Week 2 Open Discussion

Baltimore Ravens QB Lamar Jackson
Baltimore Ravens QB Lamar Jackson
Photo: USA Today Sports Images

Daniel Jones! Taylor Heinicke! Only on Thursday Night Football!

On Sunday, San Francisco (1-0) travels to Philadelphia (1-0), the surprising Raiders (1-0) visit the somewhat surprising Steelers (1-0), and the not-surprising Saints (1-0) face their first divisional opponent, the Carolina Panthers (1-0). On Sunday night, Kansas City (1-0) seeks a second straight win over a rival AFC contender in Baltimore (0-1). The Monday night game sees winless Detroit visit winless (for now) Green Bay. Use this thread to discuss them all. 


194 comments, Last at 21 Sep 2021, 8:35am

152 I'm not sure whether I'm…

I'm not sure whether I'm more impressed by Kelce's catch-and-run or by big guy Ellis chasing him down and tackling him (into the end zone).

153 I was thinking the same…

I was thinking the same thing. The TE takes a 46 yard catch and run to the house, almost chased down by the dang DT - this is not the football of my youth (in the best way possible).

154 Well that was a…

Well that was a preposterously terrible INT by Mahomes. Darnold-esque - wait, apparently he's awesome now. Wilson-esque? Jets QB-esque.

At any rate, sometimes you've just got to eat the sack, man.

157 I think the logic was (down…

I think the logic was (down 5 in the 4th) = go for 2. Whether from the 2 or the 7 or the 50. But the way the game is going, it does feel like having it be an 11-pt, i.e., 2-score, margin after a TD+XP score would be desirable, as opposed to going down 3 scores if it happens. Yes, will be interesting to see what the numbers say.

156 ...like I said, the Ravens…

...like I said, the Ravens can easily hang with the Chiefs in a shootout.

They went for 2 and got it, but it was overturned for inelligible downfield. The announcer rules expert thought it shouldn't have been called since the guy was basically pushed downfield, but I also kind of think there ought to be a soccer-style not-meaningfully-involved-in-the-play exemption.

On the re-try Jackson gets picked - looked for a minute like KC might return it for the 1-pt safety. That would've been neat.

175 I agree with wanting refs to…

I agree with wanting refs to not to call cheap penalties that clearly had no effect on the play, but it's difficult to make the case that an ineligible receiver downfield has no effect on any play where there's a run threat because defenders read the lineman (at least in theory) in order to know whether to stay in coverage or come up in run support. This was a short-yardage play that included a fake handoff from a team whose quarterback had over 100 yards rushing in the game, so it certainly qualifies as presenting a run threat to the defense.

158 That was kind of amazing:…

That was kind of amazing: Collinsworth showed how Williams misread his blocks and took it outside instead of cutting up the hole for a big gain. Very next play they ran essentially the same thing, he made the cut, and got all the way to the 1st down.

160 I almost wonder if Baltimore…

I almost wonder if Baltimore should've let Kelce score there. There's virtually no chance they can keep the Chiefs out of FG range at that point, and without TOs they can't really keep time for the last-second drive either.

161 Yooooooo

This game is great! The rookie! Odafe Oweh!!

164 Gutsy call!

Thankfully they didn't do the dumb hard count call timeout thing.

Lamar! Ravens won the trade.

167 Give credit to Lamar…

Give credit to Lamar. Struggled early and mid but stuck with it. An impressive, gritty performance.

169 So the Raiders are the best…

So the Raiders are the best team in the AFC, right?  They beat the Ravens who beat the Chiefs and they beat the Steelers who beat the Bills.

174 What a game

Its been over nearly 3 hours now and I am ready to sign off for the night.

Some thoughts on the game, yes, its a week to week league, I expect variance in play, but more from QB's receivers, FG kickers and others.  If your offensive line stinks it stinks right.?  Not so fast, last week the Raven's offensive line was awful, tonight Jackson had time to throw, and the Ravens non Jackson runners were 25 carries for 144 yards, 5.8 per carry and Jackson (hard to break out the scrambles from the designed runs had 16 carries for 107).  This team is like no other with 251 rushing yards by traditional stats, clearly some were scrambles.

This team is also like no other because of its coach.  I just read EDJ Sports twitter.

Jon (misspelled) HARBAUGH.  He makes the decision that every coach SHOULD make there, but most coaches WOULDN'T make.  Going for it increased the #Ravens' pre-snap win probability by 17%.  That's the best decision of the young season.

Yes, how many coaches go for that, all 32 should, would you really punt and expect Mahomes to not drive the Chiefs for at least a reasonable FG attempt with a full minute left?  Ask your defense to stop the Chiefs for a 4th straight time?  Insanity.

Maybe Kevin Stefanski, maybe Andy Reid and a few others, I doubt you can get more than six.


178 For those of us who are not Packers or Lions fans

This game shows a Pro Football addiction.  I will watch tonight's game.

Reminds me of the old joke:

Wife to husband:  You love football more than me!

Husband to wife:  Yeah but I love you more than basketball!

I am a committed family man and do not watch the Lions on Thanksgiving.  Yet, I am angry that the Ravens play at Detroit this Sunday and not on Thanksgiving, it would have made for a great road trip with my son and everyone in the family would understand why we took off on Thanksgiving.  Who doesn't deserve a year off from the annual family BS?



179 Wow.

Kevin King getting roasted already.

I legit just don't know what they saw in practice to re-sign him. Im a broken record but at some point the games HAVE to factor into evaluation.

And Stokes confused? At least we can blame that on him being new. Cant for King

185 King's ok as a 2nd/3rd CB…

In reply to by ImNewAroundThe…

King's ok as a 2nd/3rd CB. He'll get burned from time to time; so will everybody not named Jaire. You have 3 starters at CB these days, and the talent pool at that position is pretty thin.

188 He's been that

and no...

He has topped out at average and there were plenty of similar priced CBs they could've gotten that would've been better and/or cheaper. Refusal to move on (freely at that!) from a mistake instead, doing the same thing again (BIG reason they lost the NFCCG). Insanity.

You can have him for a 7th. See a rookie is already doing better. Like better better. See: King gets jumped (he's also been a bad tackler his whole career) and Stokes breaks up the final pass. 

SB aspirations can't rely on complacency. 

189 He has topped out at average…

In reply to by ImNewAroundThe…

He has topped out at average and there were plenty of similar priced CBs they could've gotten that would've been better and/or cheaper.

[citation needed]

192 Which part?

Either way, these sum it up.

Terrible known used band aid.

What team are you a fan of? What would you give up? Especially knowing these other options and the first 2 weeks of the season and its info?

193 The Stokes confusion on that…

In reply to by ImNewAroundThe…

The Stokes confusion on that one play could have actually been King's fault as well as in Stokes did what he was supposed to but King didn't and Stokes then tried to cover for it because he is fast, even at NFL game speed he still looks fast. I haven't been able to find the play again to watch but it looked like King and Stokes were both on that side of the field.

Of course you and I have had conversations about King on here before and we are in agreement. Also agree with your later post pointing out other options they could have tried for the same or less money.

I know it was Detroit and they don't have any top end WR but it was good to see Stokes doing the same type of stuff he did in college with rapidly closing gaps, sticking to receivers and getting his hands on balls. He even had a play where I was worried about a flag because he was just faster than the receiver to the spot but he kept it clean. He did that a lot in college and I was worried with NFL receivers being faster than college receivers on average that he could get in trouble and get some ticky tacky PI calls. But like Alexander he is translating his game from college to the pros nicely so far, with the caveat that a rebuilding Detroit might not be that much better than a college team, especially at WR this year.

Still don't think Joe Barry is the right coach, but two cover corners and 2 above average to great safeties can start to cover up for mistakes. I mean the Packers have actually only given up 387 passing yards so far this year and King getting burned is responsible for at least 135 of that. So that's like 252 yards to the rest of the team and 135 to Kevin King (it might be worse that's just 4 plays that I remember 3 of them 20+ yards).

But the more I see of the Gutekunst front office the more I feel like we have a conservative front office, with the need to prove it's right, paired with fairly aggressive head coach and I'm not sure how well that is going to work in the long run.

194 Fair

Didn't see a replay of it but it did seem awfully far away for it not to be some major team confusion.

I was (and still am) worried they hired Barry, just like you. A guy that runs a scheme that's not fit to Stokes strengths (who they drafted after signing Barry, made no sense, did they ignore Barry or...does Barry not know what he runs...or...something messed up there). 

King is 84th/99 CBs on PFF. Not much to say about that but it's not starting quality. Sounds about right to my eye. 

Yeah, the King re-signing really signaled to me: "We've been to back to back NFCCG with the guy. Don't really feel like calling others so just get him back here. What are they gonna do? Fire me when Rodgers leads us to another NFCCG? Lulz." I have other nitpicks but Gutes in the middle of the pack. Paying Rodgers, which was the right decision, requires more craftiness on the margins. King was one of them they could've gone with out and risked it. Apparently not much risk whatsoever actually. 

180 Also

I'd like to reiterate a wish for a new thread for each day of football because there's already so many posts here

181 Packers

Look like they are trying to make FO column “Any Given Sunday” for second straight week.  Poetic license granted to use a game on a Monday.

182 Lions won’t need much

To get last place in DVOA position on defense, the defending champs of pitiful defense.

183 Cowards

Kneeling out the half. 

190 That's probably the more…

That's probably the more appropriate take.

It seemed like once he hit that long one to Adams his timing and accuracy were much better. How much of that is just shaking the rust off after not playing in the preseason, and how much is the Lions' defense being tired/bad, we will see. I'm wary of father time sneaking up on him.

187 Goff has already learned…

Goff has already learned that a Lions 4th quarter is judged by how many TD’s/onside kick recoveries are needed to win.

191 Well as someone who watched…

Well as someone who watched every single Goff game as a Rams fan, this game was pretty weird. He starts out making me think “wow, maybe McVay moved on from this guy too fast,” to eventually sinking back into the exact same guy I’ve known for years. 

To be fair, his pocket presence/movement is improved. Having said that, this is basically the same old Goff I’ve seen again and again. Very happy with the Stafford Experiment by the end of this game.