Week 13 kicks off with a doozy, as Drew Brees and the 10-1 Saints visit the 6-5 Cowboys. Other key games this weekend include 6-4-1 Minnesota at 8-3 New England, the 8-3 Chargers at the 7-3-1 Steelers on Sunday night, and a big divisional matchup on Monday night between 6-5 Washington and 5-6 Philadelphia (hey, somebody has to win the NFC East). Use this thread to discuss them all.
And the Saints trail. For the first time in forever.
A pass intended for Thomas that was not completed? That's new. A 3 and out for the Saints? That's RARE.
2 Three and outs. Back to back. That looked a bit like a catch, but there wasn't a camera angle that clearly showed the ball getting loose or not getting loose.
Seriously though. Eli Apple is slowly becoming more a liability and less an asset.
Could players stop holding the football with just the hand through contact? That's yelling for a fumble.
Saints stopped on 4th and goal!
The Saints have enough firepower to get out of that hole. But can they actually start firing on all cylinders before it's too late? And can they put a spy on Dak?
Well, I was worried this game might turn into a blowout early. Just not by this team.
Well, 10 points is not really a blowout, but I really expected the Saints to have like high 10s to low 20s in points. The Cowboys have played great defense and ball control offense.
I was saying it might. Would've been if the Cowboys had cashed in on a TD on that drive. It still kind of is with the deficit at 13.
*Double Post*
I hate the challenge rules. Better to have it all initiated from the booth. Just get the calls right. It's stupid to have missed calls because a coach doesn't know when to challenge or has already used up his challenges.
Then the game takes longer, because the replay official can't decide that a questionable call is unimportant enough to ignore. If there's a question of whether a 0-yard pass is actually incomplete, no coach will bother to challenge. But the guy in the booth doesn't have that luxury. (If he does, there will inevitably be complaints about particular calls going unreviewed.)
In fact, the original replay system did involve those calls from upstairs, and the league decided it was better off with coaches' challenges. Despite all the imperfections, I agree.
They don't have challenges in the college game and there aren't any such issues. In fact, things should be faster because we won't have thirty or forty wasted seconds where a coach debates whether to challenge a particular call or not.
If there's a question of whether a 0-yard pass is actually incomplete, no coach will bother to challenge. But the guy in the booth doesn't have that luxury. (If he does, there will inevitably be complaints about particular calls going unreviewed.)
The college rules require a material effect to stop play. So if, e.g., a ball carrier at the end of a 40-yard gain is marked out at the 23 but had actually stepped out on the previous stride at the 26, a review is uncalled-for. The incomplete pass versus completion for no gain is a slam dunk in that regard.
Well, that just happened. The Saints got shut out in the 1st half.
39 yards? I'm just tuning in, what?
Great Cowboys defense and an inefficient Saints offense led us to this.
a) The Cowboys really want to make sure the Saints score a TD. b) Morstead got leveled there.
Brees looks fine, but I'm not sure I've seen a completed pass yet, they've all been dropped and every first down has been a defensive penalty. Oh wait there's one for a TD
Who gets the 4QC/GWD (Assuming New Orleans ties it up)? Brees or Prescott?
So, New Orleans Offensive Line blows up and Brees is strip sacked. All is good for the Cowboys until Randy Gregory gets called for offsides. After he Roughed the Punter a drive early.
How that is not a helmet to helmet hit!? That was pretty much a Hit Stick tackle out of Madden with the helmet to Kamara's head. Dude was even getting up slowly. No flag.
This has been a poorly officiated game.
I will restate this again.
"Sometimes when you get a guy that wide open… it's a harder throw than you can imagine."
"Sometimes when you get a guy that wide open… it's a harder throw than you can imagine."
"Sometimes when you get a guy that wide open… it's a harder throw than you can imagine."
"Sometimes when you get a harder throw than you can imagine... it's a guy that wide open."
"Sometimes when you throw a guy harder than you can imagine... it's wide open, get that?"
"Sometimes when you get a guy harder than you can imagine... it's that wide open a throw."
For the Saints, How is that you allow a QB to slip out of your grasp like that? For the Cowboys, dang it Dak (Or Gallup, can't see who did something wrong). He had nothing but space and opportunity with not a single black jersey in front. Either an over throw or Gallup simply ... missed it.
Wow...ANOTHER blown call. They need to fix replay.
Even as I hit "Post" the refs blow another call.
There have been so many I was wondering which one this was about.
Sorry, I am hot right now.
First the blew the first down call for Beasley. His knee was CLEARLY down a yard or so before the first down.
THEN they missed a clear face mask on Dak.
What's terrible is that EVERYONE watching the game knows what the right call is within seconds of the end of the play. Why can't the officials just have someone in the booth buzz down the right call. That way the pace of the game isn't interrupted and the right call gets made.
This is quite possibly the worst officiated game I have ever seen in the NFL.
It seems like every other play has a blown call.
An 8th official in the booth has always been the solution
That would be too simple. NFL can't do that.
That fumble might be the best thing to happen to the Cowboys. If Garrett kicks a field goal there, he forces the Saints to go to four down football and play for the TD.
Now the Saints will be more likely to go conservative if they get to the Cowboys side of the field and play for OT.
Well that's lame
Stupid use of the timeout at 2:03. You save yourself three seconds, but you make an incomplete pass consequence-free, which makes it much more likely that Dallas tries to throw and clinch the game instead of just killing clock.
Like I think Aikman was saying, it might've made sense for the Saints to save their timeout for after the two-minute warning. It would only cost you three seconds and would ensure there's still a reason for the Cowboys to not run the ball, which in turns lowers the chance Dallas picks up a game-clinching first down.
Some thoughts on last night's game:
- The Officiating was horrible - and I want to point out that it made Mike Pereira want to leave in shame by the end
- Troy Aikman actually seemed... engaged and enthusiastic for once. He tends to be mister bland but he was engaging and energetic and by far the best I've heard him as an announcer. I think no one was more surprised than Joe Buck in the 1st quarter about it - but Buck did match him as it went on there.
So on the game itself
- The Cowboys defense was fantastic - and was all over the field and in Brees face.
- The Saints defense, after a rough opening was good
- The Cowboys offense still needs some work but seems to be getting a bit better overall.
This might be the first time that the Saints have paid for lacking a true second receiver there - and they need to figure out what was going on with their offensive line there. Brees looked frighteningly mortal there with pressure in his face and made some bad decisions. Sean Peyton also needs to learn to better handle challenges as he wasted them early on there and it cost them later - though with how the Saints offense was playing it may not have mattered.
I'm not sure I would take much away from this game other than the Saints are as susceptible to shitting the bed on the road on Thursday night as any other team in the league.
For what it's worth, both teams played on Thanksgiving and so had a full week's worth of rest and practice.
I did not remember this. These guys are such creatures of habit I wonder if Thursday nights throw them off even if they have had 7 days of rest.
Brees looked frighteningly mortal there with pressure in his face and made some bad decisions.
Everyone does.
The best QB I've ever seen dealing with pressure right up the gut was peak Roethlisberger, who was like a lighthouse fighting off waves. Next best was Cutler, which is why he was so eternally frustrating. For a guy so lazy and laconic, he was a goddamn wizard at handling massive line leaks.
I'll throw Russell Wilson into the mix, though he has a tendency to bring the pressure on himself looking for a big play sometimes.
Tony Romo and Aaron Rodgers are also up there.
I particularly enjoyed the moment late in the 4th when Aikman was beginning to discuss that Cole Beasley was probably short of the line... BOOM Joe Buck jumps in and practically yells "But they can't even challenge it!" and then Aikman very sullenly said "Yeah I was gonna get there Joe..." and there was like 10 seconds of silence/glowering at each other in the booth.
I only watched the 2nd half but it seemed like one of those games where one team was just faster and more powerful than the other.
Was it just Bhron Jones on Thomas most of the match or washe being bracketed?
Those Cowboys LBs were outstanding, was astonishing to see how quickly and cleanly they were getting to the gaps and executing.
KC has released Kareem Hunt (who also has been placed on the Commissioner's exempt list, so he can't play or practice or even attend games).
Some team is going to get a top 5 RB for cheap. A whole lot worse conduct has been seen in this league. I expect Goodell keeps him on the list until the season is over, and whoever picks him up off waivers will have him for another three years at a discount. Probably open next season with a 4 game suspension.
"He's not the worst person in the league" isn't a good reason.
It was good enough to get Jerry Jones into the league.
And the HoF! Never forget that bullshit
Well it's like they say. It's not the Hall of Good. It's not the Hall of Great. It's not even the Hall of Phenomenal.
It's the Hall of Fame. And are there many other owners the average fan can name?
Ray Rice was suspended indefinitely after he punched out his woman. Hasn't played since 2013.
Hunt is much better and younger than Rice was. We'll see.
The NFL issues suspensions on the basis of league image, not on player age or talent.
This is true even when you go back to the Rozelle years. Rozelle suspended Alex Karras and Paul Hornung in the early 60's, two of the biggest NFL stars at the time.
Oh no! Chris Harris carted off the field. That's not good
The announcer for Bills/Phins just said “shades of Steve Young” about a Josh Allen play. I don’t know if my eyes will ever be unrolled again.
Take a look at what Steve Young looked like when he was on the Buccaneers. I don't think it's that terrible a comparison
Texans punt on 4th and 3 from the Browns' 40. I understand it a little more when you're up by 10 and the opposing offense is struggling, but I still don't like it.
WTF CBS? I understand that you feel the need to shill semi-charitable whatever on your broadcast, but DO NOT PLAY SAPPY MUSIC WHEN YOU DO! MFG that is INFURIATING. That music is fingernails on a chalkboard for me. Ugh.
And now AJ Green is hurt on a non-contact injury. I think Chris Harris' was non-contact as well. Is the field in Cincinnati known to be bad?
ETA: Green carted to the locker room. The update on Harris is he's "done for the day," which I guess is reason dor cautious optimism.
The field has been cursed since Paul Brown left.
But aside from that, no.
And Derick Wolfe is hurt with what appeared to be an injury caused by the turf. WTF is going on with this field?
For as much as Vontaze Burfict clearly loves hitting people, he sure is a baby about it when he's hurt (not a turf injury this time! And he's already back in the game)
So, Broncos-Bengals observations, 2-minute warning:
1. The Broncos look like a team that usually plays at 2:30 suddenly having to play at 11:00. The Bengals, meanwhile, just look completely discombobulated–their last drive ended on a 3rd and 39 caused by a bunch of offensive penalties.
2. The Bengals are totally playing hide the quarterback today. They've had opportunities to do something, but they haven't really capitalized on them.
3. There have been four injuries so far. Outside of Burfict (tweaked his shoulder on a tackle), they've all been turf-related. Strangely, according to the FO report on Turf Type and Injuries, the Cincinnati turf isn't that bad; it's about middle of the league injury wise and one spot above Denver's field for injuries, so maybe today is just an outlier.
Broncos have been very poor on the road going east this year. They have seemed simply lethargic and off. I read somewhere that they had changed their travel routines this year to try to improve things, I'd hope they change back next year as it has not been working.
Maybe the air is too heavy for them in the humid side of the continent.
Panthers are down by 10 to the Bucs at halftime. Their season has really fallen apart since that 6-2 start.
EDIT: Newton has 54 yards and two picks. That's incredibly bad against the Bucs defense.
Ridiculously bad call on Von Miller just then for what was actually 'hands to the pads'.
Jeff Driskel called for intentional grounding because he didn't pretend good enough to be throwing a real pass.
If current scores hold up and the Ravens lose their tied game we would have a four-way tie in the AFC for the last wildcard spot between the Dolphins, Ravens, Colts, and whoever wins Broncos-Bengals. I expect the Colts and Ravens will win their games, though.
On the one hand, I wrote off the Broncos season after the Jets game. On the other hand, I still want to see the Broncos in the playoffs. And on the other other hand, the Colts/Ravens have both looked good enough at times to make a run if things fall right, and the Colts would probably be entertaining in the playoffs.
So go Colts, Broncos, and Falcons.
Hey, the Browns have a 29% chance of getting that wildcard spot if they go 8-7-1.
I know, I know, Jim Mora...
Just saw that Jalen Ramsey pulled the 'nah, I won't help you up after all' on Luck that Von Miller did last year (on Mahones?), but somehow didn't get the 15 yard penalty.
Von Miller's last year was on Tyrod Taylor (Mahomes didn't start at all until this year). I still think it was a BS call. A no-call on Ramsey strikes me as the right move.
Mahomes actually started week 17 of last year against the Broncos. But you're right the fake-out was with Taylor
Giants get their second TD pass from Odell Beckham on the season. Odell takes the ball, kind of fakes that he's going to run after looking downfield, then lobs it deep to an extremely wide open receiver. A great play call, especially when you consider Eli is 8/18 for 76 yards and an INT.
I loved that Beckham sold giving up on the pass and faked like he was trapped running before throwing the ball. Either that or he was smart enough to keep his eyes down the field while scrambling. Regardless, Beckham was great on that play.
Bruce Arians and Trent Green have been having some interesting discussions of defensive schemes (Tampa 2 high safety vs. Man) as the Browns were doing both at times against the Texans, then Gumble seemed to nudge them away saying they were speaking a different language. I hope they go back to this discussion at some point.
Dammit he never should have left Gumbel2Gumbel
Great play by 38 on special teams! The Bengals returner muffed the punt, and instead of scrambling for the ball he just hits the returner, preventing his recovery and allowing a Bronco teammate to get the recovery
Shamarko Thomas is 38, apparently
Giants go for it on fourth and goal from the 1. Eli is under enormous pressure almost immediately but is able to lob it up to Odell, who is completely alone in the left side of endzone. With Chase Daniels at QB the Bears are going to have a hard time coming back from down 24-14.
Packers looking like world beaters again. If they lose to the Cardinals at home, will McCarthy get the boot now rather than the courtesy wait till the end of season firing??
Cardinals now leading the Packers in Green Bay. If Green Bay loses, it would surprise almost nobody if McCarthy is fired with the next 24 hours.
Well, it did happen.
I was only off by 21 hours. I thought they'd wait until tomorrow morning to announce it.
I see the Jags and Colts are playing a scintillating game.
I don't know. I thought the baseball game was a nice change of pace.
-Ian
Looks like the Bears get screwed out of a TD. On a long pass downfield the receiver goes down, but doesn't appear to be touched. He gets back and after two defenders hit him but fail to bring him down there's no one to prevent a TD. But the play has been whistled dead so the ball remains at the Giants 29.
Under ten minutes to go and the Colts still looking for their first points. I guess Cody Kessler has succeeded where Bortles failed to inspire the Jags defense to carry him.
Obligatory "Cody Kessler's first win as a starter!!11!! oh-fur-8 before dat!" comment from many Browns fans.
Of course, very few stats are more misleading in this type of context, in which they are one of many subpar QBs with often subpar supporting casts, than raw "W-L as a starter."
All he needed was to play for a team where 6 points were enough to win.
3 points, actually, but clearly Kessler wanted to run up the score.
I hate the "points off turnovers" notion that networks push. When the turnover is at the 10 yard line and the offense drives 90 yards, that's hardly due to the turnover
Exactly, it's instructive in basketball because of the short court and the measurability of transition defense, but with football it's only really useful with turnovers inside your own redzone.
Same reason, somewhat, that traditional passer rating is limited because passing so that your RB can punch it in inside the 5 is not all that less valuable than passing for the TD yourself, in addition to all the other variables
That’s one of my biggest pet peeves.
Just saw this completely crazy stat on Twitter, courtesy of Field Yates: "The Buccaneers entered Week 13 with three interceptions as a team for the entire season. Safety Andrew Adams has three interceptions today." Panthers mid-season meltdown continuing.
Falcons are a complete mess
Cya Mike. Enjoyed having you around from 2006-2014.
Wow. Nuts play to end Dolphins-Bills. On fourth down Josh Allen is way behind his line under pressure, but gets away and throws a pass to the endzone to a wide open Clay for what would be a game winner. It's a poor, wobbly pass, but the receiver has no one near him and should be able to adjust and make the catch. He doesn't and the Fins win.
Surprised Bears didn't go for two instead of risking OT
The Bears are likely the superior team even with Chase Daniel at QB so I don't think it's the wrong choice at all.
Anyway, this has been the most incredible comeback I can remember in quite a while. Capped off with that crazy play call to send it to OT. I've been cheering for the Giants most of the game, but now I want to Bears to complete the comeback and win.
Everyone will want to check out the play that scored that TD.
Indeed. Thanks for pointing that out.
Chris Harris is supposed to have a broken fibula according to NFL.com.
I have a succinct response to this, but due to the preferred PG-rating for the game threads, I'll just call myself "displeased" and leave it at that.
Kascmar should have a lot to write about for Clutch Encounters this week.
I feel like Fox is abusing the "BREAKING NEWS" chyron for announcing that the Rams won half an hour ago…
Although the Bears lost, I think they made the right decision in choosing overtime. Their defense is better than their offense, so betting that their defense would hold over their offense converting a fourth-and-goal is the right decision to me.
I agree completely and I think the way the game turned out supports that. To me you only want to roll the dice on a single play if you are very clearly inferior to your opponent. The Bears played poorly today, and Daniel was bad, but I still don’t think there’s any reasonable argument that as a whole they are marketedly inferior to NY (even with Daniel at QB).
If the Bears had won the toss, or if the defense had been able to force a turnover or a punt, they’d have been in good shape to get a score to win. As it was, they had multiple chances on their drive to try to at least tie and it took multiple bad plays to prevent it.
The way that Giants-Bears OT went should give anyone who believes in momentum pause for thought. It won't, but it should.
A single datapoint does not a trend make
It's momentum that doesn't have any evidence for it. It's cited in situations when it seems to exists, in circumstances like this the whole concept is temporarily sent down the memory hole.
Momentum is one of the most misused concepts of all time. Napoleon is one of the few nonscientists to get it right.
Maybe not, but it does mean that the no-momentum argument does have momentum right now, so...
That ref sure looked uncomfortable making a call against the Patriots, wringing his hands nervously. More proof of the conspiracy?
Well it’s almost like an unwritten rule.
And yes I know GB has often gotten iffy calls their way in Lambeau. But nobody gets calls like the Pats in Foxboro.
Well, when the coach is the head of Illuminati and the quarterback a known associate of Satan, you can't be too careful. Perhaps tin-foil beanies can be distributed to officials before Foxboro games, protecting them from gamma-wave radiation and the sinister effects of chem trails.
Say what now?
It's just basic common sense!
I was really surprised Zimmer won that challenge. He was right. I just don't remember a midfield challenge with <1 yard being won.
The NFL does a pretty decent job with its Youtube highlights. 8 minutes are usually enough to get a decent sense of the flow of a game.
(If you're wondering, I was looking up the 6-0 Jags/Colts to see what happened. Basically, good defense from both teams, a failed 4th down or two for the Colts, and the Jaguars just taking the field goals when they got close enough [and faced long 4th downs instead of 4th and 1s].)
So ... this is the year's upset week I guess?
4 games so far I'd call upsets, but no real shockers apart from maybe ARZ/GB. There are probably other weeks we can look to as the upset weeks.
Although if the Jets pull off a win, that's a (not very surprising) upset, and I forgot about the Saints when I wrote this (that one was an upset), and if the Raiders actually manage to complete the comeback, then yes, this IS upset week.
Wait, what? How was that a 1st down? It didn't look like Cook crossed the 1st down plane.
KC needs to make big improvements on defense if they want to survive the postseason. There's no reason the Raiders should even be close in this game.
Just watched the boxscore. 33-30. There is no way the Raiders are supposed to have over 24 points.
Hard to make up 20 yards when you only throw 3 yards each play.
Dammit Vikings. A 4-yard slant with the defender right on him on 4th and 11 isn't going to do it. It would be better to take a sack looking for a deeper throw because at least then you're trying!
Mike McCarthy has been fired.
EDIT: And Joe Philbin is the interim HC.
Next step: trade Rodgers. Jacksonville, maybe?
Rodgers won't be traded. However, it wouldn't surprise me to see an early round QB drafted given they have two first round picks.
I would be shocked by that. Aaron Rodgers isn't close to the point where you should be worrying about his replacement
If they were to find themselves in the right place at the right time like they did when Rodgers fell to them in '05 they should definitely consider it, but hard to imagine this will be the year - it doesn't look like a strong QB draft class, and the ink just barely dried on Rodgers's extension
2005 wasn't considered a strong year for QBs at the time. It was Smith or Rodgers going #1 and whoever didn't go#1 going top 10 then nothing. Rodgers falling to GB was a huge upset. Worked out well for Rodgers and GB tho...
I totally support GB drafting a QB to sit for a year or two.
Favre wasn't really at the point where they needed to draft his replacement, but they did anyway.
Rob Demovsky, ESPN reporter who covers the Packers posted this to the ESPN Milwaukee web site after today's game:
This is, well, something: Aaron Rodgers had 233 yards on 31 completions. The only quarterback to complete 30 passes in a game and throw for less yards this season was Nathan Peterman.
It's not good when your raw stats only beat out Peterman. I wonder how bad his DVOA will be. I can't wait to listen to his podcast tomorrow.
lol
Wait, did Gruden really sent the FG team to kick an FG with pretty much no time left, down by 10?
Worked for Chicago.
And Oakland is eliminated from the playoffs.
Feels like they were eliminated on the day Khalil Mack was traded.
Close -- they were eliminated the day they signed Jon Gruden as head coach. Trading away Mack was just a side effect.
Yeah, if they had hired somebody else they would definitely be in a playoff spot right now.
I hope all of you were standing for that anthem! If I find out any of you were kneeling so help me… *shakes fist menacingly*
I was laying on my floor in respect.
*shakes fist harder*
Geez. Chargers can't defend the deep pass. And on 2 plays, the Steelers are on the Chargers 2.
WTF Michaels? The Chargers didn't draft Eli "only to find they had to trade him" like it was some kind of unpleasant surprise! The whole idea was trading him to the Giants from the beginning! Truly 2018 is the Year of Gaslighting
2004 draft class is all the rage today. FO readers I ask you:
How would you rank those 3 QBs?
1. Rivers
2. Roethlisberger
3. Schaub
4. Eli
5. McCown
6. Van Pelt (probably only important to CSU grads, but he beat out Matt Mauck to back up Jake Plummer!)
Roethlisberger, Rivers, Eli.
It would be interesting to shuffle their careers, though.
I mostly agree with Mountain Time's assessment.
1. Rivers
2. Roethlisberger
3. Manning
4. Schaub
Schaub had better DYAR and DVOA than eli in 2007, 2009, 2010, and 2013. Some years he was way better, some years it was pretty close. They split 2008 and 2012. Eli was better in one year only: 2011. That covers the bulk of Schaub's starting career. Eli played for longer, but would you really want any of those years?
*double post*
So, the Chargers tackles can jump and not they flagged?
Didn't the Chargers also score a TD after an uncalled false start against the Browns?
Yes. Seems silly it is non-reviewable.
I know that there's been research done proving pretty conclusively that West Coast/Mountain Time teams have a harder time in early games. Has there been any research done showing how teams perform in night games? You've gotta think that a lot of the guys on East Coast teams are usually in bed by the time the night games wind down.
I don't think it's been conclusively proven. There is possibly some effect if teams travel naively, however, these days their travel and training during the week should be structured in such way that it limits any theoretical effect.
Holds. False Starts. All uncalled.
Seahawks put a professional feeling beatdown on the 49ers today. The final score was sugared a little bit by a 98 yard interception return and a gratuitous goal line stand but the overall outcome was never really in doubt.
Not where I expected the Seahawks to be in December back in the pre-season, but I certainly won't complain.
Meh, this game is close to over, especially with the Steelers getting the second half kickoff. Disappointing.
The Chargers could engage in a comeback. Or it could be part 2 of Steelers-Panthers.
This gentleman has good ideas, given the comeback.
I feel like congress should pass a law that says if you want to advertise during football games you need make at least 10 different commercials.
Seems like the Steelers should have been penalized 15 yards for the helmet to helmet hit on their own guy…
The punishment comes from having to play Artie Burns.
Or .... maybe not.
One of the poorest officiated games I've ever seen
Worse than Thursday night? How is that possible??
Are you watching?! The Chargers were literally gifted two of their TDs
Someone told the refs the Chargers were really the Patriots and thus activated conspiracy mode.
The best possible spin you can put on this challenge is that Tomlin was looking for more time to decide what play to run here. I don't think they'll win it.
Al Michaels is a good host for a snoozer, but he's not so good in a close, exciting game. He doesn't have the voice for it. I don't know what it's called, but there's a thing you can do with your voice, an ex called it "going gospel" and that's always made sense to me. Kevin Harlan is really good at it. Al isn't.
ETA: Al busted out the gospel voice for a second on that Keenan Allen conversion!
He's old and nearly done. If you've ever seen him outside broadcast make-up, he looks and acts like a skeezy oldster.
Surely the Chargers aren't just going to settle for a 40 yard FG attempt?
It's wide, which it should be. Two runs into the middle with time to spare and two time outs left is asking for a missed FG from that distance.
Oh, you're kidding. Two consecutive offsides by Pit and now it's a 30 yard FG and that is a gimme.
Bad process, good result.
Of course the Steelers are offside on three consecutive attempts with the third being declined because he was so far offside the kick actually went behind him.
FG kickers these days are very accurate from 40 yards in. I don't think it's a problem settling when you are that close.
There's no magic line at 40, as the first attempt demonstrated (pushed wide). There was plenty of time for the Chargers to have run normal plays there and made the attempt a true gimmee.
Didn't matter as the Steelers gifted them the extra yards, but if the Steelers had just stood there and watched on the first kick, the game would have gone to overtime.
The hell just happened? The Steelers were determined that SD would make the kick
Felt like Steelers decided a clean kick would definitely beat them, so they had to jump offsides, block the kick, and dare the officials to keep calling them.
If so, it backfired.
It kinda felt like that to me too. Though, maybe not that bad of an idea. I bet home teams get way more bad calls in their favor, probably even more so on plays where the crowd is roaring. Officials also like to swallow their whistles in late game situations.
It sounds to me like a reasonable strategy once the game winning FG attempt is inside 35 yards, or thereabouts. At that point the only realistic path to victory is to block the kick, so just keep on trying ultra-aggressively until you time it perfectly, or the refs blow the call. Giving up 5 yards (or half the distance to the goal) at that stage is barely a punishment.
Of course if teams were to begin regularly adopting that strategy we would descend into farce, and the league would have to introduce a rule. Something like, consecutive offsides by the defense on a FG attempt mean the offense is automatically awarded 3 points.
On a similar note, why aren't pre-snap motion penalties reviewable (such as on the Chargers first TD)? I'm not somebody who believes in 'everything should be reviewable' as I think it would lead to an increase in frivolous/time-wasting challenges, and in many cases would not necessarily lead to better outcomes. But pre-snap motion stuff feels like it could be reviewed quickly, accurately and objectively, certainly eliminating obvious errors like yesterday's.
The rules already allow for the referees to award 3 pts on consecutive offsides.
Hell, they could award 300 points if they really wanted to.
There's always the scenario the Steelers, and to a extent the Jaguars a few weeks earlier faced, the dreaded "Game can't end on a defensive penalty" and "Defensive Penalty nullifies play". For PIttsburgh, the first offsides call nullified the missed FG and generated a down, the second nullified an block and created another down and the third one was irrelevant since Artie Burns overran the play and the FG was good. For Jacksonville, a DPI penalty erased what should have been a game winning interception in the endzone (It DID ran some clock however), the next one nullified a thrown away pass (More time off the clock), then Ben plunged himself into Matt Feiler's butt and then into the endzone, with just time for a 70 yard Hail Mary, or a sack.
And I agree that pre-snap penalties should be reviewable. With coaches just having 2 challenges (With a 3rd when they win the earlier 2), I don't think time wasting challenges would go on the raise. I'm pretty sure coaches would not use their challenges on that, unless it is a HUGE play, as in a TD after a false start. Hell, the booth could even review that too.
Joe Schobert has an explanation:
https://twitter.com/TheSchoGoesOn53/status/1069452553438543872
This is a good point, I'd forgotten about this. Schobert says:
"Chargers long snapper is notorious for twitching and moving the ball before he snaps. Pointed it out to refs during our game and was told “he’s been doing it his whole career” it’s not gonna get called."
Still though, other teams, including the Steelers earlier in the game, have been able to deal with it seemingly fine.
Ok chargers finally get game winning fg on the third try (first miss, then block, negated by penalties)
Tomlin chooses not to ice the kicker, but the Steelers make up for it by going offsides twice, saving the Chargers from at least one miss.
The game ended on a farcical note after being thoroughly entertaining throughout.
Didn't have any timeouts left.
He had one timeout, the Chargers ran the ball, and he used it with 25 seconds left on second down. It didn't save them any time since the Chargers just ran another play, and may have hurt given that they probably asked their kicker where he wanted it and he chose the left hash. His using the timeout with 25 seconds instead of icing the kicker did nada, and I was just surprised he didn't use it to ice the kicker instead of...whatever his plan was there.
As recently as a couple of years ago, "icing" timeouts actually resulted in a higher FG% than usual. I haven't seen anything recent but I don't know why that would change.
I may be making this up, as I'm going by memory, but I thought the data suggested "icing" the kicker was counter-productive when the kicking team didn't have a TO themselves and the kicking unit is rushing out to get set and make the kick. Otherwise it was irrelevant.
Wondering if DVOA can adequately punish the Steelers' special teams for the 2nd half display.
Given that they were playing ST DVOA #32 I think we can call that...
Well, I totally did not see that coming, as the surprised actress said to the bishop while wiping her face...
I don't believe ST DVOA is adjusted to the opposition, it's essentially VOA. Could be wrong though.
Adrian Peterson is old for an RB, right?
So who are the geriatrics in the Eagles' secondary that they can't catch him in a 90 yard sprint???
Exactly. What a stud.
I think those were Special Teams players? Still, how you get out sprinted by Old Man AP? (TO his credit, he still has some gears)
Well, looks like AP still has about 5 gears in him. He's still fast.
Loved Pederson going for two to go ahead by nine points. I've been wondering if a coach would ever be bold enough to do that.
According to the MNF crew, Washington told them that they "conducted their own investigation" into the Foster situation, apparently concluding that everything was fine. That is hilarious! I've got to know more about this serious investigation they did! You just know the details are going to be a shitshoe.
They talked to his former 'Bama teammates. Well, some of them. Not all of them. Even though the Redskins have like five of them.
You know, at the Sunday brunch or something like that. Whoever happened to be around.
And when they expressed reservations about the guy, Snyder said "nope, hire him anyway. Big Danno in tha houze, makin tha decizionz!"
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209 comments, Last at 04 Dec 2018, 3:44am