Writers of Pro Football Prospectus 2008

Week 5 Open Game Discussion

Here's the thread for open discussion of all of Week 5 NFL's games, starting on Thursday night with the Patriots at the Buccaneers, then going all day Sunday, and ending with the Vikings at the Bears on Monday Night Football.


by fb29 :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 8:04pm

Looking over FOA, in 2016 the Pats had a TE on the field 96% of the time. I've seen some comments that they will run more 20 personnel but I really don't think so. I mean who is even the 4th WR?

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 8:55pm

Giselle Bündchen wearing a fake mustache.

(I jest, but given how depleted that receiver corps is, would it really surprise you? BTW, according to the Patriots website, it's either Phillip Dorsett or Matthew Slater.)

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:42pm

Dorsett would be ahead of Slater, who is primarily a special teams guy.

They also have guys like White and Lewis that they can put out wide.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:07pm

Has the Patriots secondary improved or is Winston just inaccurate tonight?

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:40pm

Some of both. They've only had one play with completely blown coverage thus far. And Gilmore is doing a reasonable job on Mike Evans. Jameis has helped them.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:49pm

Winston has missed 2-3 plays, but the throwing windows were much tighter than in the previous games. The secondary was absolutely horrific last week, among the worst performances I can ever recalling seeing from a professional team. There's been nothing like that tonight. Even when DBs have been beaten, they've been in position to tackle. There was one blown coverage on an underneath guy, but otherwise, I'd say some good coaching and a sign of a learning in the NE secondary.

by Mike B. In Va :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 10:14am

So much more zone than in previous weeks. Tampa failed to adjust to it completely at halftime.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:44pm

Color Rush: is it one of the worst ideas the NFL has ever had...or one of the better ones?

(Before you answer, consider: everything the NFL has done since 2005)

by deus01 :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:20pm

I actually prefer the Broncos color rush jersey. However, when also wearing orange pants it's a crime against nature.

by Sixknots :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 1:58pm

Wait until you see the Seahawks color rush uniforms. Crime against the universe.

by ChrisS :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 12:55pm

I don't like the Pajama look of the one-color colored unis, the all white is OK

by Theo :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 5:28pm

Some are cool, the all white pats, steelers look good in black and yellow, the all black ravens are cool, uhm, some others maybe, but the all green jets, the all red bills just seem too off.
Some teams look rediculous. That and the throwbacks and the "pink because Koman paid us" is what I feel takes the 'unison' out of uniforms.

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:54pm

Good clock management by both Bucs and Pats ending the first half.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:57pm

Romo is such an odd departure from the rest of the commentators. All these references to beers and casual time as a player. He is the most chill, relaxed announcer I have ever heard. He seems like a real person.

by Bright Blue Shorts :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 3:20pm

Don't worry the networks will knock all that out of him. Since last Thursday they've alraedy stopped him from guessing plays and interrupting Nantz's play-by-play.

But he's an ex-QB and he's still taking the lead and Nantz is happy to play along. It's very enjoyable while it lasts.

by Theo :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 5:38pm

to a lesser extend, but he was calling plays on offense and defense the whole game.

by Theo :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 5:32pm

He was told to stop talking about crashing wedding parties already. You could hear the silence.
We can not have someone with balls in there. It's got to be nice. And clean. And safe.

by Bright Blue Shorts :: Sat, 10/07/2017 - 4:09am

And they wonder why ratings are down when all they serve up is vanilla


by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:31pm

Some days I get sick of watching the offensive line ONLY; I really wish they would show the receivers running routes and the defensive secondary coverage, which is where the majority of modern NFL football occurs.

Yes, bad commentary makes me turn off a game sooner, but if they want ratings for broadcasting football, start broadcasting the goddamn football game!

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:58pm

Two 0:00 roughing the passer penalties?


by Theo :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 5:47pm

smh is so much hstupidity?

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:23pm

SMH = Shaking My Head

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 9:59pm

...was that seriously two roughing penalties in a row?

I want to know what Milkman thinks of this: were they good calls or bad calls?

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:01pm

The first one felt tickytacky. The second was a legit late hit. But... I've never seen anything like that to close a half ever.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:05pm

I don't get the logic on kicking the field goal. Folk has been inaccurate and has never been known for his leg; is it really that much of a stretch to think that maybe the Hail Mary has a higher probability of working than the long field goal?

by Aaron Brooks Go... :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:10pm

GB-DET, to end the game.

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:18pm

If Jameis could it an open receiver the Pats would be in real trouble.

by deus01 :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:19pm

Does he have any accuracy? So far it looks like he just keeps throwing Eli specials where the ball sails 10 ft over the receiver.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:19pm

Okay, that pass was horrific by the Pats' defense. Winston missed it, but Butler somehow let Evans go absolutely clean. Did anyone see how and why Butler messed it up so badly?

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:23pm

It was Jackson, not Evans. Jackson is probably just faster than Butler. At least Butler stayed close. And was in the correct coverage.

Baby steps.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:26pm

Jackson, sorry. It's just weird when you see one of these guys in trail like that, makes me wonder if he was expecting Harmon or McCourty to help over the top.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:33pm

Romo just highlighted Gilmore on Evans pointing out how Evans got open. Wasn't that offensive pass interference?

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:47pm

Irony is McCoy on bench on the play Brady is forced to fumble.

by Yu Narukami :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:56pm

I was cheering for Bucs taking the FG, then I thought they had a 90% getting a penalty from Pats.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:59pm

The Patriots just keep letting the Buccaneers hang around. Or maybe the Buccaneers are letting the Patriots hang around.

EDIT: Nevermind, the Livestream said Folk made the kick at first.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:56pm

Wow, Lewis' little dance after the missed kick was magnificent. Almost like he was having a conversation with the defender with his body language...

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 10:58pm

Pats' 3rd down defense has been much, much better tonight.

Romo says "you can't blitz Brady". Previous blitz of Brady caused the fumble.

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:01pm

I noticed that too, but I figured he was speaking in general terms. Brady is a decent blitz killer most of the time...

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:05pm

Okay. Horrific again. Butler's cushion on Jackson was abysmal.

by Yu Narukami :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:13pm

Well, at least it happened twice in full game instead of twice/drive.

And now Nick Folk is no longer a Buccaneer.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:11pm

My god, the Buccaneers kicking team was better LAST year!

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:12pm

As this game has gone on, Pats have been bailed out a lot by combinations of Winston being inaccurate and Tampa receivers dropping passes. The Pats' defense has been much improved, but one can readily overstate the case for them. They still have made lots of mistakes.

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:15pm

Nick Folk: wow.

Great luck for CBS that they have Jay Feely as their 3rd man tonight. Solid analysis of what Folk is doing wrong.

by vrao81 :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:16pm

Is Nick Folk going to be cut after the game? Three misses, to go along with 2 misses and missed XP last week.

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:18pm

More important question: will they bring back Aguayo?

by PaddyPat :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:19pm

3 made kicks is a tied game. Legitimately accounting for the difficulty of the one before the half, 2 made kicks is a super tight 3-point game. Makes you kind of wonder what DVOA will look like for this game...

by xydux :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:47pm

Given how this one turned out, he makes ONE of those kicks–the 31-yarder–and the Buccaneers take a late lead.

Granted, the Pats still win because Brady would drive them into field-goal range, but ya still gotta hate that (unless, of course, you had a vested interest in the Pats winning–and perhaps even then).

by RickD :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:54pm

If Folk had hit the 31-yarder the Patriots would have been more aggressive on offense and on defense down the stretch. In the last TB TD drive, the Pats were in a very soft defense that they would not have used if they'd only been up 6 points.

by PaddyPat :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 12:44am

The Pats likely wouldn't have punted on the drive that pinned TB around the 5 either... Nevertheless, Folk's horrible game was a major factor in this game, and was probably the biggest difference in efficiency between the teams. Third down conversion, average yardage per play, etc. were all similar. Apart from the kicking, the most obvious difference in performance was the 2 New England turnovers and the horrible New England penalties. This was easily Brady and the offense's worst game of the season, just as much as it was the defense's best.

by RickD :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 12:49am

Brady was fine. He made one really bad pass and fumbled when blindsided. He also completed a lot of passes when needed.
The O-line was dreadful. Well now they have 10 days to work with. And I assume Gronk will be back for the Jets game.

by mehllageman56 :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 12:04pm

Not sure if using Gronk against the Jets is better than letting him rest. The Jets are defending tight ends well, with the two rookie safeties(including the one who said he'd like to die on the field). Running up the middle and throwing to running backs, thereby exposing the Jets' terrible interior linebackers, seems a much better idea. I'd save Gronk for the teams you need him against. Most likely McCown gives up an 80 yard fumble/int return to win the game for you guys.

by Led :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 1:07pm

Hoo boy, Lee and Davis trying to cover White and Lewis all day will be be ugly. The Jets better replace one or both of them with extra safeties instead. When Gronk plays that's hard to do because he's such a good run blocker.

by Cythammer :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:28pm

Now I want to see Folk kick a game-winning FG at the end, just to see if he would still get cut or not. I think he would unless it was from a really impressive distance, like 55+.

by Yu Narukami :: Thu, 10/05/2017 - 11:28pm

Nick Folk will become local hero by nailing onside now.

by RobotBoy :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 4:47am

Last season, the Patriots had a better record five games in after a) starting their second and third string QBs for four of those games, b) playing without Gronk.
After the first four games, the Pats only had 2 close games the rest of the way - the loss to Seattle and nail biter against the Jets.
Winston made the D look better than it was but I think this is closer to what we'll see for the rest of the season as long as Hightower stays healthy (big if): The usual bend-don't-break and lack of emphasis on pass rush.
The O-line play should improve; that is, unless whatever is wrong with Solder doesn't go away. If it doesn't, Brady is unlikely to survive the season. The return of Mitchell should provide some of the Edelman check downs.

by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 10:58am

The plays were there for Tampa to win this game...Winston just didn't make them. And Nick Folk...yeesh.

by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 11:21am

With sincere apologies to MilkmanDanimal:


by aces4me :: Fri, 10/06/2017 - 2:46pm

And I would have gotten away with it if not for you damn kids!

by joe football :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 12:10pm

Time for another season of FO slack gameday chat! For people who are already in, just go to https://kotakuites.slack.com/messages/fo/details/. For anyone that wants to join a star-studded cast of their favorite FO posters for gameday chat, just email me at gamadict@gmail.com and you will receive an invite

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 1:46pm

Refs are all in for Detroit today.

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 2:12pm

Todd Haley has potentially the most explosive offense of the league.
But all he can dial up is runs, screens and bombs.

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 2:55pm

Did Mike Pence just leave the Peyton Manning event in Indianapolis, fly across the country, buy a front row ticket at the 49'ers game, just so he could walk out? How much did this publicity stunt just cost taxpayers?

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 2:57pm

The sooner this idiocy ends the better.

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:06pm

Kaep says he will stand for the anthem. Easiest way to end this is for one of these teams in desperate need of a QB, to get the best QB available. Looking at you Miami.

by MJK :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 1:07am

The anthem protesting, or the Trump-Pence administration?

by Theo :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 6:20am

The attention the protests are given and that everyone turns it into a vehicle for their agenda.

by ChrisLong :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:00pm

My favorite part is the grandstanding about the players protesting, when he had a scheduled fundraiser in California tonight and was almost certainly going to leave early anyway.


by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:10pm

He told the staff to stay in the van when he went into the game, he'd be right out.

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:08pm

Isn't Indy at home today, or did I miss something?

by ChrisLong :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:03pm

In actual football news, I'm enjoying watching the Lions get crushed by the Panthers. Their only real movement on offense came with the aid of a bunch of Panthers PIs and facemasks.

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:08pm

How did the turnover happen in the Detroit game? Fox Sports decided to let their idiot weather guy launch into a 5 minute soliloquy while they inexplicably switched over to the Philadelphia game in the corner.

by ChrisLong :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:12pm

Stafford fumble while getting sacked, it was a close call but the right one.

by RedZone :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:14pm

1-10-DET 30(10:43) M.Stafford sacked at DET 23 for -7 yards (K.Short). FUMBLES (K.Short), RECOVERED by CAR-T.Davis at DET 23. T.Davis to DET 23 for no gain (D.Fells).

by Cythammer :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:17pm

From the couple of highlights I've seen, I'm not at all understanding how the fumble return for a touchdown by Miami wasn't a forward pass.

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:45pm

Too bad it wasn't the Philadelphia game, I would have been able to help you.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:27pm

Where is Tony Romo today? Why isn't he scheduled to call any of the games? This is BS! I've been going out of my way to watch his games! This sucks

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:39pm

I dunno - maybe tmr.
Yeah he's pretty good.

by justanothersteve :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 8:34pm

The short week having him call the Thursday game gives the network extra time to suck out his personality between games

by leviramsey :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 8:39am

Ever since CBS started broadcasting TNF, they've given Nantz's crew the Sunday off after a TNF game unless it's a doubleheader.

by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:29pm

Lions defense gets exposed when they can’t force turnovers. Newton is in a zone. Meanwhile, the Lions offensive line is getting eaten alive by the Carolina defense.

by Cythammer :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:33pm

The Jags have passed just 14 times, versus 31 runs, against the Steelers. They just had an 8-minute field goal drive consisting of 12 plays, all runs.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:36pm

Nice. Washington had a drive like that against the Rams a few weeks ago IIRC

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:41pm

and if you see how they run (or how pittsburgh defends it) they shouldn't be changing that strategy

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:35pm

Panthers safety Captain Munnerlyn has 5 sacks today? That's what the announcers just implied

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:42pm

no the team has 5

by vrao81 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:35pm

Meanwhile Steelers back to playing down to the level of competition...

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 3:58pm


"but he has the 10th best win % of coaches with 100 games or more. .... You just hate him because he's black..."--------------------------------------
The standard is the standard!

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:05pm

You're not allowed to disrespect the winz. Though I think Haley should be fired before Tomlin.

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:14pm

well, on the bright side, at least Antonio Brown didn't just wreck his ankle like Odell Beckham just did. He'll probably never be the same

The standard is the standard!

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:11pm

You're right. Tomlin should have accounted for the fact that Ben was gonna throw five picks today, including two pick-sixes. Man, if only he was good enough to come up with a game plan that was prepared for his quarterback to throw five interceptions! I mean, it happens so frequently, he ought to have found a way to win when it happens by now, right?

(I blame Haley...but seriously, it's hard to win when your quarterback keeps throwing interceptions.)

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:15pm

you blame Haley? Fine.

You know who has the power (and has had the power) to fire Haley for hte last few years? The guy who keeps him around? The guy who doesn't question "Hey Todd, why are we throwing 50 times against the #1 pass D, #32 run D?"

The standard is the standard!

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:21pm

Could it be that Haley is kept around because over the last two years the Steelers offense was a monster?

Seriously what is with your hatred of Tomlin? A lot of fans out there would probably prefer Tomlin to their current head coach. And I'm sure you've had this argument before, but Tomlin really isn't a bad coach. He's not Vince Lombardi or Bill Belichick or Chuck Noll or Bill Walsh–but there's generally only one of those guys in the league at one time. Bagging on Tomlin because he's not the current generational talent (but is STILL a fairly good coach)–that kinda just comes off as spoiled.

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:30pm

good coach? did you see the 2 emotional challenge wastes he had today?


I don't bag on Tomlin because he's not Belichik. I bag on him because he was handed the perfect situation to win, did so, and has been in completely over his head since. He's Barry Switzer 2.0

The standard is the standard!

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:33pm

Oh, so you think in-game management is the most important aspect of being a head coach? I guess you think Andy Reid is one of the worst coaches in the NFL too.

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:35pm

where did I say it was the most?

so, tell me, have you stopped beating your wife?

I just gave an exampel of what he did wrong (the worst) TODAY.

The standard is the standard!

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:46pm

You said that his "emotional" challenges in and of themselves made him a bad coach, so yeah, pretty much.

I'll ignore your other comment for now because it doesn't make sense, it only makes you look like a stupid jerk, as if you need the help. And also because I don't see a "report" button

by Tomlin_Is_Infallible :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:47pm

so I didn't say "most"

can't take a dose of your own medicine, eh? too bad.

The standard is the standard!

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:00pm

You're right, you didn't say "most."

Implicit in your statement, when you brought up the "emotional" challenges, was that his challenges–and, by proxy, his in-game management–was the most problematic thing about him.

But you didn't explicitly say it was the most annoying thing about him.

So, because you don't think his biggest problem is his in-game coaching, allow me to ask what you think it is? What does he do that makes you really despise him?

by roguerouge :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:02pm
by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:47pm

I don't see how anything in that article defends his "wife beating" comment. That fact that Tomlin here uses domestic violence as a joke should tell you everything you need to know about him.

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:56pm

He's not using it as a joke, though. The classic example of a loaded question is "when did you stop beating your wife?" The reason that this is a loaded question is because the question is premised on "you beat your wife in the past, when did you stop?" In other words, the question is loaded because embedded in it is the accusation that you beat your wife in the past; even if you've stopped doing that, you're still a wife-beater.

He's saying that you asked him a loaded question by suggesting that his biggest problem with Tomlin is his game management. Infallible is peeved that you "loaded" the question by suggesting that his only (and largest) problem with Tomlin was in-game decisions. So, he asked you a loaded question (and the archetypical example, to boot; I'd assume that he thought you'd heard it before) to point out what he perceived as your fallacious questioning.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:39pm

First of all, I think it's way funnier to refer to him as Tomlin, not to mention more accurate.

I guess I see what you're saying, but it's not like I just overlooked the fact that I was asking a loaded question. Asking a loaded question was kind of the point of my comment there, to point out the assumption inherent to Tomlin's earlier comment

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:49pm

He gave an example of why Tomlin is not a good coach (2 emotional challenges).
And then said he got into the job with the perfect situation; solid run game, HOF QB, HOF defense, that Tomlin won a superbowl, then went 10 years without one.

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:58pm

I agree that Tomlin is horrible in-game, for whatever choice there is to be made (time outs, challenges, go for 2, trick plays, unnecessarily running the wheels off of runninbacks) he's one of the worst I've seen.
Sure he's a good coach, but those aspects have been around for over a decade and he hasn't learned a thing.
It's frustrating and leads to many loses.

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:11pm

Yeah I never really understood that go for two thing–was it him trying to show that he wasn't conservative, or was it him thinking that it would win more games? I read somewhere that he wanted to do it because it meant that they should be better on both offense and defense at short yardage/go-for-two situations, but I'm not sure how applicable that is; has Pittsburgh really been better in short-yardage situations (or converted more two-pointers) over the past two/three years (I don't know when they started doing that)?

Off-topic: has anybody anywhere on the internet done a study on whether taking a timeout to avoid a delay-of-game penalty is worth it? It frustrates me immensely when I see teams doing it, but they do it all the time, so I'm wondering if it's done out of habit (this is the way it's always been done) or whether there is a justification for it.

Spam filter, why do you hate me so?

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:44pm

1: (2pointers) he thinks that it puts pressure on the other team. He's horrible on calling them though. I've seen him call it when it actually made more sense to go for 1. They have called pass plays on it forever though. Often empty backfield. That's horrible tactics.
2: (timeouts) Coaches are more concerned about the current drive (1st and 15 or 2nd and long are bad downs) than about an hypothetical future drive.
3: (spam filter) the spam filter hates everyone.

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:10pm

Maybe they've realized Ben is pretty much done, so they give him canned plays. Screens, pick routes and bombs.

by morganja :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:06pm

Panthers offense goes into severe conservative mode and voila, Detroit is back in it. A huge weakness of their offensive coordinator. So stupid.
Haven't been able to run all up the middle all day. Why would it start working now?

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:12pm

So has the success rate of expected onside kicks finally reached zero? I don't understand why else Detroit would kick deep here.

They put so much effort into coming back, then just gave up? That doesn't make sense, unless losing is okay with them as long as it LOOKS close?

by JoeyHarringtonsPiano :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:19pm

If they had made one 3rd down stop, they would have gotten the ball back with about 2 mins left. Instead, Newton makes a nice pass to Benjamin to convert the 3rd and 8, and the Panthers take 3 knees to win.

by vrao81 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:12pm

Ed Dickson should have the highest dyar/dvoa this week. Caught all 5 targets for 175 yards with 100% success rate?

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:43pm

Oh my god Joe Flacco is pathetic. He just lucked into two first downs in a row on balls that should have been incomplete. God I hate the Ravens

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:55pm

So long as it hurts the Raiders, I'll take it.

Out of curiosity, what's your team?

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:01pm

Broncos, but my roommate/good friend is a Raiders fan, so I root for them casually as well. I came to the Broncos as an adult so I don't have the typical AFC West divisional hatred.

What about you?

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:05pm

Broncos as well.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 4:59pm

"Dak Prescott is doing a Tony Romo impersonation" -Buck or Aikman, as if there's a difference between them

Now if only Troy Aikman could do a Tony Romo impersonation too...

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:08pm

I don't know what a Romo impersonation is. Play good QB? Fumble a snap? Throw an untimely INT? Sit on the grass, weeping?

by justanothersteve :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:13pm

It's just he was improvising after the line broke down like most of the lines Romo had.

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:16pm

*Suddenly, Aikman's spine snapped underneath the weight of having to carry the Cowboys for a decade.

None of the fans were impressed.

And no, The Ninjalectual did not feel remorse for demanding a Romo impersonation.*

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:37pm

I wanted to see Aikman do a booth Romo impersonation, aka see Aikman start doing a good job in the booth

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:50pm

Oh yeah I got that...but that joke was wide open, so I took it.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 7:29pm

HAHAHAHA Aikman DID try a Romo, on the Packers last TD, but he got it WRONG! That was hilarious

by MJK :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 1:11am

Date a pretty blond country singer.

by DisplacedPackerFan :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:03pm

Feels like I'm watching the Packers play the Packers. The Cowboys can't run the ball, but Prescott keeps plays alive to get huge gains. I've also seen the Packers get calls like the one against Martinez that allowed them another chance for a TD when they should have faced a fourth down decision. The Packers don't feel like they are playing that badly on defense, but the results...

by DisplacedPackerFan :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:06pm

That second possession by the Packers, ouch. The potential for this to be completely out of hand early....

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:13pm

Beautiful double nickel/safety blitz by the ravens to sack the Raiders QB (EJ Manuel).
They never saw it coming and it was so fast they could not get it away.

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:23pm

Austin fumbling a punt... he's getting way overpaid

by vrao81 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:24pm

Nfl.com says Beckham Jr. broke his fibula, other sites are saying its his ankle.

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:28pm

They are not mutually exclusive.
The "ankle" consists of many bones, if you break the end of the fibula, you have an ankle break.

by vrao81 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 5:54pm

Either way his season is effectively over

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:29pm

He could be back for the playoffs... *sees the Giants record*. Oh.

by deus01 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:25pm

I like that the Packers actually go for it on 4th. I hate it when teams line up pretending like they'll go for it on 4th when it's clear to everyone they're just going to call a time out/take a delay of game. In order to have a chance of drawing people offside you need to go for it at least some of the time in those situations.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:29pm

The Fox director is incredibly good at his job. I feel like I'm close to all the action, watching from the field. Whenever I flip back to Bal/Oak on CBS, I feel like I'm watching from the upper deck bleachers.

Also, couldn't Jurrah's $100 billion stadium have done something to keep the damn late afternoon sunlight out of the players' eyes?

by Theo :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 6:31pm

The cardinals have the same problem - I've wondered the same thing.

by deus01 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 7:07pm

Yeah, the camera is great. Though I wish we'd get the overhead view from behind the QB more often. There were a few games last year that did that and it was fantastic.

Building a stadium isn't about actually making it good place to play game. Apparently in Levi's stadium fans can't even sit on one side because it gets unbearably hot. More focus is spent on how they can get public money (through either grants or ridiculous tax breaks) than actually designing a great place for both players and fans.

by Anger...rising :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 7:04pm

Rams shouldn't have called their last timeout with 2:42 left. Seattle would've been forced to run another play before the two-minute warning, then the timeout would've been available to stop the clock again after third down. In this instance, second down took the clock below 2:40, so third down won't have to be run until 2:00, and then 40 seconds will burn.

by deus01 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 7:35pm

Even though Dallas needed a touchdown I feel like Prescott maybe should have downed himself at the one. They obviously left too much time on the clock and should have known better when playing against Rodgers.

by Guest789 :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 7:42pm

I think the thing people will be criticizing on that drive is the shot play on second down. Run the ball there, and the packers get the ball back with 35 second instead of 75.

Hell of an ending though, I'm so spoiled as a Packers fan by Rodgers.

by justanothersteve :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 8:30pm

I'm still a pessimist with their defense. I was worried Dallas would somehow score a TD, even though there were only 11 seconds left on the clock.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 8:35pm

Hm. Jacksonville's coach doesn't believe that higher workload = higher injury risk for his starting RB. If I were a JAX fan I'd find that concerning.

by Cythammer :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 9:05pm

I'd be more worried if I were Leonard Fournette. The Jags will probably get great production from him for a few years, and if/when he breaks down, he'll be a free agent or close to the end of his rookie contract, meaning he's the only one who really suffers from being overworked. We kind of saw this dynamic with DeMarco Murray during that one great year he had in Dallas.

by The Ninjalectual :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 8:50pm

Scarlett, Whitney, Kelsey, is this the NFL or the lingerie league?

Edit: I once dated a girl named J.J. too xD

by oaktoon :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 9:24pm

He'll never win 5 Super Bowls. Hell, he'll probably won't win 2, and might not even reach a second. He'll never equal Favre's consecutive game streak, or Manning/Brady/Brees TD or Yards Records. For some GB fans, not most, but some, he'll never truly replace Favre in their hearts.

But what Aaron Freakin' Rodgers did today was the single most exciting thing in an October NFL game I've ever seen. It was, IMHO, the greatest drive of his career. The scramble-- whether Tony Dungy wants to blame a defensive breakdown-- was amazing. The willingness to trust Adams and go back to the same play which hadn't work was brilliant.

He may not have a chance to be regarded as the GOAT. But he is simply the best football player i have ever seen. Period. There may never be another like him.

by D2K :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:09pm

It's a very hard argument to make because he won't win 5 Super Bowls, but if I need a score on the final drive of the game, Rodgers is the guy I would choose as well.

by Will Allen :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:12pm

I can't stand the injuries in this game any more. First 10 minutes of Chiefs and Texans, and Merciless and Watt are done, and a Chiefs kick returner looks to be in the concussion protocol.

by Steve B :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:24pm

J.J. Watt got injured? NBC hasn't been very clear on this during the telecast.

by Will Allen :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:36pm

Hey, ya' gotta' talk about somethin'.

by Steve B :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:49pm

I mean I get that he's a great player and that by pretty much all accounts he's a good guy. I applaud the fundraising effort he undertook for the hurricane victims. But do we need to be told every five minutes what a saint/folk hero he is? The way the NBC crew was acting, you would think his leg was about to be amputated.

Also, I'm annoyed that Mercelius' injury got only a passing mention. He's about as big a loss as Watt is.

by Will Allen :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:59pm

Like I said, I just really hate the injuries , more than I have in the past. If a lot of concerts you went to had one or two important performers leaving early due to injury, you'd start enjoying concerts less

by roguerouge :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 8:27am

There's actually a lot of throat injuries in singing across all fields, from popular to opera. Vulture has a good explainer here: http://www.vulture.com/2015/08/surgeon-explains-vocal-cord-injuries.html

Guardian article on a theory that the modern way of singing is causing these injuries, along with the financial need for concert tours: https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/aug/10/adele-vocal-cord-surgery-wh...

by Will Allen :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 10:37pm

Repeat delete

by Will Allen :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 11:08pm

I don't care what the gun said on his pro day before the draft, Deshaun Watson's arm is fine for an upper echelon NFL qb.

by xydux :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 11:15pm

So does anybody know who the Chiefs #1 WR is? I get the sense that it's actually Kelce, but who is it officially? Is it Hill? Wilson?

by Steve B :: Sun, 10/08/2017 - 11:48pm

Good as they look, why do I get the feeling that this will once again end in January heartbreak for Reid, Smith and co.?

by oaktoon :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 12:15am

Because Marty...Bud...Marvin...no-- Andy Reid is still their coach. Schottenheimer is the best comp because they have both won in multiple cities-- but never the big one... Maybe that turns around this year... everybody talks about a Brady-Rodgers SB-- what about an Alex Smith-Rodgers Super Bowl?

by Cythammer :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 12:22am

You have to be incredibly dominant and great to actually be favored over the entire field for the Super Bowl. So of course it will most likely end in playoff defeat. That's true for every team.

by oaktoon :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 12:23am

No Packer fan is going to bitch at anything tonight, not even MM's decision to go for 2 after Randall's Pick Six (don't care what the chart says-- to me it's foolish. What are the odds that the Cowboys get 2 FGs with nothing else happening? pretty damn remote. what are the odds they miss the XP? Even more remote. What are the odds they score a TD and leave you needing a FG just to tie, whereas if you kick the XP (and Crosby makes it-- and maybe that influenced the decision, this poor long snapper) then THEY have to convert the 2 point conversion to make it a 3 point game... if i say we have to convert a 2 pointer to avoid them having to miss an XP; or vice-versa-- i know what my answer is)

Anyway the real question is: Is a first down spot ruling the same as a TD? When Zeke extended his arm, if that had been the goal line it's a TD. But it wasn't. He extended it but then brought the ball back without any Packer forcing him back so there wasn't a question of forward progress.. Unless the ball carrier gets the benefit of the doubt in a scrum like that no matter what. Maybe that's true... Can someone clear this up? (And actually the real mistake was the previous spot. Packers correctly won the challenge but Beasley when he tucked the ball in his left arm and was contacted was just about directly on the 20, not the 19 and a half which the zebras gave him credit for. Cowboys don't get that foot or so and Zeke is short)

by oaktoon :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 12:26am

And I realized I just bitched after saying I wouldn't, but I'm really not. Just curious about that spot ruling and whether the refs for it right or not. Perfectly prepared to accept that they did. As for the 2 pt conversion, well the chart says I'm wrong. I cannot believe it, though...

by RickD :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 12:35am

Didn't see the play in question, but yes, the spotting of the ball is supposed to follow the same logic of judging whether a team has scored a TD. It's all about forward progress. The ball is supposed to be spotted at the point of maximal forward progress, unless the ball carrier deliberately brings it backward himself. Up to the point where the ball carrier is downed, of course.

by nat :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 8:04am

No. It's different from the goal line. Extending the ball into the end zone ends the play. There is no forward progress to award. Forward progress is a concept only on the field of play, when a player is driven backwards by the defense.

I think you understand the difference. But you were misleading to say it was like a TD call. They are entirely separate rules.

by ChrisLong :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 8:17am

But that's the thing: he did deliberately bring the ball back to his body, at which point it doesn't reach the line to gain. Definitely seemed like an odd interpretation of how it normally works. If Zeke is running there and deliberately dodged back a foot and then was tackled, that's not a first down, but here it is? Odd. But whatever, go Pack

by Nevic :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 11:56am

I was saying the same thing as I was watching it. It was very similar to the play right before where Beasley brought the ball back on his own. It is forgotten now with the outcome, but if Dallas scores a TD with less left on the clock and wins, this deserves more focus. I thought Kevin Seifert might address this as he is big into the refereeing issues.

by ChrisS :: Mon, 10/09/2017 - 11:15am

I think that since Zeke did not break contact with the defense and then move forward again the farthest position of the ball is the correct spot. The distinction is not whether the ball was retracted but what did the runners body do after contact was made. The only way the ball would be spotted differently is if he kept moving (forward or backward) and then broke free of the contact and then a new forward progress point would be determined.