to see the Pats again? A chance to give up 100? There's this thing called defense, the Redskins should look into it. Godfrey is a sore loser.

by PatsFan (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:22pm

Re: #39

Given how Mangini acted on the way back from the Denver playoff loss, I don't blame Belichick for blowing him off.

by Ryan (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:22pm

#33: He had an affair with a married woman. That's all I need to know about him "in real life" to make a judgment.

by JoshuaPerry (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:23pm

On Sharpe
When was there a Godzilla cartoon?

by Fat Tony (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:24pm

re: 24 - thanks for the dazzling insight. That idea plus just about every other conceivable "running up the score" angle, pro and con, has already been expressed, both on FO and elsewhere on the internets. Thus the request to give it a rest.

Dan Pompei interviewed Satan this week and he actually had some interesting football related things to say, especially about Randy Moss (link in my name).

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:28pm

Yes, Belichik, Prince of Darkness, so unusual in having his team throw 4th quarter td passes while up a ton. Why, at stately Gibbs Manor, such things are unhear....what? Really? Oh.....

never mind.....

Back in the nonhalleucinegenic-influenced world, you know this country has become obscenely wealthy when a widespread source of discontent is that extraordinarily well compensated football players, who have contracted to play hard for a whole sixty minutes of live action football, are having their feelings hurt by other extraordinarily well compensated football players who have similarly contracted, by scoring touchdowns.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:30pm

Fat Tony, didn't you hear? Satan is Moss' coach!

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:33pm

44 - You mean you don't remember Gadzooki(sp?) either?

Here's the quote I sent in this week, but it didn't make the cut. Mike Tomlin was asked at his weekly press conference about whether he gets tired of second guessing by local media.

"It's fun to me. I like to play with you guys. Your opinions don't matter -- and I mean that[.]"

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:34pm

Got me, Tony. I thought you meant Pompei had run a humor column where Beelzebub was the supposed interview subject.

by gmc (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:36pm

1: Steve Smith is concerned that the other Panthers receivers are inadequate? Really?

7: Joe Gibbs wouldn't throw long when HIS team was being blown out. Even now that he has a quarterback with a rocket for an arm (seriously, Campbell isn't a great quarterback but he can gun it).

I agree about Brady. People keep worrying about being beat deep, when they should really be blitzing safeties and jamming Moss/Stallworth off the line. Brady's success has been about better protection as much as anything.

by Bill Belichick (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:38pm

Guys...I'm one massive prick...Rich...you can take your lips off my cock now.

And I cut off the Redskins' communication feed as well because I freakin' can.

Suck it humanity.

by TomC (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:39pm

I thought fundamentalist Christians weren't supposed to have a sense of humor. His wife went as a Wendy's drive-through attendant! That's more comedy than Tony Kornheiser and Dennis Miller combined for in more than 50 weeks of MNF.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:39pm

Thanks, Ryan, for your penetrating moral vision, which allows you to know sufficient details about another person's personal behavior, from a very great distance, to pass judgement on him. Did'ya learn how to do that in church? I loved that part about stoning the prostitute!

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:40pm

Will -- I think Fat Tony made it clear that it was Belicheck talking about Moss. But thanks for the odd and potentially unnecessary amplification in 47.

As for 46, you think *this* episode is what shows that Americans (or perhaps all humans) obsess unnecessarily over sports? I guess this week must have been the straw that, for you, finally broke the camel's back, which previously had borne up so well under the weight of Super Bowl week, five ESPN networks, soccer hooliganism, March Madness, etc.

by zip (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:42pm

I wonder how hard it would be to trade for Steve Smith. He's gotta get sick of the suck that is Carolina after a while, right?

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:45pm

gmc, a good blitzing team may as well try that, although Moss just used to destroy a lot of teams who took that approach with him when he was with the Vikings. The notion that a guy who scored long tds, in the numbers Moss did, was poor at getting past a jam at the line of scrimmage, has always been a little suspect.

by lionsbob (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:48pm

Wait sleeping with married women makes you a bad person. Damn.

by mawbrew (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:48pm

You just have to appreciate the consistency of Marvin Lewis.

If the Bengals don't turn it around (7+ wins), I wouldn't be surprised to see him canned after this year

by lionsbob (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:51pm

Plus we all know why Belichick sleeps with married women. Trying to run up the score on his "notch" list.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 3:52pm

Yeah, Matt, as I wrote, I thought Tony meant something other than an interview with Belichik. As for the rest, yeah, the obsession is long standing, but now it's reached the point that the outcomes of competitions doesn't give sufficient cause for monomania. Players getting their feelings hurt is now cause for outrage, although I suppose that really started with the whole "I've been disrespected" nonsense from guys like Rodney Harrison.

by mawbrew (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:03pm

I think Devin Hester has officially peaked (comparing himself to Bonds), the only question is how steep the descent will be.

by lagfish (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:03pm


-on to another article now.

by Fisher (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:04pm

Maybe the Patsy Nation can call him "God" and the Hatriots can call him "Satan" because it's clear few of you can spell his name correctly.

B E L I C H I C K.


by gerry (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:08pm

Benson - The 2006 draft was the first clue a Bears fan should have had as to Benson's poor psyche. Every other top draftee has a big smile and nice things to say about the four win team he just joined. He's excited and thanking the Lord for the opporturnity to make four wins five. And then Benson comes on stage, crying and making surprising statements about how the man is/was out to get him. The second clue was the 30-day acrimonous holdout about which is was unbending and remorseless. The third was his rift with Thomas Jones throughout 2006. And now it's abundently clear that he doesn't have the mental makeup, for whatever reason, to play in the NFL. Why do root for this team?

by johonny (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:26pm

Tom Brady has been pulled early in the 4th quarter in 6 of their games. He IS removing him.

I think it was putting him back into the Miami game that worries people. Did Bill really think Miami was going to come back? Is he really that paranoid... it's not an easy question to know the answer. I think he might be. If he is or isn't behaving like a poor sport is debatable (yeah the Cowboys were calling their time outs), what I think isn’t is that most fans of other teams have soured on the Pats. These aren't the lovable guys that upset the Rams anymore. It happens when your on top, particularly if you get fined by the NFL commissioner for cheating in game 1 of the season and YOUR THAT MUCH BETTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE:) Enough of that stuff: JON KITNA is now on my favorite QB list. I’m pulling for the Lions this year.

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:26pm


Will, the Jets tried doing a lot of blitzing.

Moss burned them, badly.

by Fnor (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:28pm

Does Hester really want to compare himself to Bonds? Everybody hates Bonds. At this point only one person hates him.

by lionsbob (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:30pm

I like the Patriots. I like prick teams and head coaches. It is a sport and it is entertainment, I did not start watching football so I can see Belichick gave nice handshakes to the opposing team. I hope they become even more classless. You try to hurt Brady because you can't stop them. They gouge out the eye of your best player.

by Tom (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:46pm

That Fred Taylor quote is priceless.

by mactbone (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 4:58pm

Re 60:
Wait, the man who's spent 100 plus posts arguing and defending the Pats and being a sarcastic jerk over the past couple days thinks that it's the words of a football player that prove this country has too much money?

by SGT Ben (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:02pm

“It’s like I tell the offense, what the ([expletive] do you think I send you guys out there for? To punt?�

– Belichick

I may not like him going for it on 4th down when they're already destroying the Redskins (yes, I know, twice)...but that line is an instant classic and a pretty good explanation.

As for his "Sour Demeanor" and what he was like in Cleveland...it's been a while, but I remember a total control freak when he coached the original Browns. He was fairly tight-lipped, but not necessarily as dour as he is now.

I agree with (I believe it was) Rich Conley...stick to football and he's not bad...go outside of game itself in any form and he's a jerk.

I am not a Belichick fan by any means...and hope the Colts beat the snot out of the Pats...but give the guy some props. He's coaching the hell out of the Pats. You can't say it's all cheating...because if teams are still using the same signals now that they have been (especially after the scandal was revealed), they're just plain stupid and deserve to lose.

by Tim (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:06pm

Ah, Rich with the inevitable defend the Pats comment that happens in every thread.

And then, of course Patsfan says that Jason is the one who keeps bringing up the running up the score.

And then you have the weird merciless defending of Belichick by Pats fans, because you know, they just can't stand the thought of him being a jerk in real life. He must be a saint.

Pats fans aren't exactly the sharpest knives in the drawer are they?

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:13pm

No, mactbone, I've argued for over a hundred posts that the hurt feelings of professional football players and coaches
don't really amount to anything, and now I 'm saying that people who do think the hurt feelings of professional football players and coaches are something to be angry or concerned about don't have enough immediate proiblems.

I plead guilty to exhibiting sarcasm to many who are concerned about professional football players and coaches getting their feelings hurt, and to anyone who thinks that trying to injure an opposing player outside the rules is a non-psychotic response to getting one's feelings hurt. Yes, I'm a jerk. I may start wearing a hoodie!!!

by dryheat (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:17pm

#57. no. Apparently vague allegations of sleeping with a married woman makes you a bad person. I don't know how many good people are in the World According to Ryan, but it can't be many. I've donated tens of thousands of dollars to charities over the last few years. I spend Wednesday evenings ladling out Minestrone at the local soup kitchen and every Saturday with my "little brother" from the United Way program*. I've also slept with married women in the past. Repeatedly. Which goes futher than Belichick, since as far as I know, the extent of his involvement is that he's been accused by the husband.

I never thought I was a terrible person, but....

#48, great Gadzooki reference. Totally slipped my mind. Everything that Scrappy Doo wishes he could have been.

*My philanthropic activities have been exagerrated to make a point. My pet peeve is people who do great things philanthropically and make sure they tell you all about it.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:23pm

lionsbob, I've always been kind of neutral on the Pats, and until this year thought their dominance was a little overrated, given they have never crushed all playoff and Super Bowl foes the way more than a few other champs have. I really want the Colts to win on Sunday, and then throughout January and into February. Having said that, the way some people tear their hair and rend their garments when the Pats throw a touchdown pass in the fourth quarter with a big lead, or to choose another example, the way some got all out of whack when they perceived that Belichik behaved improperly with Manning at midfield after the game in January, it makes me start rooting for The Dark Side.

by scurvy (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:28pm

Someone mentioned the Beli-strator show in Boston. Belichick comes across really well on it; he's more than willing to be informative, and he has a good back-and-forth with the show's host. I think he just doesn't like the media's whole, "If you were a hot dog, would you eat yourself," schtick. He especially doesn't like the questions that basically translate to, "Coach Belichick, would you mind saying something bad about your opponent?"

by A for Anonymous (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:36pm

I agree. The Jets have also tried the 3-4 and that hasn't worked, so nobody else should try it either.

Oh wait, Will said a good blitzing team.

by Starshatterer (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:38pm

A for Anonymous (#77 )--

Last season, the Jets blitzed Brady to great effect in the second regular-season game.

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:45pm

73 - Will, I think mactbone's point was not that you express too much or too little sarcasm in your posts about hurt feelings, but that someone (like you) with enough time to be such an FO commenting machine also probably has enough money or few enough worries, etc. -- i.e., if you need proof that some people in this country have the leisure and luxury of worrying about less than life-altering events, look in the mirror. (I can see myself in that mirror too, of course; but the point is you are the one spending considerable time here bemoaning other people's lack of perspective, but you're here too, eh?)

As for the lack of respect card starting in approximately 2002 or whenever, I'd say no way. What's changed is 24/7 media coverage and blogs and whatnot, but I doubt that there are a whole lot of new tactics, topics, or emotions that have been created by Rodney Harrison.

Wait -- I can't believe I just disrespected Rodney Harrison like that. I ask you, what else does that guy have to do to get some recognition for coining words and starting societal trends?

by Will Allen\'s employer (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:49pm

Get back to work!

by zip (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:56pm


I'm pretty sure I've read here before that Will owns his own business, but good effort.

As for the rest of you people, who are now arguing about who was arguing about running up the score... SHUT THE FUCK UP. PLEASE.

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 5:59pm


"Oh wait, Will said a good blitzing team."

Well, the Chargers tried blitzing heavy too. That bit them in the ass. The one thing that slowed the Pats down was when Cleveland pretty much refused to blitz and double'd Welker and Moss the whole game.

IIRC, the cowboys blitzed a bit, and it didn't work.

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:13pm

77, 78, et al.

I think the original point was the benefit of blitzing Brady if he's in there throwing in the 4th with a 5 TD lead.

Blitzing him in order to actually beat him? That might work, assuming anything would work, and so far that's not been a good assumption this year.

by Joe T. (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:13pm

Sportsmanship brings out the worst in everybody.

by Purds (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:30pm

I know NE and Indy are way above the rest of the teams this year, but does this surprise us when we think of the major holes/deficiencies that so many of the "good" teams must operate under this year. For example

1) good team but new head coach: Dallas, San Diego, Pittsburgh, Detriots (if you think they're 5-2 is legit)
2) good team, but rookie or first-year quarterback (less than 16 starts): Jacksonville, Denver, Washington, Cleveland, K.C. (now), Carolina (now), almost Tenn.

That only leaves a few "good" teams left without major changes in coaching or QB-ing: Packers, Ravens, Giants

by Matt (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:31pm

81 - Thanks for the friendly advice, Zip! So sorry that you are forced to read comments that annoy you. Yours must be an even harder lot in life than Will's.

by Purds (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:34pm

Wow, my bad grammar was astounding there. Let me try again:

I know NE and Indy are way above the rest of the teams this year, but does this surprise us when we think of the major holes/deficiencies that so many of the "good" teams must operate under this year?

For example 1) good team but new head coach: Dallas, San Diego, Pittsburgh, Detroit (if you think their 5-2 is legit)

2) good team, but rookie or first-year quarterback (less than 16 starts): Jacksonville, Denver, Washington, Cleveland, K.C. (now), Carolina (now), almost Tenn.

That leaves only a few "good" teams without major changes in coaching or QB-ing: Packers, Ravens, Giants

by Fnor (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:45pm

Just saying "well, they blitzed, and it doesn't work" is a ridiculous oversimplification. There are many types of blitzes. There are many different ways to hide blitzes. You run different blitzes to do different things, to suit your personnel, etc.

I think a well-executed (confused, disguised, etc) blitz executed by a good defence will do fine against the Patriots. The question will be how Brady deals with it. That said, I think the only two teams that can field that sort of gameplan (and keep up with the- hopefully lower- scores a risky high-blitz package will cost) are Indianapolis and Pittsburgh.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 6:50pm

The sad part is that when your are self employed, there is a constant battle between thinking your employee is a great guy who has done more than enough, or a slacker who should be fired. I usually solve this problem by firing myself for the day, and then re-hiring myself and giving myself a raise. Sometimes I suspend myself, but always without pay.

Matt, but I'm not concerned about anything that happens on a football field, other that a deliberate attempt to injure; I just think it is extremely odd that people are so gosh darned concerned about the feelings of people who are providing a pleasant diversion, in return for a lot of money. I mean, why on earth would anybody care? It's no big deal if nobody has an answer, but it just strikes me a curious.

by Papa Narb (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 7:05pm

Re: # 88

Maybe Pittsburgh, but I have watched a lot of Indy football and would not think they can pull off a well-disguised blitzing scheme. I think this is more of a philosophical stance on Dungy's part than anything else. Other teams on the Pats schedule that are more likely than Indy to try a complex blitz package are the Ravens and Eagles.

by mactbone (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 7:38pm

Re 89:
You keep making this point like people here are losing sleep over this. Considering Nathan and Morganja are the only ones with over 10 posts commenting that they didn't appreciate the behavior it might be time to think that you're the one with out of proportion feelings on the subject and most of us were just making an observation.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 7:50pm

Mactbone, when person A observes that a behavior is objectionable, and person B says the behavior is unremarkable, who, exactly, is expressing concern about the behavior? I know I've spent a lot of time on this, mainly because I can't talk this week due to a medical issue, but geez, I am now really, really, curious as to the reasoning here, because it is fascinatingly bizarre to me. Perhaps you can enlighten me.

by Dave (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 8:52pm

On the issue of whether or not Joe Gibbs is too classy to run up the score:

"In 1991 I was covering Atlanta-Washington in the playoffs. I talked to the Falcons' defensive end, Tim Green, and he said, "Ask Glanville about Joe Gibbs throwing the out and up in the fourth quarter when they were ahead, 42-17. He's been using that as a motivational tool all week."

The Redskins' out and up went for 64 yards and a touchdown to Art Monk in that November meeting and moved the score to 49-17. It ended up 56-17. So when I talked to Falcons coach Jerry Glanville that evening in his hotel suite I asked him about it. His eyes narrowed.

"That's just football," he said. Then he flashed rage.

From a Dr Z column on SI on Tuesday.


by MRH (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 9:00pm

1. Please give it a rest.
2. Note to FO staff - please put all Pats related content in a separate web page.
3. Because you can never have enough Herm (from KC Star):

"Herm don’t surf

Herm Edwards, who appeared as a guest on FSN’s “Best Darn Sports Show� this week, was asked whether he was capable of using the Internet.

“You gotta be kidding me,� he said. “Internet? Surf? I don’t have a cell phone. How am I going to surf the Internet? I have no idea.� "

Note that the Best "Damn" show changed it's name to "Darn" because Herm wouldn't appear on a show using profanity and an interview with Herm trumps brand identity or integrity any day of the week.

by young curmudgeon (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 9:11pm

my God, it's like a virus...Will, Rich, Al45, Morganja, dryheat, mactbone, all of you, can't you just ignore one comment? Don't log onto the site for a day...take a walk with your wife or your girlfriend or your dog or your friend or (in dryheat's case) a married woman (just a little ribbin' there, maybe even a tinge of envy if I really wanted to analyze myself)...Patriot fans, glory in the historical excellence that has been your team's performance so far this year and don't worry about what those of us who wish our team were undefeated and dominant say...those who root against the Patriots (and I am among your proud number), don't focus so much on how jerk-like they seem in their winning, what goes around will come around even if it isn't this season...but please, for your own sake, for all of our sakes, for the sake of Football Outsiders (the only place I know of on the web where there is the potential to have an interesting and stimulating discussion about so many aspects of football, please, please, please don't let every single thread spiral hopelessly downward into this pointless, fruitless, never-to-be-resolved bitchfest.

Anybody up for some football this weekend?

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 9:34pm

Absolutely, Curmudgeon. Here's to the Colts winning 34-31!

by Jason (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 10:05pm

"Tom Brady has been pulled early in the 4th quarter in 6 of their games. He IS removing him"

Removing a qb in the 4th quarter after he has thrown another TD to give them like a 35+ lead falls nowhere in the realm of what is considered "pulling someone early"

Pulling someone early is like what the Broncos would do when TD would sit out not only all 4th quarter but also part of the 3rd cuz they were up by 28 points, not letting him rush for 2 more tds to get th eelad up to 42 then pull him out for the last series of the game

by Alaska Jack (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 10:50pm

How about a different topic.

Ben Riley, you have something posted backwards. In the quotes you have involving Childress and George, you posts George's first. That makes it sounds like Childress's totally assholish and uncalled for quotes were in response to what George said.

If I'm reading the story correctly, it's the other way around. First, Childress made his totally assholish and uncalled-for comments in response to a reporters question at a press conference. When Childress's comments were relayed to George, put on the spot and without premediation -- responded in a humble and mature way.

That's right, JEFF GEORGE, of all people, makes Childress look like a sniveling jerk with his response.

There is something to be said for the maturity that comes with age.

- Alaska Jack

by CJH (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 11:46pm

BB is the best football coach I have ever seen. When you get away from the politics and BS he is the greatest. Watching him break down a play on the weekly show here in Boston is watching a master at his craft.

BB was run out of Cleveland, his family harassed because he tried to replace an over the hill icon with a new QB.

BB had the stones to do it again in Boston.

If you want a winning football team you want BB on your sideline. What he did in 2001 was nothing short of amazing.

BB seems to always make strategy decisions on what is best for his team, he wouldn't make a decision based on personal spite even if he had a half a million reasons.

The media here in Boston and nationally don't get this. I'm not sure they have a good grasp on winning football.

My guess on why he ran up the score is to him this is still part of the preseason. They were still working on things to get ready for the season opener, the Colts.
The Colts have given the Pats fits in the last couple of years.

The Pats are great because of the O and D lines first and foremost. You need really good big guys. This is why the Pats, Colts, Steelers and Cowboys are all so good.

It will be interesting to see if the Pats have caught up to the Colts this weekend.

This is fun, what a treat to have such a great football match up in the middle of the season.

by oldnumberseven (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 11:49pm

’My whole approach on that is you can’t make another man speak if he doesn’t want to speak. These are men here, so if I’m the commissioner or anyone, who am I to say you have to go talk to him? You’re not my dad. I am a grown man. I should be able to say: ‘No, I don’t want to speak.’�

– Bears cornerback Charles Tillman (Chicago Sun Times)

I have to agree with Tillman here. Of course, this feature wouldn't exist with out the mandated media time, but I have to agree with Tillman. The reporters ask such idiotic questions and the players and coaches are supposed to take them seriously. I especially hate the interactions that start with the reporter saying; 'talk about how...' The state of reporting is so bad they can't even ask a question half the time. It is always, 'talk about how it felt to run that kick-off back,' or 'Tell us about what you felt when(insert team or player) scored that last second touchdown.'

On the Pats, they kind of now remind me of that old Soviet hockey team. Who will step up and be the Herb brooks of the NFL?

by flounder (not verified) :: Thu, 11/01/2007 - 11:54pm

Re: 98. I thought his comments were hilariously accurate. Why should he take seriously questions about the delusional desires of a bad QB who hasn't played in 6 years?

by Matt (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:10am

With apologies to 94 and 95 and anyone exasperated by this continued dialogue with Will -- I'm not talking about Belichick or the Patriots or anything here, except tangentially as it relates to Will's question about why anyone would care, but please skip ahead. Or just swear. Whatever works for you.

Now Will -- on the narrow view of the topic du week, I don't think the only objection to how the Patriots are playing was based on concern for poor Randall Godfrey. I have no intention of listing those various complaints here to be sure, and you can say what you want about the validity of such complaints, but it's not as though fans in this case are solely "concerned about the feelings of people" that play or coach in the NFL.

On your larger point, asking why fans would care how such people feel, are you serious? Why do (some) fans care if their favorite player is using drugs, committing felonies, giving enough to charities, splitting up his wife, and on and on? You could argue that people care solely because of how it affects the team's chances when the starting left tackle is in jail, but I think that's a tough argument to support. Why do people care if Tony Romo's new pal Britney Spears is a good mother, if so-and-so on Survivor is evil, if Brad and Jennifer are getting back together, etc.? Fans identify with and care about the stars they watch on TV, sometimes caring to an irrational or unhealthy degree. Is this news to you?

by Alaska Jack (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:18am

101 (Flounder):

Do I really need to point out all the things wrong with your post?

Just for starters, I never said Childress's comments weren't accurate. And hilarity is a subjective thing, so if your idea of hilarious is making assholish comments about someone you have no history with and probably never even met, more power to you.

George is a guy looking for work. Childress doesn't want him -- fine. But the salient point is that Childress's comments are not only rude and uncalled for in and of themselves, but also have the practical effect of making it harder for George to find any *other* job. GMs are constantly under public scrutiny, and if Childress makes it sound like hiring George would be crazy, that's going to make a lot of GMs hesitant to even give the appearance that they take George seriously.

At some point, you may remember a parent telling you "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all." Tell me, did they add "Unless, son, it's hilariously accurate"?

- Alaska Jack

by Ben Riley :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:19am

# 98 -- Jeff George actually volunteered his services to the Vikings first, which then prompted the reporter's question to Childress. You are right that George's quote above came after Childress mocked him, but I don't think it's really misleading.

#5 -- I pondered whether to change the "Dungy, Bumaye!" head for a good twenty seconds. Not only does it incorrectly have the Colts playing the Ali-role, the phrase comes from the Rumble in the Jungle between Ali and Foreman, not Ali and Frazier. Then I remembered: life is short.

And thanks to everyone who made sure Patriots-related comments didn't take over the thread. Again.

by John (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:53am

BB seems to always make strategy decisions on what is best for his team...

As long as the team in question isn't named the "Jets", anyway.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 4:22am

Well, Matt, most of the complaints I've encountered here about the Pats' behavior HAVE centered around the hurt feelings inflicited on the Redskins, so much so that I've read numerous posters say that it should be expected that attempts to inflict career ending injuries outside the rules will occur, or even that hurting the Redskins feelings by scoring touchdowns is analogous to donning kkk garb in an African American community, or engaging in the mass rape of women. I'm sorry Matt, but there is no other way to put it: that's just freakin' insane, and I'd say insanity of that nature is a lot more notable than hurting the feelings of some professional football players. Finally, no, Matt, it's not news to me that people are crazy sometimes, but there is practically nothing that is news to me about human nature. I still will remark upon it however.

by Starshatterer (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:14am

BB seems to always make strategy decisions on what is best for his team…

As long as the team in question isn’t named the “Jets�, anyway.
Maybe. Or maybe Belichick felt that it was impossible for himself to do his best coaching under Parcells in that particular situation.

One of the amusing things about Belichick's taciturn disposition is, it makes him a Rorschach blot for commentators. He doesn't show much, so people project all sorts of things (good or bad) on what little they see.

by Shawn (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 10:00am

The closest that Tarvaris Jackson and Brooks Bollinger should come to an NFL football field is that fantasy camp Childress spoke of.
As far as Kelly Holcomb's career goes, to say he's on the downside, I think, would be kind.
This may be the first time where it seems in hindsight that somebody who was at odds with Terrell Owens may, in fact, have been the bigger asshole.

by admin :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 10:47am

Holy smokes, has this comment thread gone to a bad, bad place.

by Starshatterer (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 10:55am

Aaron (#109 )--

Don't look at the Audibles thread.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 11:09am

I apologize, Aaron, for re-engaging on this most tiresome matter. My teeth just get set on edge, however, when people start saying that somebody should be expected to be the recipient of late hits or cheap shots, perhaps with career ending implications, because they scored too many touchdowns. It goes without saying that some of the other stuff I've read this week regarding this matter is worse. How about a policy of not advocating anyone being deliberately targeted for injury via illegal contact?

by White Rose Duelist (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:00pm

Will, you do realize that you were the first commenter to mention running up the score in this thread, right?

I happen to agree with you, but right now both sides of the argument make me sick.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:06pm

Yeah, that was a mistake, but I simply wanted to note that there was a great deal of phony historical revisionism going on. I shouldn't have done it. Then, the predictable, "Brady should be injured via late hits" nonsense raised it's ugly head again, and I admit that stuff drives me nuts.

by oldnumberseven (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:24pm


How many people actually said Brady deserved to get injured? The most vocal as I recall was Morganja, (sp?) and you and he debated it for many posts in the audibles feature. Were there others?

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:42pm

There's one in this thread, old number seven......

"If Brady was in with a 30 point lead in the 2nd half I would tell my D Line after every single play (run or pass) to intentionally rough Brady. I guarantee you that watching Brady take a gigantic cheap shot after every single play that could potentially ruin their season would prove extremely effective in getting Bellichick to remove him."

I really despise that sort of sentiment; one that states that I will break the rules to hurt someone, because they do their jobs much better than I do. I find it absolutely infuriating, which has, along with some people who addressed me directly, and my own stubborness, to , er, overparticipate.

by SGT Ben (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 12:43pm

What's sad about all of this is that we will probably be subjected to it for at least the next couple of weeks regardless of the outcome of "The Game". The only way to silence it to a dull roar is for Brady to drop back to pass and twist his ankle or something...which would probably lead to some Conspiracy theory...

Wow...nevermind, this is going to stupidly rear it's head in every NFL thread for the season.

1 - BB cheated.
2 - BB doesn't particularly care for media folks
3 - The Patriots score a lot of points.
4 - Indy appears to be a classier team. (Today...but things always change)
5 - You can't lose by building your franchise around (Brady, Moss, Welker and company)/(Manning, Harrison, Wayne and company) unless the other combination happens to be on the field.
6 - Even a 2-0 victory will produce it's share of critics for the winning and losting team
7 - The PATS/COLTS are championship worthy teams
8 - PATS, you almost have to love or hate them...with little room for the inbetween
9 - COLTS, you almost have to love them (for Dungy) or hate them (for Manning and his 2,354,736,346,532 commercials) with little room inbetween
10 - This game is overhyped, the fans are irrational and these topics are getting old.

I think these are statements we can all agree on. All that other stuff is stupid. Running up the score is argumentative. No way to prove one side or the other. Cheap shots at Brady (and company) are stupid and classless...way more classless than "running up the score."

The defense's job is to make the offense look stupid. The offenses job is to make the defense look stupid. We agree there...the point at which you rest is...argumentative.

You can't prove one way or another what is best. Let BB decide what is best for his team...and Dungy decide what is best for his (and so on and so forth for the other 29 forgotten teams...Washington clearly wasn't forgotten in this case).

Those who don't actually work in/with/for the NFL have absolutely no say in it...therefore, they are wrong in offering their opinion as if it matters. If Roger Goodell, Robert Kraft of Tom Brady have an issue with the #1 QB being on the field throwing TD passes in the 4th quarter, let them take it up with BB.

They are the only ones who have any real say on the matter. (Personally, I don't like it. From a football stand point, a coaching standpoint and a fan standpoint, I think the risk is far greater than the reward...but it's not my team, it's not my problem.)

If I was Washington, I probably would have blitzed 5 on most plays to lay a few hits on Brady...but I would have tried it early and often and just stuck with it. Sitting back and playing zone doesn't work, Cleveland proved that...so get to Brady. Lay some CLEAN hits on him and rattle his cage a little (it's the only way you're going to beat the Patriots or the Colts...by rattling the QB...which means applying good CLEAN pressure).

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 1:02pm

Absolutely, SGT Ben. It's a magnificent game when played hard as possible, within the confines of the rules. It gets greatly cheapened when people step outside the rules, which is why I advocated the Pats losing an entire year's worth of draft picks when their taping shenannigans were discovered. Geeze, just play the game full bore for sixty minutes, within the rules, and let us see the results. It'll likely be pretty entertaining.

by MRH (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 1:19pm

nevermind, this is going to stupidly rear it’s head in every NFL thread for the season.


IMO, as I've stated elsewhere, the only way to keep this from happening is to confine Patriots-rleated comments in Audibles, TWIQ, etc. to separate postings - one for the Pats, one for the rest of the league, and then rigorously police the comments on the rest of the league postings deleting any mention of anything Pats. Let the comments on the Pats postings run wild, I'm not looking to censor those debates, just make them easier to ignore and less likely to drive out other discussions.

Such a quarantine would take extra work on the part of Aaron and the FO staff and it may not be worth it to them. I wouldn't blame Aaron et al if they choose not to do this - they are in the business of football analysis, not policing the Internet. But clearly self-restraint will not work - it only takes one troll or practical joker or unintentional post by a newcomer to set the whole thing off EVERY TIME, with no end in sight.

I can only hope the FOMBC strikes (in a non-injury fashion) the teams of those involved in this whole sorry affair.

by Starshatterer (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 1:40pm

I can only hope the FOMBC strikes (in a non-injury fashion) the teams of those involved in this whole sorry affair.
I think that would be impossible -- the teams involved are usually "the Patriots" and "whoever the Patriots are playing." How can they both lose?

Besides, FOMBC is the "Term used to describe the tendency of NFL teams to lose games after their fans flood the FO message boards with angry complaints about a low appearance in the FOXSports.com power rankings (based on DVOA). " Even accepting the FO board as a substitute for the now-defunct FOXSports rankings, most complaints have been along the lines of:
The Patriots are clearly ranked too high because they're running up the score late. Good sportsmanship is way better than this. And their teh cheatz,to!!!11lolwaffles
...which means non-Patriot-fans should better hope the FOMBC stays out of this fight, lest the Pats start posting DVOA numbers like Weimar inflation rates.

by Paul (London,UK) (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 2:03pm

#119 A Post First World War German economics reference in TWIQ, a Norse Mythology comparison in Rundown....the Fox message boards are going to have to up their game.

by prunemike (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 2:35pm

#116 again
"or hate them (for Manning and his 2,354,736,346,532 commercials)" I love watching his commercials - I can't ever recall a time when they didn't make me at least smile - even after the 100th time watching them. Even Tom Brady acknowledged that Peyton was a better actor. Because he is.

by Greg (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 2:37pm


I agree, advocating cheap shots is disgusting. One of the reasons I continue to despise Buddy Ryan, despite the modicum of success he brought my Eagles, is his glorification of that sort of thing. I'm embarrassed that some of my fellow Pats-haters (and I use the term hater with tongue in cheek when I refer to myself - nothing so insignificant as a football team is worthy of being truly hated) would advocate such things.

That said, there's nothing wrong with suggesting that teams blitz, make sure they get clean hard licks in on Brady every time he tries to pass with a big lead late in the game, etc. Hitting and physical intimidation are part of the game. That's the appropriate way to respond if you think the opposing team is trying to show you up.

by young curmudgeon (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 3:34pm

OK, if you kids don't stop fighting, I'm going to have to come in there. Don't make me come in there.

I'm glad the linemen rushing Brady have more self control than the posters on this thread and damn near every other thread this week.

So why, you may legitimately ask, am I reading it? I don't know, but whatever the reason, I'm sure not proud of it.

by P. Ryan Wilson :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 3:42pm

Please, please, please, no politics, religion, or discussions on sexual orientation in football threads. Please. I'm asking nicely.

by sam (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 3:59pm


Ryan, with all due respect, deleting comments is not asking nicely. I'm fine with the deletions (since you deleted them both). Hey it's your house and we're just guests here... but let's call it what it is.

by SGT Ben (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 4:22pm

#121 (prunemike)

I'm a huge fan of Manning and his (exponentially) growing list of commercials. The year he broke Dan Marino's TD record (and Steve Youngs efficiency rating...which I feel is a far greater accomplishment) when he kneeled it down instead of tossing a TD...I was impressed. Prior to that, not so much, but I liked the class he showed. I think if it had been the final game of the regular season, he would have done the same.

This is not to say that Tom Brady is playing only for records...I think Tom Brady is busting his butt because that's what he get's paid (handsomely) to do...and because BB is keeping him out there. If the coach says to play, you'd better play your best (no matter which coach you play for).

I can see both sides of the coin...and while I (personally) don't advocate the BB method, it is his team.

As for the Manning hating I had referred to, most people that have decided to "hate" on Manning is because they are sick of seeing him so much. I'm sure Lebron gets that outside of my hometown of Cleveland too.

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 5:26pm

"you almost have to love them (for Dungy) "

Love them because they have a bigot as a coach?

by sam (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 6:02pm


No offense but say goodbye to your post (see #124).

by Rich Conley (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 6:29pm


If Ryan wants to delete my post, thats fine. I would ask that he also delete the post insinuating that Tony Dungy is someone to be liked.

by sam (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 6:36pm

Sure, because those are the same thing.

by prunemike (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 8:37pm

Ryan,I can't believe you deleted my post when I made a factual statement about Dungy not being good. Dungy is a bigot and because he is a bigot that makes him a bad person (not a bad coach - he is a great coach). It is a fact that he lent his football celebrity status last March, right after the Colts Super Bowl win for tickets to a banquet that he appeared at that raised $50,000 to be spent on actions to deny the civil rights of thousands of people in Indiana. Your saying that you deleted my post because it referenced sexual orientation. However you let stand all posts that refered to BB's affair with a married woman. Now, that was a sexual orientation post if there ever was one. I just wish people would stop saying that Dungy is a good person, he is not.

by Paul (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:01pm

As a huge 'skins fan, may I say that I have no problem with what the Pats did. I have a very good friend who is a Giants fan who assures me that Gibbs used to run it up regularly on the Giants, when Bill was an assistant there, and this was done for revenge. I find that hard to believe Gibbs ever did that, as I seem to remember Parcells outcoaching Joe every year. But in any case, they are big boys and can handle an ass whupping.
And the worm always turns...

by oldnumberseven (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:08pm

@Will Allen — 11/2/2007 @ 11:42 am

Ok, Will, that is two. Jason advocated late hits, and morganja (sp?) advocated assault. I find it incredible that you went over the deep end on this.

by oldnumberseven (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:10pm

Though I am sure Viking fans need something to keep them occupied this far into the season.

by sam (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:17pm


You can keep hammering on the civil rights rhetoric but it won't make it true. An you can keep posting after they ask you not to, but all it's going to do is get the comments closed.

by Paul (not verified) :: Fri, 11/02/2007 - 9:48pm

"Panthers quarterback Vinny Testaverde, describing treatment proscribed"

I think that should be PRESCRIBED, unless you're really saying that all of that good-sounding stuff is stuff they don't want him to do.

by coldbikemessenger (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 12:21am

So are Romo and Spears dating?

by sam (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 8:53am

Romo and who?

by dbt (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 1:52pm

The reason Urlacher isn't talking to the media probably has a lot to do with the fact that the local media all ran with a story over the spring involving a custody dispute between himself and a woman with whom he did not have a long term relationship, and who has a history of getting into legal disputes with famous people over sexual encounters.

specifically, she took a ton of SMS messages he sent her (which, yes, were fairly rude), and sent them to the local papers, and everybody ran the story.

I'm sure a lot of it is crankiness over his injury and their crap record, too.

by Will Allen (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 3:08pm

Golly, seven, I'm sorry that you think I went over the deep end. In my defense, you'll see that in the audibles thread, most of my comments about the Pats scoring habits were directed at Morganja, or to people who had directly addressed me. Many of my posts in that thread had nothing to do with the Pats scoring touchdowns. I regret addressing the topic again in this thread, but again, when people start advocating inflicting injuries via late hits, I become infuriated, something I will endeavor to avoid in the future.

by dbt (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 4:51pm

On the Hester-Bonds comparison -- there's two salient facts. One, people are clearly kicking away from Hester regardless of the price, and two, the rest of the team is so bad there is little price to pay.

by Yaguar (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 5:03pm

Yes. I remember saying during the Superbowl that I'd rather the Colts give the ball to Rex Grossman at midfield than to Hester at his own 5.

by Sid (not verified) :: Sat, 11/03/2007 - 11:46pm

“And [expletive] them. So I guess I’m getting to the hole and walking through the hole, right?�

– Benson. To be fair, he typically falls down around the vicinity of the hole, rather than walking or running through it.

hahahahahah, awesome.

by the way, with Steve Smith, you didn't mention what happened with a reporter.

Does it make sense to Smith? Although he hasn't been talking to the media, I offer him a chance to explain.

"Steve, do you have a minute?" I ask Thursday after practice.

"That depends on the subject," Smith says. And to be fair, he's courteous.

I want to talk about what you said to Jarrett.

"I don't have a minute to talk about that," Smith says.

But he says he will talk about the stock market.

by Loyatulla (not verified) :: Sun, 11/04/2007 - 6:25am

Re #13, Belichick's sour demeanor -

Aw, he's OK. Pre-2004, I used to watch him on a Boston TV coaches show. Definitely not a warm & fuzzy kinda guy, but he could actually smile now and then. Altho come to think of it, his smile was sort of like cracking ice ...

by Sid (not verified) :: Tue, 11/06/2007 - 9:38am

RE: 94

Herm saying he doesn't know how to use the Internet was in TWIQ a few weeks ago.